It's true Gaika doesn't work like that, or not in that way when it was set up. Gaika doesn't render high end graphics to stay economically viable. Using distributed computing, ie multiple servers to ray trace the video for 1 client is a nice demo, but rather expensive to do for millions of CoD players.

Anyway this is not what MS is promoting. This runs the entire game in the cloud and you end up with no signal on connection hickups. Way more powerful rendering method then Gaika, yet the same problems with latency and compressed visuals. And ofcourse the more servers in your render pipeline, the higher the latency can become.

CBF reading through all that. I'll be back on later!

MS has not specifically stated that they can send processes from the rendering pipeline, they have been ambigous about it and giving that impression, to confuse people, becuase they cant offload anything relevant from the rendering pipeline to the cloud. Data transfer speed from the ps4 CPU to the RAM is 170GBytes per second, a 50 MBits per second internet connection moves 6 Mbytes per second, that is miserable, and upload speed is usuallay half the download speed. Cloud computing works for stuff that does not require real time processing.At 30 frames per second, the frame has to be ready in 0.0333 seconds, thats 33 miliseconds for the entire rendering pipeline, is all BS.

If you really believe they are rendering the entire in 33 milisecond and in the middle of that they are sending anything to the cloud for which you have to wait 20 to 100 miliseconds to come back (just latency and bandwidth limitations, asuming the server take 0 milisecond to get the result), you are completly blinded by you fanboyism.

They can stream assets but you will see popin depending on your connection speed.

In any case, anything that the Xbone can really do with distributes computing my Iphone can too, is not a magical technology it distributed computing, is what the ps3 use to do with folding at home, is all PR bs.

No it's not how many times we have to say we know it can't offload the entire game with proper result for the gamer.... but if it can offload even 10% of tasks that don't need per frame reactivity it is 10% more processing power on the box you can use for those per frame visuals....

Simple example take fable original concept where villages where suppose to evolve realistically.... or family trees be evolving too etc... all that stuff has very little impact on what you see and could be happening elsewhere....

Yeah you can have same results on your iPhone this is the entire point of cloud tech on the long run.... suppressing complex hardware with simple terminal monitors with input solutions.... basically one day any TV with keyboard will be enough to use anything regardless of the resource needed....

The difference here is that when it comes to cloud infrastructures on the servers side MS has by far the upper hand on almost anyone... maybe Google could be and is a fair contender and still they don't have things like azure or Orlean.... but apple doesn't and certainly not Sony.... once again when it comes to cloud tech comparing Sony to MS is comparing a dwarf with a behemoth.... they have nothing close in terms of infrastructures already in place and won't be able financially to match it..... compared to MS.... so no it's not a PR stunt... now will rev exploit it is an other debate....

but regardless cloud computing is the future for thousands of reasons.... internet connections are getting better every day all around the world... it is to today's world railroad was a few centuries ago or highways more recently... then it will also be an essential point for hardware... needing only a terminal to do things will allow smaller lighter cheaper device more eco friendly with very long battery life... and when you see where technology was not even 30 years ago and where it is today and how increasingly fast it's going... it won't take long for the cloud to be more and more relevant for the mainstream

I completely agree with you, I was only pointing out that that Wolfenstein raytrace example is not economically viable and not what MS is after for games, since they still have to continue to work without it.

For now we only have 2 real world examples. Titanfall that also handles NPC behaviour in the cloud during multiplayer, pretty much like an MMO. That makes it easier to keep the games in sync but doesn't free up any significant resources. I don't believe for a second that launch games are maximizing all available cores and memory already, and if it can be off-loaded to cloud, it can be more easily off-loaded to a separate thread.
And there is Forza Drivatards, which actually adds a little extra strain to the console. It always has to upload your replay data for the server to analyze and then download custom AI routines before the race, to be run on the console.

Although MS is not after it right now lag free 30fps gameplay might be do-able gaika style some day. I have ping times of around 18ms to the nearest server. If that server can render and compress in 10ms (200fps rendering is possible, 5ms for render and 5ms for game updates and compression), and I have 1gbps internet that can download 5mbps worth of data (reasonable 720p image stream) in 5ms (200 times faster then 5mbps internet, since that would take 1000ms to download that image data), then I could get a comparable experience. Pipedream for now.

You don't actually need to hit 33ms to get the same experience as we have now though. http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-lag-factor-article?page=3 The best we're used to atm is 67ms. So you could get away with 100mbps internet or a bit better visuals. Although you still need to factor in the time it takes to poll the controller and prepare that data to send to the server, plus decoding and preparing the image for output to the display afterwards.

Ofcourse by the time this is possible on a large scale, local hardware can most likely do a better job again with 4K coming up next gen.

AH, i missundertood you then, apologies

I'm not a specialist, but why are we focusing only on what is going on on screen or pure real time graphics.... they could offload many things beside graphics.... stuff going on surface enables devices, and game mechanics that are not graphical or latency related..... static effects... or pre calculate stuff that will be required later... we've been talking only about on screen visuals at 1080p 30fps but there is much more than that going on in a game isn't there ????

No problem. I realize I made some gross calculation errors in my example.
You don't need 1gbps internet to get 5ms latency per frame in a 5mbps 30fps stream. a 5mbps 30fps takes 33ms per frame, so you only need 7x faster, 35mbps internet to get the download speed fast enough for my example. And for 67ms latency, 5mbps internet is fine if all the other stuff can be done in 33ms. 

Somehow though the full streaming solution feels the same as the argument that mobile is catching up to consoles. At least was catching up until consoles take a big leap forward again. It's the same with streaming. It is almost capable enough to do last gens 720p 30fps games that have an average latency of 100 to 150ms on consoles. However the bar has now been raised to 1080p and hopefully 60fps.
Providing it for backwards compatibility is not a bad idea for those 720p30 150ms latency games, yet local hardware remains king for now. And probably will for a long time as local hardware can be a lot less powerful then a server with equal experience, due to all that extra time available for processing and rendering.

And back on topic for enhancing games with cloud computing. MS is recommending 1.5 mbps internet, 192 kb/s or 6.4kb/3.2kb per frame in 30/60 fps games. I'm curious to see what can be done with 3.2kb of data to enhance a render pipeline...

I wonder what some people have been waiting to go into consumer groups to attack there ISPs.... I haven't had a connection under 3mbps since the late 90's.... 1997 to be exact (granted my city was a beta test ground for broadband internet) but still.... I lived in small towns in USA and never got anything under that.... today even in a very small town in France (I just moved from a 2k inhabitants town) anything under 5mbps real speed is absolutely scandalous.... yeah some countries are not there yet and I feel sorry for them.... but I feel like a lot of people in developed countries here and relatively decently sized cities are being raped by ISPs more than any MS policies could pound in your rear hole with a CAT truck.....

Game streaming like Gaika is the more efficient way. It takes much less information to only stream video and audio. More importantly you only have to upload controller input instead of all the information you want to get calculated, and upload speed is much lower than download speed with most connections.

I can explain that for you, it's called buffering. The video is simply being loaded while you are watching it, and that's possible because the movie isn't going to change during playback. They can't buffer the actions of a player now can they.