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Forums - Gaming Discussion - About Twenty Companies Including Sega Made a Bid on Atlus, 20 Billion Yen Offered

ishiki on 02 August 2013
AlphaCielago said:
bananaking21 said:
TheLastStarFighter said:
I would pay $200 million for them probably. If I was Nintendo or Sony that is. Especially Nintendo, they have the cash and need the development capacity.


and you would never ever make the money back. no doubt atlus is a quality company, but their games barely sell. thats why it would be really stupid for Sony or nintendo to buy them and it would be the stupidest thing ever for MS to buy them. they simply wont be able to make enough of a return on their games, and limiting them to one platform certainly wont help


Their games selling 1 million or more have nothing to do with anything. If the company has remained profitable then that is because they know how to handle their given or own money. Then there is also the possibility of their higher tier franchises being bigger sellers and can therefore increase the install base.

That's not how it works, there's opportunity cost, net present value, and IRR and other things to consider consider. Let's say there's 20 billion yen  to invest. You only have so much money to invest. So lets say for simplicity there's 2 possible investments

Atlus
lets say investing in atlus will take 8 years to for the investment to become postitive after net present value of costs of the investment equals the net present values of the benefits. But maybe over 20 years you have a higher IRR than you would with option B, but 20 years is a really long time to consider.

Option B, investing in games, space shuttle whatever
Makes you money in 3, and then you can reinvest, and determines plans from there.  This is more of an instant gratification investment

It's not near as simple as this company makes money, lets buy them. And the actual discussions have even more variables to consider.
There's also no guarentee at atlus that the talented people will stay (like what happened to  rare) and then all you have is niche IP's without the creators that people bought them for that don't sell them a million copies.



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RenCutypoison on 02 August 2013
bananaking21 said:
RenCutypoison said:
bananaking21 said:

im not saying they dont. but is it really worth it? how much time will they take to bring that money back? and in the case of the post i replied too how much would they take to make 200$ million back? they are a talaneted and profitable dev, but are they worth being first party devs?


If they did buy them, the must have a reason.

The one who did buy it should have plans to make them more profitable.

I hope that won't kill their games, tough.


if they want them to make them more profitable then they want them to start making different games. the question is, why buy a developer if you dont want their games at all? 

Quality games sell better. That can be proven quite easily.

If they can improve their games for it will sell better.

Of course, all devs can't make ultra big budget games that are good. But Atlus isn't just hardcore RPGs. Theyb don't only make Shin Megami Tensei.

I just hope they are not bought by a western company, or censorship will kill their games.



MrUnagi on 02 August 2013
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:

I would be cool with Sony having it but i want to see the everyone on this site have a meltdown. This is only for the online entertainment that comes with fanboys melting down.

It won't be as bad as the XIII meltdown...


Are you refering to Final Fantasy XIII?  


Yes.

Do you think there would be a meltdown of sony fanboys if Persona 5 was money hatted and put exclusively on WiiU?

I don't know but I sure will!

I'm guessing you only buy Sony.



Proud gamer of Nintendo and Sony consoles since 2003.

gooch_destroyer on 02 August 2013
MrUnagi said:
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:

Do you think there would be a meltdown of sony fanboys if Persona 5 was money hatted and put exclusively on WiiU?

I don't know but I sure will!

I'm guessing you only buy Sony.


...Yep.



AlphaCielago on 02 August 2013
ishiki said:
AlphaCielago said:

Their games selling 1 million or more have nothing to do with anything. If the company has remained profitable then that is because they know how to handle their given or own money. Then there is also the possibility of their higher tier franchises being bigger sellers and can therefore increase the install base.

That's not how it works, there's opportunity cost, net present value, and IRR and other things to consider consider. Let's say there's 20 billion yen  to invest. You only have so much money to invest. So lets say for simplicity there's 2 possible investments

Atlus
lets say investing in atlus will take 8 years to for the investment to become postitive after net present value of costs of the investment equals the net present values of the benefits. But maybe over 20 years you have a higher IRR than you would with option B, but 20 years is a really long time to consider.

Option B, investing in games, space shuttle whatever
Makes you money in 3, and then you can reinvest, and determines plans from there.  This is more of an instant gratification investment

It's not near as simple as this company makes money, lets buy them. And the actual discussions have even more variables to consider.
There's also no guarentee at atlus that the talented people will stay (like what happened to  rare) and then all you have is niche IP's without the creators that people bought them for that don't sell them a million copies.


Fair enough. Although, I'm in the opinion that no third party or first party should buy Atlus. It's not like Index was 100% games either, then again Sony isn't either. 



Check out my Upcoming Wii U Games 2014 Thread

3DS Friend Code: 4553 - 9954 - 4854. Name - David

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ListerOfSmeg on 02 August 2013

Anything but Sony



ishiki on 02 August 2013
AlphaCielago said:
ishiki said:
AlphaCielago said:

Their games selling 1 million or more have nothing to do with anything. If the company has remained profitable then that is because they know how to handle their given or own money. Then there is also the possibility of their higher tier franchises being bigger sellers and can therefore increase the install base.

That's not how it works, there's opportunity cost, net present value, and IRR and other things to consider consider. Let's say there's 20 billion yen  to invest. You only have so much money to invest. So lets say for simplicity there's 2 possible investments

Atlus
lets say investing in atlus will take 8 years to for the investment to become postitive after net present value of costs of the investment equals the net present values of the benefits. But maybe over 20 years you have a higher IRR than you would with option B, but 20 years is a really long time to consider.

Option B, investing in games, space shuttle whatever
Makes you money in 3, and then you can reinvest, and determines plans from there.  This is more of an instant gratification investment

It's not near as simple as this company makes money, lets buy them. And the actual discussions have even more variables to consider.
There's also no guarentee at atlus that the talented people will stay (like what happened to  rare) and then all you have is niche IP's without the creators that people bought them for that don't sell them a million copies.


Fair enough. Although, I'm in the opinion that no third party or first party should buy Atlus. It's not like Index was 100% games either, then again Sony isn't either. 

Yes, I don't want a first or third party to buy atlus. Also I didn't say this, my numbers obviously weren't necessarily accurate just the concept. I don't have all of atlus studio details, so it could be a slam dunk investment once you consider all the factors.



MrUnagi on 02 August 2013
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:

Do you think there would be a meltdown of sony fanboys if Persona 5 was money hatted and put exclusively on WiiU?

I don't know but I sure will!

I'm guessing you only buy Sony.


...Yep.

Have you ever had a non Sony console?



Proud gamer of Nintendo and Sony consoles since 2003.

gooch_destroyer on 02 August 2013
MrUnagi said:
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:

Do you think there would be a meltdown of sony fanboys if Persona 5 was money hatted and put exclusively on WiiU?

I don't know but I sure will!

I'm guessing you only buy Sony.


...Yep.

Have you ever had a non Sony console?

I still have my green N64, I wanted a gamecube, and I may get a 3DS.



MrUnagi on 02 August 2013
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:
gooch_destroyer said:
MrUnagi said:

Do you think there would be a meltdown of sony fanboys if Persona 5 was money hatted and put exclusively on WiiU?

I don't know but I sure will!

I'm guessing you only buy Sony.


...Yep.

Have you ever had a non Sony console?

I still have my green N64, I wanted a gamecube, and I may get a 3DS.

3DS is showing an awesome amount of games in the library and if you like japanese third parties you will find many good games. I got mine on launch (March 27,2011). It was worth it two and a half years later.



Proud gamer of Nintendo and Sony consoles since 2003.