By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Sales: Why did TP soar and SS flop?

Tagged games:

atma998 on 21 May 2012

It's all about the first iteration of an established franchise on a new generation of console vs. the second one.

In other words, the first game of a franchise which is in its maturity stage will always sell more than a sequel on the same generation of console, especially if the game is released late in the generation. Sure, there are some exceptions here and there but mainly the sales are following this trend.

For example:

The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time (7.60M) vs. Majora's Mask (3.36M)
Final Fantasy X (8.05M) vs. Final Fantasy XII (5.95M)
Final Fantasy VII (9.72M) vs. Final Fantasy IX (5.30M)
Metal Gear Solid 2 (6.05M) vs. Metal Gear Solid 3 (4.23M)
Gran Turismo 3 (14.88M) vs. Gran Turismo 4 (11.36M)
Super Mario Galaxy (10.12M) vs. Super Mario Galaxy 2 (6.75M)
Mario Party 4 (2.47M) vs. Mario Party 7 (1.57M)
Pokémon Diamond / Pearl (17.98M) vs. Pokémon Black / White (13.99M)

This is why when you're comparing sales of one of these game to its predecessor, you always have to compare it to the first iteration on the last generation of console rather than simply comparing it to the previous release of that franchise to see if it performs well.



Around the Network
Arius Dion on 21 May 2012

^very interesting numbers.



Bet between Slimbeast and Arius Dion about Wii sales 2009:


If the Wii sells less than 20 million in 2009 (as defined by VGC sales between week ending 3d Jan 2009 to week ending 4th Jan 2010) Slimebeast wins and get to control Arius Dion's sig for 1 month.

If the Wii sells more than 20 million in 2009 (as defined above) Arius Dion wins and gets to control Slimebeast's sig for 1 month.

oniyide on 21 May 2012
Arius Dion said:
^very interesting numbers.


those are interesting numbers, but what about your Uncharteds, CODs, GOWs, MEs etc of the world. Not all series suffer a decline during a console gen, sometimes its the opposite.



Areym on 21 May 2012
Fusioncode said:
Probably because it was a mediocre Zelda game. Or maybe even the Nintendo fanbase is getting tired of playing OoT for the 5oth time. Hopefully Nintendo changes up the Zelda formula with the next installment.


Amen, brother.



"Trick shot? The trick is NOT to get shot." - Lucian

Gnac on 21 May 2012
Fusioncode said:
Probably because it was a mediocre Zelda game. Or maybe even the Nintendo fanbase is getting tired of playing OoT for the 5oth time. Hopefully Nintendo changes up the Zelda formula with the next installment.

Do you believe in such a thing as a good Zelda game, or are you just being redundant?



WHERE IS MY KORORINPA 3

Around the Network
Zim on 21 May 2012
Arius Dion said:
DieAppleDie said:
i dont trust anyones op, i always try it myself before making any statement, i just pointed out that the game had mostly great reviews from every media.

There are too many factors to just say, disappointing sales=bad game, thats just ridiculous.
I actually believe it performed well taking in count the bad economy, strugglin vg market, Wiis death, no marketing, obligatory m+, sd graphics, .....etc.
too much things that have nothing to do with the quality of the game itself.

I respect that. But I'm not so sure I agree with the other factors inhibiting SS's performance other than its inability to entice enough consumers, or excite the base.

However, shelf life will be considerably shorter than TP's and that most certainly will favor TP's overall performance, but its not like SS has ever lit up any sales charts anyway. You belive its for reasons you've mentioned with are good ones btw, but I'm more of the belief of had the game been better overall that its performance would have reflected that.

I've seen SS receive more mixed reviews than any other Zelda game prior. And in my opinion, the controls weren't the problem, the lack of enough compelling content was. WSR required M+ and that things sold 30m (yes bundled, yada yada etc.)

additionally, I am not saying sales equals quality, its more complex than that, and not every game will sell like NSMB or WS, but a successful games are supposed to spark excitement and provide momentum and SS did neither. I wouldn't call the game a flop, in terms of sales, but definitely for a game with as much dev time as this should have been a crowning acheivement and much more fulfilling than it was. Imho of course.

SS didn't light up sales charts? It's performing better than TP in the same time frame. In a single week it did over a million units!

Also if you have never seen a zelda game get more mixed reviews then you have only been paying attention to Zelda games for what? 2 years? Without even having to take a look I can say that Phantom hourglass, Spirit Tracks, four swords and majoras mask had more mixed reviews. I would also wager that there would be a substantial amount of the earlier games/portable games there. 

Oh also ''The quality of a product can be traced to its markets performance. '' ''I am not saying sales equals quality'' So which is it? Sales do equal quality or they don't? As you seem to be flip flopping on it. 

For someone who has Link as your avatar you sure hate Zelda. So skyward sword was bad, WW was bad, MM was bad, Tp was boring. So basically of the modern zeldas you like Ocarina of time and think everything else is a disappointment? What a unique attitude that is. I'm guessing you disliked ST too since you refer to increasingly boring nonsense like trains. Probably PH as well. 



Turkish says and I'm allowed to quote that: Uncharted 3 and God Of War 3 look better than Unreal Engine 4 games will or the tech demo does. Also the Naughty Dog PS3 ENGINE PLAYS better than the UE4 ENGINE.

Arius Dion on 21 May 2012
Zim said:
Arius Dion said:
DieAppleDie said:
i dont trust anyones op, i always try it myself before making any statement, i just pointed out that the game had mostly great reviews from every media.

There are too many factors to just say, disappointing sales=bad game, thats just ridiculous.
I actually believe it performed well taking in count the bad economy, strugglin vg market, Wiis death, no marketing, obligatory m+, sd graphics, .....etc.
too much things that have nothing to do with the quality of the game itself.

I respect that. But I'm not so sure I agree with the other factors inhibiting SS's performance other than its inability to entice enough consumers, or excite the base.

However, shelf life will be considerably shorter than TP's and that most certainly will favor TP's overall performance, but its not like SS has ever lit up any sales charts anyway. You belive its for reasons you've mentioned with are good ones btw, but I'm more of the belief of had the game been better overall that its performance would have reflected that.

I've seen SS receive more mixed reviews than any other Zelda game prior. And in my opinion, the controls weren't the problem, the lack of enough compelling content was. WSR required M+ and that things sold 30m (yes bundled, yada yada etc.)

additionally, I am not saying sales equals quality, its more complex than that, and not every game will sell like NSMB or WS, but a successful games are supposed to spark excitement and provide momentum and SS did neither. I wouldn't call the game a flop, in terms of sales, but definitely for a game with as much dev time as this should have been a crowning acheivement and much more fulfilling than it was. Imho of course.

SS didn't light up sales charts? It's performing better than TP in the same time frame. In a single week it did over a million units!

Also if you have never seen a zelda game get more mixed reviews then you have only been paying attention to Zelda games for what? 2 years? Without even having to take a look I can say that Phantom hourglass, Spirit Tracks, four swords and majoras mask had more mixed reviews. I would also wager that there would be a substantial amount of the earlier games/portable games there. 

Oh also ''The quality of a product can be traced to its markets performance. '' ''I am not saying sales equals quality'' So which is it? Sales do equal quality or they don't? As you seem to be flip flopping on it. 

For someone who has Link as your avatar you sure hate Zelda. So skyward sword was bad, WW was bad, MM was bad, Tp was boring. So basically of the modern zeldas you like Ocarina of time and think everything else is a disappointment? What a unique attitude that is. I'm guessing you disliked ST too since you refer to increasingly boring nonsense like trains. Probably PH as well. 

After a single week of selling over 1000000 units what did it do after that? What is it doing now? Those games you mentioned probably had worst reviews, because they were also bad Zelda games.

I've explained myself about market performance just read it again. It is more complex than just saying sales=quality, but there are correlations, and word of mouth is extremely powerful at both ends of the spectrum. But I digress.

So I'm not allowed to critique a sacred cow such as Zelda? As a gamer who grew up playing the series, when the series continues to stray from the things that defined it, I'm supposed to just go along to get along? That's what I would call a 'unique attitude.' I've also said that SS wasn't all bad, it was a mixed bag. Some things were very well done, other things weren't, as has been the case with every game post OoT.

Yes, I feel of the 3D Zelda's OoT was the best, cheifly because the games it drew upon for its structure were the NES/SNES game(s) so it felt like Alttp in 3D. I don't know where Trains fit in, or a loftwing, or a wolf or tad tones, or any of these things in the Zelda universe. Things start to drastically change and I'm not too sure its changing for the best. I'm a fan of Metroid as well, as you can see, does that mean that I have to also go along with every Metroid game made, even if its also a lame game like Other M?

I'm assuming you enjoy every Zelda game put out in the last decade?



 



Bet between Slimbeast and Arius Dion about Wii sales 2009:


If the Wii sells less than 20 million in 2009 (as defined by VGC sales between week ending 3d Jan 2009 to week ending 4th Jan 2010) Slimebeast wins and get to control Arius Dion's sig for 1 month.

If the Wii sells more than 20 million in 2009 (as defined above) Arius Dion wins and gets to control Slimebeast's sig for 1 month.

theRepublic on 21 May 2012
Arius Dion said:

I've seen SS receive more mixed reviews than any other Zelda game prior.

Maybe you should look again.  Only three games in the entire franchise were reviewed better than Skyward Sword.

1. Ocarina of Time - 97.48 (N64) / 93.84 (3DS)
2. Twilight Princess - 96.00 (GC) / 94.51 (Wii)
3. The Wind Waker - 94.48
4. Skyward Sword - 93.34

http://www.gamerankings.com/browse.html?search=zelda&numrev=3&site=

Most of those scores are so close together it isn't even significant anyway.



Switch Code: SW-7377-9189-3397 -- Nintendo Network ID: theRepublic -- Steam ID: theRepublic

Now Playing
Switch - Super Mario Maker 2 (2019)
Switch - The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening (2019)
Switch - Bastion (2011/2018)
3DS - Star Fox 64 3D (2011)
3DS - Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney (Trilogy) (2005/2014)
Wii U - Darksiders: Warmastered Edition (2010/2017)
Mobile - The Simpson's Tapped Out and Yugioh Duel Links
PC - Deep Rock Galactic (2020)

Arius Dion on 22 May 2012

^no not too significant. But we can all agree reviews scores and emphasis on them have changed significantly in the last decade.



Bet between Slimbeast and Arius Dion about Wii sales 2009:


If the Wii sells less than 20 million in 2009 (as defined by VGC sales between week ending 3d Jan 2009 to week ending 4th Jan 2010) Slimebeast wins and get to control Arius Dion's sig for 1 month.

If the Wii sells more than 20 million in 2009 (as defined above) Arius Dion wins and gets to control Slimebeast's sig for 1 month.

2000cc on 22 May 2012

In my personal case, by the time Skyward sword came out, I was bored of Zelda & the wii & didnt bother, Twilight princess was one of the more decent zeldas though, but i'm just over the series now



PLAYSTATION NATION LADY OF JRPGS

Favourite Games of 2013 1.Tomb Raider(PS3) 2.Atelier Ayesha(PS3) 3.Virtues Last Reward (Vita)