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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Mozilla CEO blasts Microsoft over Windows 10 defaults

DonFerrari on 31 July 2015

Microsoft Edge - the best browser to download Firefox/chrome



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pbroy on 31 July 2015
AbbathTheGrim said:

 Do you believe Mozilla CEO's complaints justified or not?

What's your opinion on this OP? Or are you just quietly sitting in the corner eating your popcorn?







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WoodenPints on 31 July 2015

So people are moaning about how it takes 15 seconds of their time to get back on firefox browser?



Teeqoz on 31 July 2015
Ka-pi96 said:
Teeqoz said:
Ka-pi96 said:

Not really abuse though. There's nothing forcing people to use Microsoft's browsers or software. It's really simple to just go and get one of the other ones. They shouldn't have to hold your hand through making the choice, if people are too stupid to figure out how to download non-MS software instead well then that's just their own fault.

It might the peoples fault that their too stupid/lazy to download non-MS software, but do you know who's problem it is? Google's and Firefox's problem.

Well if it's google/firefox's problem then maybe they should be the ones making it easier to download their browsers or making their own OS to compete with MS. It isn't up to MS to do google/firefox's job for them.


*sigh*

You do understand what the concept of abusing your monopoly means? Google/Firefox doesn't have control over how easy Microsoft makes it to keep your preferred browser. If Microsoft intentionally makes it more difficult to download/keep Chrome/Firefox, that is abusing their monopoly in OS. Both Firefox and Google have made their own OS's, but they haven't been able to attain much market share. Does that give Microsoft a free pass to do whatever they want with Windows, because Google and Firefox has their own OS?

If Microsoft made it only possible to have Edge on W10, meaning that you'd have to switch OS to Firefox OS or Chrome OS to use a different browser, would you be okay with that? That is the extreme of this case.

And once again, I don't know if MS doesn't give you the option to keep your preferred browser when you upgrade, but this is all if they don't.



Puppyroach on 31 July 2015
Teeqoz said:
Puppyroach said:
 

Why? It's their OS, they should include the services they see fit as defaults. That other companies haven't been able to create a viable option (like what exist on smart devices) shouldn't be blamed on MS.


Windows is the OS nearly everyone uses, and that's not a problem. The problem arises when they use that market position to give a disadvantage to other competitors on other fields (like web browsers). Imagine if Microsoft made a Steam like service, and would've told publishers "If you release your game on steam, you can't develop it for Windows". Most of the big pubs would screw Steam pretty fast, and the smaller pubs would follow.

Now, I don't know if it actually does ask you, but if it doesn't, it is abusing your monopoly.

But in what way does that relate to this situation? I just install the browser I want, MS is not forcing me to choose one under some penalty.



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Teeqoz on 31 July 2015
Puppyroach said:
Teeqoz said:
Puppyroach said:
 

Why? It's their OS, they should include the services they see fit as defaults. That other companies haven't been able to create a viable option (like what exist on smart devices) shouldn't be blamed on MS.


Windows is the OS nearly everyone uses, and that's not a problem. The problem arises when they use that market position to give a disadvantage to other competitors on other fields (like web browsers). Imagine if Microsoft made a Steam like service, and would've told publishers "If you release your game on steam, you can't develop it for Windows". Most of the big pubs would screw Steam pretty fast, and the smaller pubs would follow.

Now, I don't know if it actually does ask you, but if it doesn't, it is abusing your monopoly.

But in what way does that relate to this situation? I just install the browser I want, MS is not forcing me to choose one under some penalty.


It is abusing your monopoly. I'm saying if it doesn't give you the option to keep your preferred browser, that's quite crappy.



Teeqoz on 31 July 2015
Ka-pi96 said:
Teeqoz said:
Ka-pi96 said:

Well if it's google/firefox's problem then maybe they should be the ones making it easier to download their browsers or making their own OS to compete with MS. It isn't up to MS to do google/firefox's job for them.


*sigh*

You do understand what the concept of abusing your monopoly means? Google/Firefox doesn't have control over how easy Microsoft makes it to keep your preferred browser. If Microsoft intentionally makes it more difficult to download/keep Chrome/Firefox, that is abusing their monopoly in OS. Both Firefox and Google have made their own OS's, but they haven't been able to attain much market share. Does that give Microsoft a free pass to do whatever they want with Windows, because Google and Firefox has their own OS?

If Microsoft made it only possible to have Edge on W10, meaning that you'd have to switch OS to Firefox OS or Chrome OS to use a different browser, would you be okay with that? That is the extreme of this case.

And once again, I don't know if MS doesn't give you the option to keep your preferred browser when you upgrade, but this is all if they don't.

If it prevented you from using any other browser than Microsoft's own then fair enough, I'd agree with you, but it doesn't. If Microsoft make such a successful OS then they have every right to use that to advertise their other services, they aren't hiding or preventing use of alternatives just putting their own front and centre. If I were to walk in to a Ford showroom or something then instead of Volskwagens they would have Fords there wouldn't they? They aren't going to be advertising their competitors products, that is the job of their competitor.


This isn't about advertising Firefox/Chrome. It is merely about giving you the option to keep your preferred/default browser when upgrading your OS. Just a little box you tick off where it says "I'd like to keep my default browser" and another box "I'd like Microsoft Edge to be my default browser". Once again, I don't know if it gives you that option, but if they don't, that is abusing their monopoly. It might not be so bad that it's illegal (though MS has gotten into legal troubles for something like this before), but it's still bad.



ohmylanta1003 on 31 July 2015

It is certainly NOT abusing their monopoly. If they didn't allow the use of other browsers on their OS, then it would be. Otherwise, you're wrong.



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MikeG85 on 31 July 2015

Wow!!the same people jumping on microsoft's back about nothing as usual ...this is a push even for you guys??

When I upgraded, Firefox was in my taskbar and when I double clicked it.it asked me if I wanted it to be my default browser.

End.of.story.



AFloatingDuck on 31 July 2015

You could just change the default browser, something which anyone with an ounce of computer understanding should be able to do. It's not a big deal.