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Forums - Politics Discussion - What are your thoughts on the refugees crisis in Europe?

melbye said:
Europe can't support it, and considering how ungrateful some of them are we shouldn't


But we will anyway I just vote to put them all in Germany, Sweden, France and UK since they want to go their anyway. 



Please excuse my (probally) poor grammar

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First, I feel that this is a tragedy for everyone involved. To my knowledge, this is a universally bad situation.

Now, starting at a basic level, I have no problem with people leaving wartorn and ravaged countries and moving somewhere more peaceful. My ancestors did that when coming to the USA back in the 1800's, and they were perfectly justified. And Syria's five-way civil war is at least as terrible as what they had to deal with. Countries surrounding Syria have already absorbed a lot of the 4 million refugees. Lebanon and Jordan in particlar have accepted a huge number of refugees compared to their population. But even then, there simply are not that many places to run away to, so going to Europe is completely understandable.

From what I can understand, there may be over a million people who would want to resettle in Europe rather than sticking in Syria or the already overcrowded camps in the region. That is a lot, but I think Europe is big enough to absorb that. The European Union alone has half a billion people, a relatively wealthy economy, and good infrastructure. In the decade following 1900, the USA absorbed ten million immigrants, who not only didn't speak English but were largely from Eastern and Southern Europe instead of the earlier Western and Northern Europeans, and thus were fairly isolated. There were many problems involved, but the USA continued to thrive despite that.

My main worry for Europe would be that European countries have sometimes had trouble integrating immigrants. Immigrants don't necessarily need to shed their old identity, but need to be willing participants in their new country of residence. This involves knowing how to speak, read, and write the local language, following native laws that aren't life-threatening, associating with natives, and so on. In many cases, European countries have either not bothered or allowed migrants to create small colonies in a foreign country. That simply doesn't end well for either the refugees or the natives.



Love and tolerate.

dyremose said:
Bofferbrauer said:
Lawlight said:
Mr.Playstation said:


Is this for real?


Yeps. And the pictures that I have seen are even worse - good food and amenities thrashed all around.

What this video DOESN'T show is very important, however. They are held back there for days without any reasons - so naturally, these immigrants and refugees get very pissed. They have to wait for a bus which should bring them to a camp, but the bus is only enough for something like 20% of those waiting for it. In other words, they stay there for days while the camp is less than a day's walk away, but they aren't allowed to walk there even after they got registered. They have to take the bus, which only drives twice a day, while the refugees come per full trains several times a day. Wouldn't you get pissed if you'd be held back without any reason?

You obviously have not seen how they move.  They ar  on the freeway.  Someone could get hurt or lost. We are trying to help them..  Social Security checks can wait a day or two longer don't you think?  They are being taken care of at the place,  fed and housed. 

No, in this case, they are not, and that's the problem. Hungary is holding them back since they don't want these immigrants or refugees by intentionally slowing down every part of the process to a crawl. And because they fear they could stay there in their country (hungary has a pretty far right government), every one stays under tight control until they are at the next border (generelly the austrian border). And there are more comimg to their border than they are processing through their tight system, causing the refugees to have to wait for days before anything happens. Yes, social security could and should wait a day or two, but not with the hungarian border patrol, as this is the very first thing they do (and even that at a crawl)



Sharu said:


3 and 4 is utter bullshit from the brain washed by western propaganda... )

Btw Gerard Depardie and boxer Roy Jones are getting russian citizenship, together with mr Jeff Monson...

We taking only the best ;)

Of course, of course, whatever helps you sleep at night



I see it like the US waged their wars and didnt care about the aftermath. Quite honestly, these refugees should be going to the US. I don't see why Europe has to pay for what isnt our fault.

With that said, muslim immigrants are noticeable for beeing disrespectful of the customs in the country they immigrated to. I do think an iron-fist on these issues is essential. This must pose no threat to european citizens.



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Burek said:
Lawlight said:
Burek said:
Lawlight said:


Sorry, you're wrong. Croatia has a very minuscule Muslim population - 1.47%. If it was any bigger they'd be claiming for Sharia law. And wasn't it this year that Muslims caused trouble because of a theatre performance in your country?

Those poor people need to be screened to make sure they're not criminals.

Sorry, but you are wrong to call me wrong from your couch surfing wikipedia wherever you are since you hid your profile.

The very fact is that many Muslims are well integrated into society and are perhaps not even religious to declare as such, and that many of them declare themselves as Croats. My city has about 8-10% of Muslims, and they are exactly the same as any other person. To even imply that they would even consider Sharia law if they reached a certain percentage is naive, stupid and insulting to them and to our entire society.

As for the theatrical performance, it was not the Muslims complaining at all. It was a show in my city, and Croats including myself protested that the County was supposed to give €100.000 (it's a public theater event) to put on the play written by a declared racist and chauvinist (Houllebecq). We did not want to financially support such people, just as we wouldn't support any hatred towards any other color, culture, creed or religion. The play itself had nothing to do with religion at all, it was just the playwright that was unacceptable.

Theater found funding elsewhere, the plays were shown, nothing happened because nothing was ever going to happen anyway. (Oh, and the play sucked after all).

And of course those people need to be screened to see if they are criminals, but that's nothing different than is done today where at the border crossings customs officials screen Swiss, Norwegian Japanese, American or Peruvian tourists to see whether they are criminals.

 

Based on the first post, you should have deduced that I'm in Australia. A country where the Australia Federation of Muslim Council has been asking for the Sharia Law so you're just showing your ignorance, naïveté and bias.

As for the for theatre performance, it was cancelled because some savages cannot handle freedom of expression in the form of art. Do people riot when Jesus is caricaturised in Croatia? I call BS on people complaining about the playwright. The motives aren't dissimilar from what happened at Charlie Hebdo - harm to those who "insult" Islam.


You haven't read what I wrote about the play. It was not cancelled, it was held as scheduled. The only difference is that it was not funded by lical government.

The play had nothing to do with Islam, it was about love, sex and relationships. The only reason it was not funded was the playwright who is a declared racist. Nobody rioted, there were no protests, it was a civilized discussion in which our Governor refused funding. 

 

Also, please understand that I wrote my first post to say that we as a country have nothing against Muslims because we have a portion of them as our countrymen, and they are completely integrated in all aspects of society, from holding high ranking governmental offices, being heads of institutions as well as our neighbors, friends and family. 

I wanted to show that it is posiible for Muslims to live according to the laws of the land they are in, and that refugees would be welcome to join them. Two of our national football team players are Syrians, their family integrated into our society, why refuse the others to do the same.

Therefore my initial post was not trying to comment on Australia and the problems you might have there. Ir is irrelevant to Croatia and my stance on refugees coming over here.


This link says it was cancelled over security risks:

http://www.expatica.com/fr/news/country-news/Houellebecq-play-pulled-in-Croatia-over-security-risk_473009.html

By security risks, they mean violence by Muslims. Obviously they haven't integrated that well.



Lawlight said:

This link says it was cancelled over security risks:

http://www.expatica.com/fr/news/country-news/Houellebecq-play-pulled-in-Croatia-over-security-risk_473009.html

By security risks, they mean violence by Muslims. Obviously they haven't integrated that well.

You have bad info. 

Sorry, you will have to google translate from Croatian:

http://www.journal.hr/elementarne-cestice-66-dubrovacke-ljetne-igre/



I would have to learn more about to give a thought out opinion it. As long as they legally migrant to other countries and adapt to the lifestyle there, then it's fine, On the other hand, if the people in a country don't want the refugees there then they shouldn't be allowed in.



Nem said:

I see it like the US waged their wars and didnt care about the aftermath. Quite honestly, these refugees should be going to the US. I don't see why Europe has to pay for what isnt our fault.

With that said, muslim immigrants are noticeable for beeing disrespectful of the customs in the country they immigrated to. I do think an iron-fist on these issues is essential. This must pose no threat to european citizens.


True but why is almost all of europe in Nato for example? We should stop supporting US foreign policy then we have a right to not take these immigrants.



Ruler said:
Nem said:

I see it like the US waged their wars and didnt care about the aftermath. Quite honestly, these refugees should be going to the US. I don't see why Europe has to pay for what isnt our fault.

With that said, muslim immigrants are noticeable for beeing disrespectful of the customs in the country they immigrated to. I do think an iron-fist on these issues is essential. This must pose no threat to european citizens.


True but why is almost all of europe in Nato for example? We should stop supporting US foreign policy then we have a right to not take these immigrants.


In the same sense, the US should stop paying for Europe's defenses and the majority of the UN's budget.