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Forums - General - To the Atheist members of vgchartz

I suppose for me, I believed in god because my family around did. It helped that, as a Hindu, Hinduism is quite accepting of new spiritual ideas; there are many different sects and belief systems surrounding spirituality in Hinduism, although the main mythology remains constant. As I went through school, education and science, my belief starting slipping to the point where anything religious was just done for the sake of tradition. I distinct remember on Religious Studies class in school where some of my classmates were asking questions about religion/god that I wouldn't have dared ask back then. That's probably when I realised that these questions were in fact valid and that the answers were becoming more and more like excuses.

It's only in recent years that I've been more open about it all. I've also found that most of my family aren't anywhere near as religious as I thought, although some of them to seem to follow some strange superstitions that I just can't get my head round. I manage to keep it fairly diplomatic around them.

Having said that, as far as my mum's concerned, I was born Hindu and will always be one no matter what I believe. Illogical, but whatever.



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I have been an atheist since god made me, that's how he wanted me to be



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WereKitten said:


Ok, let's say that we are not born with a philosophy as in "a set of specific beliefs about phenomena", because at birth we dont see or care about the sun or the thunderstorms, but we might still be born with an ingrained philosophical scaffolding/method as in "in doubt, it's less dangerous to give intentional meaning to the observed world phenomena". At birth, we're already scared by the sudden loud noise of the thunder, because it's safer to assume that sudden loud noises are associated with dangers, and the most dangerous phenomena are conscious predators. Basically all children go through a magical thinking and animistic phase, and the same is true for many adults.

What I'm trying to say is that while logically it's true that the default position is that of non existence of unproven entia, and that we should apply Occam's razor, antropologically and biologically our default method of knowledge might not be logical at all, but intuitively - and of course deceptively - skewed toward animism. Which is, itself, a philosophical belief. Semantics aside, I'm sure you understand what I meant :)


I think I get what you are saying. Correct me if I'm misinterpreting you, but you're saying that because we all go through imaginary and magical thinking at some point in our lives, that makes the magical/imaginary thinking the default position. While it may be true that everyone goes through imaginary/magical thinking, I don't think that makes it default, because it is not until years after birth that such thinking arives. Your assertion would still agree with mine that people aren't born with any philisophical beliefs (such as a belief in God), but we attain them later in life.

And besides, when it comes to belief in a God, that's simply not the case anymore. It may have been true in the past that people naturally associated God with inexplicable phenomena. But today, most things can be explained and I don't think it's default for people to bring God into the equation. For the most part today, people's belief in God is the result of cultural upringing, not innate inclinations. 



RolStoppable said:
badgenome said:
dsgrue3 said:
It's easy to avoid confrontation/arguments with religious folks - simply tell them you aren't religious. It shouldn't impact your family or friends if you're atheist though.

I think so, too. I have a suspicion that a lot of atheists who claim that the Christians in their lives are all out to get them are actually the ones who are instigating most of the confrontations, probably by lecturing and attacking the beliefs of others like so many internet atheists love to do.

I mean, I live in the Bible belt and I have literally never had a single confrontation over my lack of belief. Granted, it's not something I talk about a lot because what is there to say on the matter? "I don't believe in this thing that I've never seen" is pretty much where it begins and ends for me. In the absence of any evidence to the contrary, there isn't much more to say let alone to get in a fight about.

In all of my time on VGC, I have never seen an atheist attacking religious people. True story.

My brothers girlfriend is an internet athiest.  She pokes & provokes every chance she gets, it's pretty annoying, even though I'm an athiest myself.



dsgrue3 said:
DanneSandin said:
dsgrue3 said:
DanneSandin said:
dsgrue3 said:

Not exactly.

Before you have pondered something, you have no opinion - apathy. It is at that moment that you consider the question that you form a belief.

Well, that is true - so we're all born apathetic in regards of god, if I understand you correctly?

Yes. Absolutely.

I can't really argue against you since I don't disagree or find any fault in your reasoning. But I'm curious none the less; since atheism is not believing in gods, wouldn't that make a new born baby an atheist, since that baby is not believing in god? What I'm trying to get at is, that those persons could perhaps be called... apathetic atheists?

You're trying to put the reason before the thought. If the thought has never been contemplated you cannot know anything about it. You cannot say you have no belief, maybe you do - you don't know until it has been considered. The partial wave function has yet to collapse upon a definitive outcome - belief.

Aaah, yes, I see. Sorry, just thought you'd make a good sparring partner so I had to try out another angle =)



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TheLastStarFighter said:

When did I ever claim to know the views of other people?  Quite the opposite, I've been saying that we don't know what is in others minds and thougthts.  I also haven't gotten into my own views on theism.  I've simply talked about being open to other trains of thought, that there is such a thing as a passionate atheist, and that many people who call themselves atheist are by enlish definition terms better described as an agnostic.  People are free to describe themselves however they want but they can't change what dictionaries say.  That said, I'm not sure why I even posted in this thread in the first place, as I have little interest in the topic, lol.


You have said it's closeminded to say atheism is the default position. But that's false because people lack a belief in God when they are born.

And if you disagree with that definition of atheism, then forget the term "atheism" altogether because it's too much trouble to go back and forth. Do you agree that people are born with a lack of belief in God?



TO ALL YOU LOGICAL PEOPLE OUT THERE TELL ME WHY NOT BELIEVE IN GOD ?

If he exists and you dont believe in him you go to hell but if you believe you go to heaven..there is nothing you can lose..so why not ? and if he doesnt exist then he doesnt exist you wont ruin your life or anything like that..thats simple logic and everyone should agree IMO.



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kljesta64 said:

If he exists and you dont believe in him you go to hell but if you believe you go to heaven..there is nothing you can lose..so why not ? and if he doesnt exist then he doesnt exist you wont ruin your life or anything like that..thats simple logic and everyone should agree IMO.

What God(s) are you talking about? There are literally thousands I could believe in. How could you possibly know you choose the right God(s) to believe in? What if I believe in the Christian God but it turns out Islam is the correct religion? I'd be just as fucked as the atheist.

You also can't jsut flip a switch in your head and suddenly believe in something. Even if I really wanted to, I'd need the sufficient evidence to truly believe.



kljesta64 said:
TO ALL YOU LOGICAL PEOPLE OUT THERE TELL ME WHY NOT BELIEVE IN GOD ?

If he exists and you dont believe in him you go to hell but if you believe you go to heaven..there is nothing you can lose..so why not ? and if he doesnt exist then he doesnt exist you wont ruin your life or anything like that..thats simple logic and everyone should agree IMO.

My friend had this very view.  He died in Afganistan after joining the "holy war" at the urging of his parents.

EDIT: One time I was a passanger in his Jeep driving on an outback gravel road.  The road was a steep, maybe 30 degree incline and we were driving down it at around 60kmh.  One side was a cliff that dropped off 100's of feet into jagged rocks & a lake.  He locked the brakes & put the Jeep into a slide going towards the edge to try prove a point, he said he did it to show me how believing in god is "insurance", and my fear was because I was uninsured.  Needless to say I always looked at him sideways after that.



kljesta64 said:
TO ALL YOU LOGICAL PEOPLE OUT THERE TELL ME WHY NOT BELIEVE IN GOD ?

If he exists and you dont believe in him you go to hell but if you believe you go to heaven..there is nothing you can lose..so why not ? and if he doesnt exist then he doesnt exist you wont ruin your life or anything like that..thats simple logic and everyone should agree IMO.

If god is anything like what is depicted in the bible and/or the qur'an or most religion, I rather take my chances as an atheist since I find the Abrahamic god to be very, very cruel and the most evil thing there ever was.



I'm on Twitter @DanneSandin!

Furthermore, I think VGChartz should add a "Like"-button.