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Forums - Nintendo - Nintendo: next gen is about “improving gaming experience” “wonderful graphics won’t help”

TheKingofRedLions on 16 July 2012
TruckOSaurus said:
sales2099 said:
All I know is that casuals kept Nintendo alive with the Wii.

WiiU looks like its alienating that exact crowd that brought them back from the brink. That just leaves real gamers.......people who like graphics along with great gameplay.

I dont see this going to end well.

Well Wii U is stronger than the HD twins which means it will have great graphics so I guess they'll do just fine!

Yeah, It's not like the Wii U is going to have terrible graphics



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crissindahouse on 16 July 2012
Kynes said:
sales2099 said:
All I know is that casuals kept Nintendo alive with the Wii.

WiiU looks like its alienating that exact crowd that brought them back from the brink. That just leaves real gamers.......people who like graphics along with great gameplay.

I dont see this going to end well.


Alive? How can you say alive when Nintendo had the best generation in financial terms by a huge mile? I'm sure that they are really glad of the development of this generation.

i believe he meant:

nes: 62 million

snes: 50 million

n64: 33 million

gamecube: 22 million

wii without worldwide success because of the casual gamers: ??

nintendo was losing millions of sales every generation. who knows what would have happened if it would have been the case for wii. just imagine wii at 15 million or so, almost no company would invest money in a new nintendo homeconsole anymore (like ubisoft is doing with wii u now)



oniyide on 16 July 2012
richardhutnik said:
Andrespetmonkey said:
Because improving how a largely VISUAL medium looks won't improve the experience.

I mean I see his point, gameplay and "innovation" (that word is tossed around way too lightly in this industry) comes first, but when a game looks amazing it improves the experience immensely. It's a big part of the experience and it's what turned a lot of core gamers away from the Wii.

The amount of return you get from updating graphics is getting less and less.  I would ask now, based on what you see with graphics today, are the games unplayable?    I bet one can go back in 10 years and look at 3D stuff today, and find a number of games that would still be playable.  I contrast that with 3D stuff on the original Playstation and a number of them fall VERY short of desirable now.

couldnt you say the same for stuff like motion gaming?? Alot of those games are unplayable now. Its just the tech. 3d was new back with PS1 so there was alot of trail and error, but it improved over time. Not much different than motion control tech now



VetteDude on 16 July 2012

Graphics helps games. So does smooth FPS. Guess what those need? Good hardware. For example, I enjoy AC2 more than AC:Brotherhood because on PS3 Brotherhood runs at like 20 FPS in some spots, where AC2 is very smooth with little screen tearing even though they both have just about the same texture quality.



leo-j on 16 July 2012

When you have CGI quality games that rival the CGI in FF XIII, in actual gameplay.. and outstanding detailed open world environments, and miles and miles of detailed terrain.. with characters that are actually well scripted with intelligent A.I and villages that would make nostalgia bloom like a butterfly out of it's cacoon, compared to what.. this gen is offering.. which isn't bad.. but if sony and microsooft really decide to jump a generation ahead.. while nintendo stays on this one.. they can really push boundaries.. simply because sony already basically stated they want a true generational leap in graphics.. not a psp-ps2 jump..



 

mM
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Heavenly_King on 16 July 2012

They are right, but their point of view is limited to what they are offering.  In order to improve gaming experience you require new ideas AND POWER. ....POWER brings ("a bag" that has) BETTER GRAPHICS.   And that is to what Sony and M$ are aiming for Next Gen.

As always nintendo doing damage control.   Nintendo's improvement on gaming experience will be limited due to its limited leap from current gen.  As we can already see, the WiiU mario game is almost the same as every other mario game (before replying, ask yourself how many Mario games are out there and how many games from the franchise your are going to bash exist.   When that franchise reaches the same number of gamess and continues to be the same, then you will have a point).

Flame suit on!



Open World-Survival-Game Days Gone

Soleron on 16 July 2012
SaviorX said:

 Despite all of this, I feel like in 2015, a large computational leap will have occurred, and the Wii U will be in the same situation Wii was...but it might still prove to be too expensive by then to matter. I cannot wait to see the GPad in action though this holiday and what Nintendo has to offer outside of launch.

On the hardware side, we are /done/ with large leaps. 28nm is the last affordable process node, we will not see 20nm (2014) (which is only a half node jump from 28nm) from many players and below that only Intel, GF and TSMC will be able to afford it.. but not for game consoles, for a long time. CPUs and GPU performance has been scaling worse than transistor count since 2006 and no one forsees that changing.



radiantshadow92 on 16 July 2012

i just want some solid AAA new ips. deliver that, amazing graphics or not, and ill buy.



freebs2 on 16 July 2012
Andrespetmonkey said:
freebs2 said:
Andrespetmonkey said:

It's a big part of the experience and the poor visuals on the Wii compared to PS360 turned away a lot of core gamers.

I don't agree what turned away core gamers from Wii wasn't poor visuals, it was just poor 3rd party support, caused by Wii's unablity to run the same engines and the same gaming assets used for 360/Ps3. So in the end the cause is still underpowered hardware, but the reason was not mainly visuals.

You just brought up another great point that helps my case, what if we see the same situation with next-gen? Going for a small jump over this gen's most powerful machines could mean they get left behind (in third party support) if Durango and Orbis are comparitively much more powerful, which is very much a possibility if the Wii U's GPU is as big of a jump over this gen as it's CPU and RAM is.

Hardcore gamers love also bad looking games, like GTA on Ps2. I mean, i liked and I used to play GTA too, but in terms of visuals it was ugly.



Yes, it's definetly a possibility almost everyone has stated that. Tought I personally think the risk of being in a Wii vs ps360 situation is a bit lower this time, for 2 reasons.

A.) According to rumors (we don't have choice so far) the difference between Orbis/Xbox3 and WiiU is relevant but not gigantic like Wii vs ps360.

B.) Most likely WiiU will be capable tu run the same engines used on Orbis/Xbox3, since according to EA and Crytek, FrostByte2 and Cryengine3 are next-gen ready (but can run on 360/Ps3 already), according to  Epic UE4 is a scalable engine, so it can also run on WiiU (even if they stated UE3 is more appropriate for the platform).



happydolphin on 16 July 2012
Sal.Paradise said:

This is exactly what I would have said 10 years ago though. People forget about the march of progress so easily. I remember seeing old usenet posts about diminishing returns in the early Dreamcast era - how much further could we possibly improve graphics from upcoming 128 bit beasts! How can we expect developers to create games on PS2/GC/Xbox hardware, it's too powerful and complex!

It's the same spiel every generation, difference is now Nintendo have a weaker machine to sell, so they'll be saying it too, not just forum posters. 

Sal, what Iwata mentioned also applies to the PS360. All he's saying is that companies are struggling to capitalize on current graphics even today on the HD twins, and some are going belly up. In other words, Iwata expects more companies to focus on the experience (with a baseline satisfaction in graphics) and probably artstyle first as that will probs offer a safer and better ROI.

A tad unrelated, I also don't see a huge leap between PS3 and PS4 graphics happening if PCs are any indicator of it. I don't think the same argument could be used in the Dreamcast era. But I could be wrong on this one.