The hypocritical trend I've found in this forum is that when people talk about gameplay, it's all fair game. There's no question about it being YOUR  opinion, or about it just being subjective. People will consider game slike NSMB as the holy grail of gameplay and everyone's okay with that.

But what happens when we talk about presentation, graphical style, graphics, music, cadence, plot, characters. Suddenly it all becomes subjective. Suddently when saying that one game lacks in that department, you become some kind of a high-class snob.

So when someone reasonably states that NSMB as a series has absolutely no value when it comes to excellence in presentation, suddenly he is speaking out of opinion, is a basher, a troll and a snob.

I'd like anyone who is also sick of this mentality to voice their opinions on it. Yes, Rol and Moreno, if you think this is a response to your behavior in my gunman clive thread, you are correct, I'm actually pretty irate right now.

You want a hug? That would make you feel better :3

He at least he just called you a snob and didn't insult your intelligence. You might be overreacting a little but I am not one to talk considering I dropped Rol and Spurge as friends when I became upset with them.

Anyways, everyone has different tastes.

"People will consider game slike NSMB as the holy grail of gameplay and everyone's okay with that."

Actually, I'm not. Jumping as a primary gamplay mechanism is always presented as superior to everything else, though I have no idea why. It might be the holy grail relative to games where you jump on stuff, I don't know or care, but it's just one of many types of gameplay. It's not inherently superior to games where you shoot stuff or race stuff or anything else.

As for the rest, I'm not sure what you're saying, exactly. If you saying that the aesthetics of NSMB are lacking for you, that is certainly your opinion and you're entitled to it. I know I find the series to be bland and uninspired. However, beyond that, are you saying your opinion is an absolute? Or just that people are saying you can criticize NSMB just because it's NSMB?

I knew from the moment you mentioned NSMB this was about how you felt about the series and how people tell you that you are wrong.
When you say that NSMB is not a "worthy series" or something not "worth the price", that's an opinion. Sometimes, though, you try to push it as a fact. I'm not sure I'm remembering correctly, but I think in one of your threads about NSMB you were basically telling everyone that they were wrong to say that NSMB is a great series, or it is worth 40$+. I don't know how you feel about people saying that it is a great series now, but you sure thought it was absolutely ridiculous to think that NSMB is "good."

Certain Gameplay may not work for you, that's perfectly fine. Like you said, it's an opinion. We all have our own opinions.

@bold. That is where I have issue. It's pretty clear to many people that the series is bland and uninspired at this point, and is a heavy cash-cow for Nintendo. We will point out specific reasons in the colors, choice of visuals and many many things (which I've done in threads past - this replies to your false point about me not backing it up with facts and details, Rol) that show that the company is lacking in the visual art aspect in making that series, for example. Yet, on the other hand, people will say a game like gunman clive has so-so gameplay and nobody will tell them "that's just your subjective opinion" and will actually consider that possibly the gameplay in gunman clive is not pinnacle of gameplay.

Why when it's mentioned about gameplay is it something people can think about, but when it's mentioned about visual art and style suddendly the person becomes a snob?

That's my issue.

@Wright. I'd love that.

Don't know what you're talking about. All of these things are VERY subjective. Taste in music varies GREATLY from person to person. Taste in graphical style? Ask a few Zelda fans whether they prefer the Wind Waker or Twilight Princess style.

Hey bro. It's okay that you don't like Mario. Really it is. There are a lot of games I don't like. There are some games I used to like that I don't anymore, and I don't go on a vendetta against the developers just because they're not making those games exclusively to fit my tastes. It's okay to play other games.

I mentioned it was reminiscent of Megaman and you said that from the trailer you didn't get that impression, unless I didn't read you properly. It's something I'm okay with reading because I also pay attention to gameplay and I could agree with something like that.

When I showed Super Mario All-Stars, the colors were bright, but there was more pastel (which I mentioned too in that thread), and the choice of colors was less playskool. It may sound silly to some debating colors, tones, moods, but to some who value art (visual and musical) these little nuances affect our enjoyment of the games. I brought out many arguments regarding the colors (not just Super Mario All-Stars but we also talked about box art and older color tones in SMB) and in other threads I mentioned that Super Mario Brothers 3 actually had a real mood to it, from level 1 to level 8 there was a true progression of mood and in level 5 there even was a dual-level (part green part snow) and this inspired the sense of being in another world. I gave solid arguments but you don't value them because (iiuc) to you this is a silly topic.

That's not my point. Two games may vary in style it doesn't make one necessarily more inspired than the other. What can bejudged though is, above and beyond variability in the sphere of quality, what constitutes design choices that are not rooted in quality?

And that's what I was pointing out in a series like NSMB.

You'll notice that pokoko mentioned that jumping isn't a fun gameplay mechanic to him, that's his tastes. But you can't say that NSMB doesn't have solid gameplay. True it gets repetitive after a certain number of games but intrinsically the gameplay is tight. I can't say the same about the presentation aspect of the game. So there's taste, and then there's objective measures of quality. Objectively speaking the presentation aspect of NSMB is lacking grossly. I've mentioned why in many other threads so I won't go there now, but at least you can understand the difference between tastes and just objective measure of quality.

I like the presentation of Mario. Therefore, your argument is fallacious.