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Forums - Politics Discussion - "Donald Trump I voted for you BUT.."

Peh said:
RolStoppable said:
What other requirements to vote than being 18+ would you suggest to be implemented? Being male?

Yeah, being a male would be the first solution to all our problems /s

I don't know. One possibility would be to let every voter take a exam on the goals off each party you want to vote and see if you actually do understand what you are voting for. Because I have the feeling that some people did not informed themself before voting. Hence why they regret it. But that would be kind of ridiculous and impossible to implement.  

I really don't know. It just gets on my nerves when I see people regretting shortly after voting and this tells me, that these people shouldn't had the right to vote in the first place, because they are actually ignorant by the damage they can cause.

I've actually thought about the idea of putting the top 5 or so most important policies of the competiting candidates on the ballots instead of their names. That way, you vote for the five positions you want to see taken and each one of those counts as a vote towards a certain candidate. So if you vote favoring Trump on 3 policies and Clinton on 2 policies, Trump would get 3 "votes" and Clinton would get 2. I'm sure there are flaws with this, but I think it is at least interesting to think about.

Anyways, I agree with you in theory. The only way to get democracy to work is by having an informed populace. However, once you start saying "you cant vote", you run a serious risk of excluding people. Especially minority voters with low education. Thats why we need to focus on improving our education systems to increase the education of the populace instead of going for the exclusion route. 

I also think changing to a ranked voting system would do a bit to mitigate the "I regret voting for Gary Johnson because Trump won" regrets and just be a great change in general.



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weaveworld said:
Mnementh said:

Well comrade, with my model Brexit and Trump wouldn't have happened.

Those would have happened years sooner...

Depends on who decides which is the sensible vote. And believe me, if I wa sit, than these two wouldn't have happened. Comrade!



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Mnementh said:
Peh said:

Yeah, being a male would be the first solution to all our problems /s

(1) I don't know. One possibility would be to let every voter take a exam on the goals off each party you want to vote and see if you actually do understand what you are voting for. Because I have the feeling that some people did not informed themself before voting. Hence why they regret it. But that would be kind of ridiculous and impossible to implement.

(2) I really don't know. It just gets on my nerves when I see people regretting shortly after voting and this tells me, that these people shouldn't had the right to vote in the first place, because they are actually ignorant by the damage they can cause.

(1) Brilliant! That leaves no room for misuse.

Do communists eat small children? <--- You said no to this? Obviously you're not fit for taking an election.

But more seriously, let's look a bit back and ask voters of Obama:

* Does Obama bombs people from drones in foreign countries? Does he end imprisonment in Guantanamo?

 

(2) Well, actually your vote does have a lot less impact than you expect. Will the world be better with Brexit or Bremain? I actually don't know, too many variables. And can change Trump the US overnight? Obviously not, he has to face House and Senate. You have just to look how well his immigration ban is working, to understand that the president isn't all powerful.

(1) Hence where I said " But that would be kind of ridiculous and impossible to implement." And "I don't know".

(2) Then why do they regret their vote so fast? Please answer me this.



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Peh said:

You clearly missed my point.

Let me get this straight:

Are you ok with people saying that they regret their vote after making their vote? What does it tell you about those people? And it doesn't matter for what they've voted for.

Yes, I'm OK with that. Because I don't wanna judge the decisions of other adult persons.

You missed my point: these people were always there and will always be. The worrying part is, that this time in this two elections they are pointed out and it is made a fuss about it. That means, that a lot of people aren't willing anymore to accept the result of an election, if it doesn#t suit them. This is the really worrysome part. And it isn't the only sign, there are much more signs that the willigness to accept the results of an election is eroding.



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Peh said:

(1) Hence where I said " But that would be kind of ridiculous and impossible to implement." And "I don't know".

(2) Then why do they regret their vote so fast? Please answer me this.

 (2) Well, there are many reasons: They didn't think it through. They thought their choice wouldn't win anyways and they could show their anger against the establishment. They voted for joking reasons. They voted for the assumed underdog. They voted because their focus was on some policies the candidate was standing for, but after the election the candidate focuses on other areas first (for instance in the Trump-case, many may have voted him for bringing jobs to america, but aren't against immigration - now immigration is the area tackled first). They voted for a candidate, because they took him seriously, not literally.

Whatever the reasons, my point stands: you will always have these people. It is completely unimportant that some people changed their opinion. But it doesn't matter, because they are a minority.



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Mnementh said:
Peh said:

You clearly missed my point.

Let me get this straight:

Are you ok with people saying that they regret their vote after making their vote? What does it tell you about those people? And it doesn't matter for what they've voted for.

(1)Yes, I'm OK with that. Because I don't wanna judge the decisions of other adult persons.

(2)You missed my point: these people were always there and will always be. The worrying part is, that this time in this two elections they are pointed out and it is made a fuss about it. That means, that a lot of people aren't willing anymore to accept the result of an election, if it doesn#t suit them. This is the really worrysome part. And it isn't the only sign, there are much more signs that the willigness to accept the results of an election is eroding.

(1) Example:

The teaching of evolution shall be replaced with creationism in schools. Your position is on evolution, because that one is a scientific theory supported by evidence. Evolution is a fact. Creationism is not a scientific theory, it's not even science. People vote for creationism, because it's what they believe in and think that evolution is just a theory. After making their vote, creationism does indeed win. And evolution is being banned in schools. Some people who didn't know much about the subject or didn't care much about the subject at all voted for creationsism and regret their vote after the outcome is clear and realise what the topic is about. So, they wish they could have voted for evolution instead. Even worse, the people who were misinformed or didn't care are now in the majority for the evolution vote.

And you tell me you would be OK with that, because you don't wanna judge the decision of other adult persons. This is an extreme example so I can make my position clear on this topic. It's not to insult anyones believes. But I didn't wanted to make it to difficult to undestand. Do you understand where I am going with this?

(2) Accepting the results and regretting the vote immediately after voting for the results has nothing to do with each other and nothing what this thread has to do with that. A democraty have always an opposition and accepting the result, doesn't mean you also have to comply with everything that follows.



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The problem is that there were no viable candidates. Yes, Trump is horrible, but Hillary Clinton isn't a good alternative either. Neither were Gary Johnson nor Jill Stein.



VGPolyglot said:
The problem is that there were no viable candidates. Yes, Trump is horrible, but Hillary Clinton isn't a good alternative either. Neither were Gary Johnson nor Jill Stein.

That's a complete different issue. I know, that there is no perfect candidate, you just don't vote for Trump and say you regret it shortly after you did. That's a stupid thing to do.



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Peh said:
VGPolyglot said:
The problem is that there were no viable candidates. Yes, Trump is horrible, but Hillary Clinton isn't a good alternative either. Neither were Gary Johnson nor Jill Stein.

That's a complete different issue. I know, that there is no perfect candidate, you just don't vote for Trump and say you regret it shortly after you did. That's a stupid thing to do.

I'm not saying that there's no perfect candidate, I'm saying that there's no good candidate. Yes, there are people that regret voting for Trump, but they may have also regretted not voting at all too if they didn't.



Mnementh said:
Peh said:

(1) Hence where I said " But that would be kind of ridiculous and impossible to implement." And "I don't know".

(2) Then why do they regret their vote so fast? Please answer me this.

 (2) Well, there are many reasons: They didn't think it through. They thought their choice wouldn't win anyways and they could show their anger against the establishment. They voted for joking reasons. They voted for the assumed underdog. They voted because their focus was on some policies the candidate was standing for, but after the election the candidate focuses on other areas first (for instance in the Trump-case, many may have voted him for bringing jobs to america, but aren't against immigration - now immigration is the area tackled first). They voted for a candidate, because they took him seriously, not literally.

Whatever the reasons, my point stands: you will always have these people. It is completely unimportant that some people changed their opinion. But it doesn't matter, because they are a minority.

And you are OK with them? The Brexit vote is just the best example here. Because the minority you speak of is the one who actually could change the outcome if they didn't joke around and took it seriously. And something like that just angers me how stupid certain people are. They are voting for their own future. If it being better or worse will be shown. But that's besides the point. I just don't want people voting, without having any kind of clue what they are actually doing with their vote. It's like playing russian roullette (Hyperbole).



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