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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - The Nintendrone: Can Microsoft and Sony Compete With The Wii U?

Mmmfishtacos said:

You didn't fix anything, and don't do that again. People are too quick to throw Sony out when they not only won the last two gens but dominated like no other console could. I've given many reasons why i think they Wii U won't be as successful as the Wii. You haven't giving one why Sony can't come back. Who's the target market for the Wii U? It's not the same market they went after for the Wii. It's going to be too expensive. There's not much of an upgrade to haul gamers away from their PS3 or xbox360. It's the same games, they are looking worse with an incompetent online. Very little of the PS3/360 user base are going to jump over for ports and give up on their friends list, gamer score, and trophies and superior online systems.  They wii u should have been launched in the place of the wii, it's this gen releasing 6 years too late.  The only thing that's going to make the Wii u take off is a 200-250 dollar launch price and Mario.  It isn't going to be 3rd party ports, while they have Mario they won't have a 200-250 launch price. 

 

If you look at the PS2, PSP, PS3 and PS-Vita you'll see that Sony has (essentially) continued with the same strategy for 4 systems in a row with progressively less success ... Two things have happened at the same time which makes Sony's default strategy for the PS4 a disasterously bad choice; and I haven't seen evidence that Sony is adopting a new strategy.

1) The market has shifted and the values that were important to gamers in the year 2000 are no longer the keys to success in 2012

2) Microsoft and Nintendo have adapted to Sony's strategy

What Sony needs to do to return to being the market leader is to innovate, which isn't Sony's strong point. Sony can engineer a better SNES and create the Playstation, engineer a better Playstation resulting in the PS2, engineer a better Gameboy Advance resulting in the PSP, engineer a better PS2 resulting in the PS3, or engineer a better PSP resulting in the PS-Vita, but have shown very little ability to color outside of the lines and design something new.

 



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phenom08 said:
Mmmfishtacos said:

We have a pretty good idea of what the Wii u can do. And it seems it could us a little more power, got to remember it's powering two screens, and if they want another game pad. That's even more power its going to need. Sony can afford a good leap, high end parts are cheaper than ever. Sony is moving away from the one off chips in favor of off the shelf parts that will be used and sold in millions of other devices. Look at the vita for example, sure it's cutting edge now. 6 months from now it won't be, those very same parts will be sold in tables and cell phone by all the major manufactures. What is this going to do? Drive down the cost of the parts and in turn drive down the cost of the vita. We could see 100 dollars cut off the vitas price by the end of 2013. Sony's assets alone are worth more than Nintendo. So don't be fooled, they have money.  

 

How do we have a good idea of what the WiiU can do? The PS3 launch games look nothing like its current games. Look at the Vita for what, whatever price cut it can get so can the 3DS. The PS4 is being doubted because Sony's past victorys came from 3rd party games not the price tag, or have you forgotten Ninty's consoles were cheaper? If they had money then the Vita would have received a price cut to increase its horrible sales or do you seriously believe Sony is ok with its terrible performance?

Reading comprehensions is your friend. They may not be okay with it, but there sure aren't going to be okay with dropping the price so quickly and losing money on the systems. Nintendo made a knee jeark reaction to get the sale of the 3ds up to current levels and lost a bunch doing so. Theres no reason for sony to do the same. Ps3 was in the same sittuation and look where it's at now. the up side is sony has started to fill their stables with quality exlusives, they were more than willing to take risk to get new games out, and that has put them in a better sistuation for next gen. So what's you point? The game cube was dirt cheap and still couldn't manage to reach good sales even with Mairo. Look around the web and you'll see, theres plenty of people giving their impressions and developers and most of the aren't good. Victory from 3rd party? Well guess what Nintendo doesn't have? And really, there hasn't been a sony systems that we can consider a flop yet. Not one has sold as low as the Gamecube or 64. So your doubt is unfounded. What are you going to say when the PS3 passes the wii?



DanneSandin said:

What really strikes me isn't the article/column by itself - it's all the answers by ya'll here on VGC.

"Oh man, this article is so bias! Such pro-nintendo talk is offensive!" - I see several people say. But none of you never ever say that a "Nintendo is d00med" article is biased against Nintendo. I'm so sick of that mentality!


More than likely it's people responding to the combination of article content and site name.  Heck if you put up an article about Nintendo being doomed next gen from MiyamotoCanSuckit.com then I'm sure people would have a similar response.



...

HappySqurriel said:
Mmmfishtacos said:

You didn't fix anything, and don't do that again. People are too quick to throw Sony out when they not only won the last two gens but dominated like no other console could. I've given many reasons why i think they Wii U won't be as successful as the Wii. You haven't giving one why Sony can't come back. Who's the target market for the Wii U? It's not the same market they went after for the Wii. It's going to be too expensive. There's not much of an upgrade to haul gamers away from their PS3 or xbox360. It's the same games, they are looking worse with an incompetent online. Very little of the PS3/360 user base are going to jump over for ports and give up on their friends list, gamer score, and trophies and superior online systems.  They wii u should have been launched in the place of the wii, it's this gen releasing 6 years too late.  The only thing that's going to make the Wii u take off is a 200-250 dollar launch price and Mario.  It isn't going to be 3rd party ports, while they have Mario they won't have a 200-250 launch price. 

 

If you look at the PS2, PSP, PS3 and PS-Vita you'll see that Sony has (essentially) continued with the same strategy for 4 systems in a row with progressively less success ... Two things have happened at the same time which makes Sony's default strategy for the PS4 a disasterously bad choice; and I haven't seen evidence that Sony is adopting a new strategy.

1) The market has shifted and the values that were important to gamers in the year 2000 are no longer the keys to success in 2012

2) Microsoft and Nintendo have adapted to Sony's strategy

What Sony needs to do to return to being the market leader is to innovate, which isn't Sony's strong point. Sony can engineer a better SNES and create the Playstation, engineer a better Playstation resulting in the PS2, engineer a better Gameboy Advance resulting in the PSP, engineer a better PS2 resulting in the PS3, or engineer a better PSP resulting in the PS-Vita, but have shown very little ability to color outside of the lines and design something new.

 


I like Sony, but Sony honestly can't beat anyone if they don't have an overwhelming advantage in the third party area. The PS1 had all the third party games that's why it was able to beat the N64 and Saturn. Sony was smart in taking advantage of Nintendo/Sega's slip ups. That continued with the PS2 as they got out to a year+ headstart with a comparably speced machine to the competetion and were able to lock up third party content again. 

That didn't happen for the PS3 or PSP and isn't happening with the Vita and we can see Sony is fairly easy to compete against when they don't have an unfair advantage with 3rd party content. The Playstation brand is still strong, but not dominant. And really I don't think it has anything to do with innovation, no one bought the PS1 because it was "new" (the N64 was actually probably more innovative in hardware and software concepts), it just had all the third party support, much of it exclusive. 



Mmmfishtacos said:
phenom08 said:
Mmmfishtacos said:

We have a pretty good idea of what the Wii u can do. And it seems it could us a little more power, got to remember it's powering two screens, and if they want another game pad. That's even more power its going to need. Sony can afford a good leap, high end parts are cheaper than ever. Sony is moving away from the one off chips in favor of off the shelf parts that will be used and sold in millions of other devices. Look at the vita for example, sure it's cutting edge now. 6 months from now it won't be, those very same parts will be sold in tables and cell phone by all the major manufactures. What is this going to do? Drive down the cost of the parts and in turn drive down the cost of the vita. We could see 100 dollars cut off the vitas price by the end of 2013. Sony's assets alone are worth more than Nintendo. So don't be fooled, they have money.  

 

How do we have a good idea of what the WiiU can do? The PS3 launch games look nothing like its current games. Look at the Vita for what, whatever price cut it can get so can the 3DS. The PS4 is being doubted because Sony's past victorys came from 3rd party games not the price tag, or have you forgotten Ninty's consoles were cheaper? If they had money then the Vita would have received a price cut to increase its horrible sales or do you seriously believe Sony is ok with its terrible performance?

Reading comprehensions is your friend. They may not be okay with it, but there sure aren't going to be okay with dropping the price so quickly and losing money on the systems. Nintendo made a knee jeark reaction to get the sale of the 3ds up to current levels and lost a bunch doing so. Theres no reason for sony to do the same. Ps3 was in the same sittuation and look where it's at now. the up side is sony has started to fill their stables with quality exlusives, they were more than willing to take risk to get new games out, and that has put them in a better sistuation for next gen. So what's you point? The game cube was dirt cheap and still couldn't manage to reach good sales even with Mairo. Look around the web and you'll see, theres plenty of people giving their impressions and developers and most of the aren't good. Victory from 3rd party? Well guess what Nintendo doesn't have? And really, there hasn't been a sony systems that we can consider a flop yet. Not one has sold as low as the Gamecube or 64. So your doubt is unfounded. What are you going to say when the PS3 passes the wii?

I can read fine lol, anyways no what Ninty did was keep the 3DS from selling poorly like the Vita. Ninty lost alot of money but no where near the amount Sony lost thanks to the PS3s utter flop lol. They posted a one year lost and expect to be profitable the very next year, meanwhile Sony posted a loss and will most likely post another this year as well. Look where the PS3 is now lol, still in 3rd place and no hopes of recovering its loss, yeah thats something to brag about. Quality exclusives according to you but sell poorly according to fiscal reports. "Put them in a better position for next gen", yeah just ask the Vita and its wonderful situation.

"The game cube was dirt cheap and still couldn't manage to reach good sales even with Mairo." What exactly is your point here lol, we clearly agree that a cheap price tag means nothing. But ok lets play this game, the gamecube had Mario Sunshine and Mario Kart Double Dash which were both outsold buy Sony exclusives like GT3 and GT4. If the Gamecube had NSMBWii then yea the Gamecube would have sold more obviously since NSMBWii has sold more than GT3 and GT4 has combined lol.

"Look around the web and you'll see, theres plenty of people giving their impressions and developers and most of the aren't good." Sounds like the Wii to me and many acticles i have seen have been good lol, but ok. Only the articles with unknown developers showed disinterest. I wonder why their unknown?

"And really, there hasn't been a sony systems that we can consider a flop yet. Not one has sold as low as the Gamecube or 64." Lol why exactly are they the parameters of success lol. How about this if the console doesn't crack 100 million then it isn't a success, or if it isnt the market leader then it isnt a success. Why should the PS3, PSP, or Vita be considered a success. You can only argue for the PSP, theres nothing pointing to it not making money and its userbase really isnt small. PS3 hell yes its a failure lol, it lost money and is still in dead last. Vita is selling as well as the Gamecube lol.

"What are you going to say when the PS3 passes the wii?" After this nonsense lol, i see no reason in taking you serious so once you reply to this dont worry about a reply. Im not gonna derail this thread any further, i wonder what you are gonna say when the PS4 flops along the lines of the Vita.



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phenom08 said:
Mmmfishtacos said:
phenom08 said:
Mmmfishtacos said:

We have a pretty good idea of what the Wii u can do. And it seems it could us a little more power, got to remember it's powering two screens, and if they want another game pad. That's even more power its going to need. Sony can afford a good leap, high end parts are cheaper than ever. Sony is moving away from the one off chips in favor of off the shelf parts that will be used and sold in millions of other devices. Look at the vita for example, sure it's cutting edge now. 6 months from now it won't be, those very same parts will be sold in tables and cell phone by all the major manufactures. What is this going to do? Drive down the cost of the parts and in turn drive down the cost of the vita. We could see 100 dollars cut off the vitas price by the end of 2013. Sony's assets alone are worth more than Nintendo. So don't be fooled, they have money.  

 

How do we have a good idea of what the WiiU can do? The PS3 launch games look nothing like its current games. Look at the Vita for what, whatever price cut it can get so can the 3DS. The PS4 is being doubted because Sony's past victorys came from 3rd party games not the price tag, or have you forgotten Ninty's consoles were cheaper? If they had money then the Vita would have received a price cut to increase its horrible sales or do you seriously believe Sony is ok with its terrible performance?

Reading comprehensions is your friend. They may not be okay with it, but there sure aren't going to be okay with dropping the price so quickly and losing money on the systems. Nintendo made a knee jeark reaction to get the sale of the 3ds up to current levels and lost a bunch doing so. Theres no reason for sony to do the same. Ps3 was in the same sittuation and look where it's at now. the up side is sony has started to fill their stables with quality exlusives, they were more than willing to take risk to get new games out, and that has put them in a better sistuation for next gen. So what's you point? The game cube was dirt cheap and still couldn't manage to reach good sales even with Mairo. Look around the web and you'll see, theres plenty of people giving their impressions and developers and most of the aren't good. Victory from 3rd party? Well guess what Nintendo doesn't have? And really, there hasn't been a sony systems that we can consider a flop yet. Not one has sold as low as the Gamecube or 64. So your doubt is unfounded. What are you going to say when the PS3 passes the wii?

I can read fine lol, anyways no what Ninty did was keep the 3DS from selling poorly like the Vita. Ninty lost alot of money but no where near the amount Sony lost thanks to the PS3s utter flop lol. They posted a one year lost and expect to be profitable the very next year, meanwhile Sony posted a loss and will most likely post another this year as well. Look where the PS3 is now lol, still in 3rd place and no hopes of recovering its loss, yeah thats something to brag about. Quality exclusives according to you but sell poorly according to fiscal reports. "Put them in a better position for next gen", yeah just ask the Vita and its wonderful situation.

"The game cube was dirt cheap and still couldn't manage to reach good sales even with Mairo." What exactly is your point here lol, we clearly agree that a cheap price tag means nothing. But ok lets play this game, the gamecube had Mario Sunshine and Mario Kart Double Dash which were both outsold buy Sony exclusives like GT3 and GT4. If the Gamecube had NSMBWii then yea the Gamecube would have sold more obviously since NSMBWii has sold more than GT3 and GT4 has combined lol.

"Look around the web and you'll see, theres plenty of people giving their impressions and developers and most of the aren't good." Sounds like the Wii to me and many acticles i have seen have been good lol, but ok. Only the articles with unknown developers showed disinterest. I wonder why their unknown?

"And really, there hasn't been a sony systems that we can consider a flop yet. Not one has sold as low as the Gamecube or 64." Lol why exactly are they the parameters of success lol. How about this if the console doesn't crack 100 million then it isn't a success, or if it isnt the market leader then it isnt a success. Why should the PS3, PSP, or Vita be considered a success. You can only argue for the PSP, theres nothing pointing to it not making money and its userbase really isnt small. PS3 hell yes its a failure lol, it lost money and is still in dead last. Vita is selling as well as the Gamecube lol.

"What are you going to say when the PS3 passes the wii?" After this nonsense lol, i see no reason in taking you serious so once you reply to this dont worry about a reply. Im not gonna derail this thread any further, i wonder what you are gonna say when the PS4 flops along the lines of the Vita.


Okay i'm done with you, Stopped reading when you called the ps3 an "utter flop". Grow up, stop trolling and learn a little. Dont even care what the rest of you post said.



Mmmfishtacos said:


Okay i'm done with you, Stopped reading when you called the ps3 an "utter flop". Grow up, stop trolling and learn a little. Dont even care what the rest of you post said.


Calling the PS3 an "utter flop" is only bad because he did not explain what he meant by that ...

When you consider that the PS3 sold at (roughly) half the rate of the PS2 there is a supportable argument that the PS3 could be seen as a flop/failure relative to the PS2. If you add profit/losses to the mix the PS3 can be seen as a disaster.

In contrast, in the grand scheme of things, the PS3 still sold far more units than most consoles and will likely end up as one of the best selling non-market leading consoles it can also be argued that the PS3 was not a flop/failure.

As with everything, it all depends on definitions.



HappySqurriel said:
Mmmfishtacos said:


Okay i'm done with you, Stopped reading when you called the ps3 an "utter flop". Grow up, stop trolling and learn a little. Dont even care what the rest of you post said.


Calling the PS3 an "utter flop" is only bad because he did not explain what he meant by that ...

When you consider that the PS3 sold at (roughly) half the rate of the PS2 there is a supportable argument that the PS3 could be seen as a flop/failure relative to the PS2. If you add profit/losses to the mix the PS3 can be seen as a disaster.

In contrast, in the grand scheme of things, the PS3 still sold far more units than most consoles and will likely end up as one of the best selling non-market leading consoles it can also be argued that the PS3 was not a flop/failure.

As with everything, it all depends on definitions.


The ps2 still has about 6 years of sales on the ps3, so by no definition can it be called a flop, nearly 50 million ps2 where sold along side of the ps3. He was blatantly trolling, and that's why i disregarded his post. His over all tone is hateful and full of spite.  I will not sit here and have childish hate full arguments with people. I have better things to do.



Mmmfishtacos said:
There's some people here thats going to be shocked after nintendeo settles back in 3rd place one more.

You mean after about a year of market dominace brought on by the WiiU and 3Dses, before the next Microsoft and Sony consoles are realead? Ha ha, you wish!



Nintendo Network ID: DaRevren

I love My Wii U, and the potential it brings to gaming.

Mmmfishtacos said:
HappySqurriel said:
Mmmfishtacos said:


Okay i'm done with you, Stopped reading when you called the ps3 an "utter flop". Grow up, stop trolling and learn a little. Dont even care what the rest of you post said.


Calling the PS3 an "utter flop" is only bad because he did not explain what he meant by that ...

When you consider that the PS3 sold at (roughly) half the rate of the PS2 there is a supportable argument that the PS3 could be seen as a flop/failure relative to the PS2. If you add profit/losses to the mix the PS3 can be seen as a disaster.

In contrast, in the grand scheme of things, the PS3 still sold far more units than most consoles and will likely end up as one of the best selling non-market leading consoles it can also be argued that the PS3 was not a flop/failure.

As with everything, it all depends on definitions.


The ps2 still has about 6 years of sales on the ps3, so by no definition can it be called a flop, nearly 50 million ps2 where sold along side of the ps3. He was blatantly trolling, and that's why i disregarded his post. His over all tone is hateful and full of spite.  I will not sit here and have childish hate full arguments with people. I have better things to do.

You're forgetting that the PS2 sold 127 Million units by the end of 2007, the PS3 has been selling at roughly half the rate of the PS2 as I said ...

With a new generation of consoles being released, the sales of current generation consoles will decline rather rapidly, and beyond 2014 there will be no meaningful sales of Wii, PS3 or XBox 360 systems. The PS3 will never sell to 66% of the total level that the PS2 did; and it may have difficulty selling 60% of the PS2's total.