By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Tagged games:

AndrewWK on 17 December 2012
CGI-Quality said:
d21lewis said:
AndrewWK said:


The facial modeling of Uncharted where allright but nothing like Enslaved. I have never played Heavy Rain so I don´t know anything about that. The facial modeling of Enslaved was splendid that is one of the things that makes this game standout.


CGI loves Heavy Rain.  I do too.  It's a great game.  While I appreciate what Heavy Rain did, there were many times where the facial animations crossed into uncanny valley territory and characters just looked unnatural and kinda freaky looking. 

Instead of saying which games look better than Enslaved (which I admit I have a bit of a bias towards since I decided before it even came out that I would love it), I will go the other route and say that Enslaved isn't the best in the business but it definitely sits among the best.  It was made by the same guys that made Heavenly Sword and I think their work was just as good in this game as it was in that--especially since Heavenly Sword used pre-rendered CGI for its praised animation and Enslaved used the game engine.

Heavenly Sword also used the engine, just thought I'd point that out. In fact, it's quite obvious when you're playing the game that's running on the engine and not CGI. The polys are blatant, as is aliasing.

And frankly, it's not about liking Heavy Rain (nor Heavenly Sword ) more than this (ironic, given I prefer Enslaved to HS). It just is what it is, and what it is - Enslaved facial animation was good enough for what it was going for, but doesn't quite match the top titles in the field.

Havenly Sword and Enslaved did not use the same engine. Enslaved is based on UNreal 3



Around the Network
AndrewWK on 17 December 2012
gronk-bonk said:
Enslaved is a fantastic game. Love trip, monkey and pigsy. I honestly believe enslaved is better than uncharted


This is like comparing tomatoes to shoes.



d21lewis on 17 December 2012
CGI-Quality said:
d21lewis said:

Dude, you say this every time.  Even when a game like Uncharted uses pre-recorded footage to pull of something that couldn't be done in game.  They use a cut scenes with bumped up capabilities although it's pretty comparable to the in game engine.  Anyway, we're on the internet.  I'll let it do the fighting for me:  "The way the plot's told is nothing short of breathtaking. Using a mix of in-game cutscenes and CGI movies, Heavenly Sword is full of emotion and character. All the game’s motion capture scenes were directed by Hollywood favourite Andy Serkis.  http://www.projectcoe.com/sony/games/heavenly_sword.html

Every site says that Heavenly Sword used CGI at the time and, playing the game, it's obvious when the CGI comes into effect and when the game engine takes over.  If it's pre-rendered, then it's just a video playing on the console and that video is likely using effects that the game can't pull off any other way.  Metal Gear?  99% in game.  Alan Wake?  Often CGI.  Nothing to argue. 

Also, the quote from earlier that you said you were happy I could find does disprove something you said.  You said that Enslaved's facial animations were not one of its strong points.  The reviews of the day say that it was.  Anyway, I'm sleepy.  It's 2am and I've been up since 4am (with a two hour nap somewher around 7pm).  Later, bro.

Yeah dude, I sure do say it a lot, because I find, too often, people confuse a completely separate technique, CGI rendering, with in-engine cutscenes (never denied the extra added effects - would know them first hand since I work in that field).

There's a difference between Final Fnatsy XIII's cutscenes in 1080p and Heavenly Sword's cinematics. One was CGI and the other was in-engine (though FFXIII used some of those as well). Everything in HS was rendered on the engine - the same technique used by many devs, with extra added effects not running in-game (never claimed it was in-game, either). If you own HS, go look through the extra content on the disc. It's explained in great detail there. Just a hint - Heavenly Sword's cutscenes weren't praised because they were pre-rendered CGI.

Btw, you found just one source that praised Ensalved's facial animation. I could find one that disagrees. I'm saying there wasn't a general consensus that put Enslaved at the top of its class.

I could find more.  IGN was just the first one that popped up.  I'll watch the bonus features right now.  Is there one in particular I should watch?

Anyway, let's agree to disagree?



d21lewis on 17 December 2012
CGI-Quality said:
d21lewis said:
CGI-Quality said:

Yeah dude, I sure do say it a lot, because I find, too often, people confuse a completely separate technique, CGI rendering, with in-engine cutscenes (never denied the extra added effects - would know them first hand since I work in that field).

There's a difference between Final Fnatsy XIII's cutscenes in 1080p and Heavenly Sword's cinematics. One was CGI and the other was in-engine (though FFXIII used some of those as well). Everything in HS was rendered on the engine - the same technique used by many devs, with extra added effects not running in-game (never claimed it was in-game, either). If you own HS, go look through the extra content on the disc. It's explained in great detail there. Just a hint - Heavenly Sword's cutscenes weren't praised because they were pre-rendered CGI.

Btw, you found just one source that praised Ensalved's facial animation. I could find one that disagrees. I'm saying there wasn't a general consensus that put Enslaved at the top of its class.

I could find more.  IGN was just the first one that popped up.  I'll watch the bonus features right now.  Is there one in particular I should watch?

Anyway, let's agree to disagree?

I advise you to read the edited version of my last post. We can agree to disagree, but it's fact that HS's cutscenes are not CGI and very much rendered on the game engine. But, I am willing to drop it though, especially since there's nothing left to prove. As for Enslaved, yep, I'm willing to drop that too.

As a final note, take up the advice on watching the Bonus Footage from Heavenly Swords's disc. Ninja Theory discsusses their technique(s) used to create the "in-engine" cutscenes.

Thought I could just let it go.  Turns out, I can't.  Go figure.


I still haven't looked at the footage on the disc, yet.  I just.....wow.  I looked at your links.  None of them said that HR's cutscenes were or were not CGI.  I showed you a link (and if you want, I could easily find more) saying that HR's cutscenes WERE CGI--as well as a few before release saying that everything was in game like Killzone 2 but that was when we didn't know what the PS3 would actually be capable of.  You reached the conclusion you wanted to reach based on speculation.  You say "They wouldn't praise lip sync and voice acting if it was CGI".  I say, why wouldn't they?  It was the best CGI acting at the time.  Still pre rendered CGI, though.  Like I said, it's OBVIOUS when the CGI kicks in and when the real game and even the pre-rendered stuff is running.  It's a fact that Heavenly Sword uses CGI (see how easy it is!) ;)

You have proven nothing but an ability to jump to conclusions.

"Graphically, there is little to fault with Heavenly Sword that is probably the most visually impressive game on the market at the moment and match that with amazingly pre-rendered CGI cutscenes and you have one impressively looking title"  http://www.impulsegamer.com/ps3heavenlysword.html


"From a technical standpoint, we’ve already talked about how gorgeous the game is. Heavenly Sword is one of the few games I’ve played where the characters are so expressive that you could honestly believe that you’re watching a movie, even if it’s clearly CGI-driven."  http://www.gameplaytoday.com/sony/ps3-reviews/738-heavenly-sword-ps3-review

"A lot of the game is made up of CGI rendered cut scenes. These look stunning with all the performances of the actors coming through clearly. While the faces are perfect, one great thing that normally has issues is that of the lip-sync. Thankfully it’s perfect in this case."  http://games.kitguru.net/playstation-3/ps3-reviews/admin/heavenly-sword-2/

"Now although this looks great in the CGI cut scenes and during the titles the actual gameplay suffers a lot." http://www.peoww.co.uk/heavenly-sword-ps3/

In Game

Pre-rendered

CGI



d21lewis on 17 December 2012

See. That just happened.



Around the Network
Pjams on 17 December 2012
CGI-Quality said:
Pjams said:
CGI-Quality said:
The facial animation only second to L.A. NOIRE? It wasn't even ahead of Heavenly Sword. Games like Uncharted and Heavy Rain easily run laps around it as well. That was not one of its strongest points.

That said, it had better exploration than Uncharted, likeable characters, and a lengthy campaign, making it one of the more enjoyable experiences this gen.

You may know everything, but you may want to go back and play Enslaved again, because the facial and eyeball animation is just as good as anything thats out there, actually may be the best eyeballs to date. And La noire looked good but it also looked bizarre.

It really isn't, but I will only go in circles arguing it. I've played through and beaten the game twice. Great story, exploration , and game-play (though there is a bit too much hand holding), but the facial animation wasn't the best out there and the lip sync (particularly on PS3) was, often times, behind the actual words. 

In short, I don't have to "know everything" to understand that Enslaved's mo-cap isn't as good as the best out there.


Like I said, go back and look at it again because your simply wrong on this one. Not sure why you're holding to this so tightly, or is this one of those street cred moments where the whole foundation of your imaginary internet persona is at stake



 

Kresnik on 17 December 2012

I really was really surprised how much I loved Heavenly Sword, so I've been meaning to pick this up at some point. This thread has given me pretty mixed feelings about it now (aside from the OP!), but I still think I'll give it a try.



Read my Vita reviews here

Famitsu Japan Digital Sales Archive
Vita Media Create physical sales database
Vita vs. COMG Japan Sales Comparison

AndrewWK on 17 December 2012
CGI-Quality said:
AndrewWK said:

Havenly Sword and Enslaved did not use the same engine. Enslaved is based on UNreal 3

I didn't say they did use the same engine >.<


You said Havenly Sword uses that engine too. It uses the same technology but not the same Engine- You kinda confused me



gronk-bonk on 17 December 2012
AndrewWK said:
gronk-bonk said:
Enslaved is a fantastic game. Love trip, monkey and pigsy. I honestly believe enslaved is better than uncharted


This is like comparing tomatoes to shoes.


lol 

You have to agree they are similar in some respects. The platforming, scripted events and the linear nature. To me, it's an uncharted game without the games.



Bet with ninjablade:

Ninjablade wins if the next 5 multiplat on the wii u are inferior to the 360 version.

I win if one of the 5 mulitplats are on par or superior on the Wii U.

Mad55 on 17 December 2012

This is one of my favorite games of the gen. Everyone should play it.