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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Digital Foundry takes a closer look at Breath of the Wild

curl-6 said:
Hynad said:

I think Zelda achieves quite a bit, but Farcry 3-4 are quite good looking games and are quite demanding, so if anything, you nailed the games required to base a comparison on. 

Yeah, besides the obvious differences in art style, Far Fry 2-4 on PS3/360 are quite similar to BotW in that they feature open worlds with lots of vegetation, scattered enemy encampments and wildlife, etc. They seem like the most logical point of comparison in my view.

Far Cry 3 and 4 on PS360 are impressive technical accomplishments for the hardware they're running on, but overall, I'd give BotW the edge as it seems to have a bigger world with denser and more interactive vegetation, as well as a slightly higher screen resolution. (720p versus cropped sub-HD in Far Cry)

I don't know. Both have a lot of pop-ins, and Farcry has quite a lot of NPCs and from what we've seen so far of BOTW, it doesn't seenm like it is as densely populated as Farcry 3 or 4. Vegetation, except for the grass, is also quite simple compared to what's found in the FarCry series. I don't see what's interactive about the vegetation in BOTW except that you can cut trees and grass... And that feature doesn't look like it's anything for which you should wet your pants. Cool feature, but nothing impressive or demanding there. As for it being a bigger world, that's a non-argument. It's not like the world is fully loaded with features and detail at all time. It's streaming just like any other open world game, with distant objects having next to no level of details, no less.



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Hynad said:
curl-6 said:

Yeah, besides the obvious differences in art style, Far Fry 2-4 on PS3/360 are quite similar to BotW in that they feature open worlds with lots of vegetation, scattered enemy encampments and wildlife, etc. They seem like the most logical point of comparison in my view.

Far Cry 3 and 4 on PS360 are impressive technical accomplishments for the hardware they're running on, but overall, I'd give BotW the edge as it seems to have a bigger world with denser and more interactive vegetation, as well as a slightly higher screen resolution. (720p versus cropped sub-HD in Far Cry)

I don't know. Both have a lot of pop-ins, and Farcry has quite a lot of NPCs and from what we've seen so far of BOTW, it doesn't seenm like it is as densely populated as Farcry 3 or 4. Vegetation, except for the grass, is also quite simple compared to what's found in the FarCry series. 

There may well be towns will plenty of NPCs in BotW, we just don't know that this point cos we were shown just the one area.

Far Cry 2-4 have better looking trees than Zelda, but the grass, in addition to being less dense, still seems to be clumped into fixed 2D tufts, as opposed to the interactive individual blades in Breath of the Wild. (I'd really like to know what trick Zelda's using for its grass, incidentally)

Far Cry 3/4 on PS360 also have heavy screen tearing and run in sub-HD.



Hynad said:
curl-6 said:

Yeah, besides the obvious differences in art style, Far Fry 2-4 on PS3/360 are quite similar to BotW in that they feature open worlds with lots of vegetation, scattered enemy encampments and wildlife, etc. They seem like the most logical point of comparison in my view.

Far Cry 3 and 4 on PS360 are impressive technical accomplishments for the hardware they're running on, but overall, I'd give BotW the edge as it seems to have a bigger world with denser and more interactive vegetation, as well as a slightly higher screen resolution. (720p versus cropped sub-HD in Far Cry)

I don't know. Both have a lot of pop-ins, and Farcry has quite a lot of NPCs and from what we've seen so far of BOTW, it doesn't seenm like it is as densely populated as Farcry 3 or 4. Vegetation, except for the grass, is also quite simple compared to what's found in the FarCry series. I don't see what's interactive about the vegetation in BOTW except that you can cut trees and grass... And that feature doesn't look like it's anything for which you should wet your pants. Cool feature, but nothing impressive or demanding there. As for it being a bigger world, that's a non-argument. It's not like the world is fully loaded with features and detail at all time. It's streaming just like any other open world game, with distant objects having next to no level of details, no less.

First Zelda BotW is 8 away from completion, and we actualy saw just one small (1-2%) of game, and it's confirmed that NPC are moved from Demo in order not to spoil story, also there will be towns and villages.

Second you have physics in game that effect whole world, you have wind blowing and you see trees, bushes and grass moving on wind, you can cut grace, what we saw basically you can cut every tree for instance maybe you can cut whole forest, you cant cut tree that fails in river and see how river carries that tree, you can set on fire grass and watching how fire spreading depending on direction of wind blowing, basicly you can interact with almost any object in world and for instance move object like rocs, boards or plates, also you can climb on evry object, building or mounting in game and that basicly means that almost evre thing in world of Zelda BotW could be interact with in some way. Also even view distance doesn't show too many details, view distance is great, you can basically see half of this huge world if you are high enough for such a view.



This does seem to be more demanding than any other game on the wii u. I wonder if all those physics (like the way the wind affects everything) are even necessary. Far Cry 3 dropped a lot of the physics from Far Cry 2 and very few people cared or noticed.



h2ohno said:
This does seem to be more demanding than any other game on the wii u. I wonder if all those physics (like the way the wind affects everything) are even necessary. Far Cry 3 dropped a lot of the physics from Far Cry 2 and very few people cared or noticed.

Really depends of how they are used in game, we saw in this E3 Demo that they are used great and gives lotsa a different possibilities to player in this vast world.



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h2ohno said:
This does seem to be more demanding than any other game on the wii u. I wonder if all those physics (like the way the wind affects everything) are even necessary. Far Cry 3 dropped a lot of the physics from Far Cry 2 and very few people cared or noticed.

From a gameplay perspective, yes it matters.  Wind effects fire propogation and gliding.  So being able to easily see how it is moving through dry grass for example is influencial. 

However, I would say such environmental details in sound and animation are absolutely crucial to the games aesthetic tone.  What they have shown and described is a desolate, melancholy setting atmosphere.  They want you to feel like you are wondering the ruins of a once great kingdom now overgrown.  As such, there's not as dense an NPC or animal population as in, say, Skyrim.  There are NPCs, animals, and towns (all those have been confirmed), but there's a major focus on the land and environment themselves.  What the small details like the abundance of ambient sounds and wind effects on grass and trees accomplishes is a sense of energy and life in the world without NPCs.  Most games like Skyrim use creatures and characters and other NPCs to create a lively world.  Take away those aspects and the environment is really quite static and lifeless.  Breath of the Wild, not so.  They are going for a world that feels alive and breathing even though empty.  For that purpose, those minor details of environmental interaction and motion are very important. 



Nuvendil said:
h2ohno said:
This does seem to be more demanding than any other game on the wii u. I wonder if all those physics (like the way the wind affects everything) are even necessary. Far Cry 3 dropped a lot of the physics from Far Cry 2 and very few people cared or noticed.

From a gameplay perspective, yes it matters.  Wind effects fire propogation and gliding.  So being able to easily see how it is moving through dry grass for example is influencial. 

However, I would say such environmental details in sound and animation are absolutely crucial to the games aesthetic tone.  What they have shown and described is a desolate, melancholy setting atmosphere.  They want you to feel like you are wondering the ruins of a once great kingdom now overgrown.  As such, there's not as dense an NPC or animal population as in, say, Skyrim.  There are NPCs, animals, and towns (all those have been confirmed), but there's a major focus on the land and environment themselves.  What the small details like the abundance of ambient sounds and wind effects on grass and trees accomplishes is a sense of energy and life in the world without NPCs.  Most games like Skyrim use creatures and characters and other NPCs to create a lively world.  Take away those aspects and the environment is really quite static and lifeless.  Breath of the Wild, not so.  They are going for a world that feels alive and breathing even though empty.  For that purpose, those minor details of environmental interaction and motion are very important. 

Great post.



Nuvendil said:
h2ohno said:
This does seem to be more demanding than any other game on the wii u. I wonder if all those physics (like the way the wind affects everything) are even necessary. Far Cry 3 dropped a lot of the physics from Far Cry 2 and very few people cared or noticed.

From a gameplay perspective, yes it matters.  Wind effects fire propogation and gliding.  So being able to easily see how it is moving through dry grass for example is influencial. 

However, I would say such environmental details in sound and animation are absolutely crucial to the games aesthetic tone.  What they have shown and described is a desolate, melancholy setting atmosphere.  They want you to feel like you are wondering the ruins of a once great kingdom now overgrown.  As such, there's not as dense an NPC or animal population as in, say, Skyrim.  There are NPCs, animals, and towns (all those have been confirmed), but there's a major focus on the land and environment themselves.  What the small details like the abundance of ambient sounds and wind effects on grass and trees accomplishes is a sense of energy and life in the world without NPCs.  Most games like Skyrim use creatures and characters and other NPCs to create a lively world.  Take away those aspects and the environment is really quite static and lifeless.  Breath of the Wild, not so.  They are going for a world that feels alive and breathing even though empty.  For that purpose, those minor details of environmental interaction and motion are very important. 

Good job. Now you hyped me even more... You are cruel ;-;



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curl-6 said:
GOWTLOZ said:

I agree with that, but the distance detailing shouldn't be much hard considering that the resolution allows loss of detail fairly nearby. GOW 3 didn't have vast open worlds but the worlds it did have were all very highly detailed, just look at the titans, millions of polygons moving as one entity, that is very impressive and something you do not see in open world games. Also as they were all at a fairly close or very close range they were highly detailed.

Killzone 3 is maybe even more hardware intensive according to you because the game did allow some exploration and freedom of movement and was incredibly detailed. Both GOW 3 and Killzone 3 have a lot more enemies too and Killzone 3 has very advanced AI. That is a very CPU intensive game.

Killzone 3 is indeed an incredibly technically demanding game for its hardware, with very impressive texturing, shading, geometry, and post-processing. It's one of the best looking games of the 7th gen, in my opinion.

Still though, it's a bit of an apples-to-oranges comparison to pit a linear action game against a massive open world one. As a more contained experience, Killzone 3 has the luxury of being able to focus its rendering budget into a smaller area.

A more like-for-like point of comparison for Breath of the Wild would be similar open world titles on PS3/360, like Skyrim or Far Cry 2/3/4.

I agree that Killzone 3 looks really amazing, its graphics are probably the best I've played on PS3 after GOW 3 and Ascension, but it also has a bit more open levels, much more advanced AI, which probably is required more in shooting games, and physics but it doesn't run at the 40-50fps that both GOW games run at.

On topic Skyrim is a terrible comparison to make, the game looks much worse than any other big release of that year on PS3 and 360. Far Cry 3 looks good but probably doesn't take advantage of either console's capability like an exclusive game like BOTW does and even then games like Batman Arkham City and GTA V look better while also open world. And I do think both look better than BOTW, but its hard to compare these games.



GOWTLOZ said:
curl-6 said:

Killzone 3 is indeed an incredibly technically demanding game for its hardware, with very impressive texturing, shading, geometry, and post-processing. It's one of the best looking games of the 7th gen, in my opinion.

Still though, it's a bit of an apples-to-oranges comparison to pit a linear action game against a massive open world one. As a more contained experience, Killzone 3 has the luxury of being able to focus its rendering budget into a smaller area.

A more like-for-like point of comparison for Breath of the Wild would be similar open world titles on PS3/360, like Skyrim or Far Cry 2/3/4.

I agree that Killzone 3 looks really amazing, its graphics are probably the best I've played on PS3 after GOW 3 and Ascension, but it also has a bit more open levels, much more advanced AI, which probably is required more in shooting games, and physics but it doesn't run at the 40-50fps that both GOW games run at.

On topic Skyrim is a terrible comparison to make, the game looks much worse than any other big release of that year on PS3 and 360. Far Cry 3 looks good but probably doesn't take advantage of either console's capability like an exclusive game like BOTW does and even then games like Batman Arkham City and GTA V look better while also open world. And I do think both look better than BOTW, but its hard to compare these games.

Breath of the Wild is not an exclusive, it's multiplat between Wii U and NX.

Regarding GTA V and Arkham City, those games look very good on PS3/360, but a cityscape of rectangular buildings is generally easier to render than rolling organic landscapes packed with dynamic vegetation.

Wii U has 1GB of RAM available for games, but PS3 and 360 have less than 500MB. As such, Breath of Wild likely wouldn't fit into the working memory of PS3 or 360, it would have to be cut down until it fit, which would require downgrades.