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Forums - Sales Discussion - Its time to admit it. PS3 will outsell the 360 in about 3 years

unknown_soul89 on 02 August 2010
nightsurge said:
unknown_soul89 said:
nightsurge said:
unknown_soul89 said:
carlosmp said:

X360 is outselling PS3 right now, ¿what will change that?

I think X360 has more things, like the Arcade bundle, Halo Reach, Kinect, etc.

A month time, the 360 is selling more because they came out with a new model those numbers don't last, you're in denial if you think halo reach is going to sell 360s, anyone who cares about halo has a 360 everyone else sees it for the mediocre shooter it is, arcade bundles have been out for years ps3 still outsells the 360 year to year and kinect lol don't make me laugh 

Insecure about something?

First, no, not every Halo fan has a 360.  Far from it.  I can name at least 15 of my close friends who love Halo yet don't have any current gen console yet.  Anyone who thinks every Halo fan is already on 360 is purely ignorant.  Also, love how you troll it generalizing that everyone thinks it is a mediocre shooter.  It has way more features than current more recent shooters and Halo: Reach is going to expand on that even further.

Second, how can you say the PS3 outsells the 360 year after year when since it's release the PS3 has only outsold the 360 one year so far which was last year.  2005-2008 were all 360 with higher sales.

And lastly, it must really upset you that Kinect is receiving far more interest and way way way more preorders than Move even with its high price tag.  Must be a rough time for you.

Oh and why are you using shipment figures when ioi and TheSource themselves have gone over time and time again why Sony's shipment figures seem to be inflated/off from all the major tracking sites?

 

So why would reach be the game to make them buy it if they passed over a 360 every halo game so far? Logic isn't your thing is it, and halo screams mediocre and the reach stuff just sounds like and probably is marketing hype

Apparently reading comprehension AND logic isn't your thing.  Notice I said they don't have ANY current gen console.  That means they passed them all up.  I'm merely pointing out that there is still a large market for Halo thanks to its highly popular LAN Party scene and still has many potential customers that have yet to jump onto any home console yet.

because ps3 sells on average 9.5 a year and 360 only 8.3 a year if 360 really did outsell the ps3 2005-2008 year to year then ps3 must have sold several million more then 360 in 2009 but since you haven't backed up that statement with anything I think it's safe to assume you don't know what you are talking about 

2005 is a given.

2006: VGChartz Hardware data for the period 01st Jan 2006 to 30th Dec 2006:
Console PS3 X360
Total
1,232,194
6,756,463
2007: VGChartz Hardware data for the period 31st Dec 2006 to 29th Dec 2007:
Console PS3 X360
Total
7,621,891
7,878,345
2009: VGChartz Hardware data for the period 30th Dec 2007 to 27th Dec 2008:
Console PS3 X360
Total
9,381,708
10,645,575

MS is marketing kinect more then move so yes it will sell more on launch but the fact that it doesn't work and has nothing but wii knock off games means it won't sell more then that, and don't pretend we have solid numbers on preorders, they claim it's more and expect half a mil by launch but EA expected mirror's edge to sell 3 million out of the gate, companies expectations aren't realistic lol

Does that include Sony's 15 million projection for this year?  I agree it's not realistic.

The reason I'm using shipment figures is because I know their accurate, I don't know that the tracking sites are accurate, in fact I'm almost positive their not accurate seeing how ps3 is on the market and sells substantially in countries that aren't tracked properly/at all

But we don't know they are accurate.  Nintendo and MS numbers match all major tracking sites, yet Sony's are quite a bit off.  ioi and TheSource already explained this.



I don't know, how much has SONY sold so far? But I'd say probably since ps3 is selling on average 9.5 mil a year, anyone who thinks expectations equal fact or even probability are quite deluded 

We know that the ps3 shipped numbers are accurate, unless you are saying Sony flat out lied on their financial report, which is something I don't even think MS could pull off, Sony's shipped numbers are accurate and as far as I know counted the same as MSes shipped, and I know the trackers aren't completely accurate so yea, you are trying to claim their numbers aren't accurate because it doesn't match the trackers when we know the trackers aren't 100% accurate, thats incredibly flawed logic 



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nightsurge on 02 August 2010
BigBoobieHead said:

Nighsurge,  I've already replied to your nonsense points about shipping yet you keep using them in other arguments.

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=113832&page=1

Would you please stop being ignorant and read what the actual admins of the site have to say?

Sheesh... some people are so ignorant and stubborn...



BigBoobieHead on 02 August 2010
nightsurge said:
BigBoobieHead said:
nightsurge said:
unknown_soul89 said:
carlosmp said:

X360 is outselling PS3 right now, ¿what will change that?

I think X360 has more things, like the Arcade bundle, Halo Reach, Kinect, etc.

A month time, the 360 is selling more because they came out with a new model those numbers don't last, you're in denial if you think halo reach is going to sell 360s, anyone who cares about halo has a 360 everyone else sees it for the mediocre shooter it is, arcade bundles have been out for years ps3 still outsells the 360 year to year and kinect lol don't make me laugh 

Insecure about something?

First, no, not every Halo fan has a 360.  Far from it.  I can name at least 15 of my close friends who love Halo yet don't have any current gen console yet.  Anyone who thinks every Halo fan is already on 360 is purely ignorant.  Also, love how you troll it generalizing that everyone thinks it is a mediocre shooter.  It has way more features than current more recent shooters and Halo: Reach is going to expand on that even further.

Second, how can you say the PS3 outsells the 360 year after year when since it's release the PS3 has only outsold the 360 one year so far which was last year.  2005-2008 were all 360 with higher sales.

And lastly, it must really upset you that Kinect is receiving far more interest and way way way more preorders than Move even with its high price tag.  Must be a rough time for you.

Oh and why are you using shipment figures when ioi and TheSource themselves have gone over time and time again why Sony's shipment figures seem to be inflated/off from all the major tracking sites?

Horrible post, oozing of bias. I'l present you with some hard facts:

  • Microsoft has sold 3.6M more consoles than Sony
  • Microsoft had more than a years head start 
  • The PS3 had no games at the start
  • The PS3 has always been a lot more expensive (Key Point)
  • Sony keeps consoles out longer than MS
  • The PS3 is seen as more futureproof
  • PS3 likely has more price cuts left in it - although MS are trying to battle this

Bottom part is bullshit considering all these tracking services don't actually track many markets that Sony sell into.

So basically what you are saying is that Sony's sales in un-tacked regions don't count.

People who also talk about overshipped are just plain crazy, and don't know what the term actually means.

So, yes I see the PS3 having higher sales soon enough (talking about shipment figures).

Ugh... I'm sorry but I'm not being biased.  Just informed.  Try reading up on this site a bit more.  ioi and TheSource (you know, the admins and the operators of this sales tracking system) have explained all of this many times as to why Sony's numbers are off and how very little of a difference those "un-trackable regions" actually makes.  Also, they do include some numbers to cover those regions, just fyi.

ioi and TheSource - two men a vast majority of sales/game enthusiasts deem very unreliable (even if they are or not), do not know how much difference these 'un-trackable' regions make, because, they are...'un-trackable.'

I don't even think the PS3 is undertracked here, I'm just amazed at how little people know. Like those saying 'overshipped.' Could somebody please explain what exactly they think that means to me. Lol.

Fyi, it is illegal for Sony's numbers to be 'off.'



A Bad Clown on 02 August 2010
NiKKoM said:
BigBoobieHead said:
NiKKoM said:
unknown_soul89 said:
The reason I'm using shipment figures is because I know their accurate, I don't know that the tracking sites are accurate, in fact I'm almost positive their not accurate seeing how ps3 is on the market and sells substantially in countries that aren't tracked properly/at all

Then why are you on this site? let's NOT use numbers from vgchartz.. wtf..  >_<" 

He's on this sales site because he wants to discuss sales, uses VGC numbers as an indicator but realises shipment figures are naturally more accurate.

What's the problem?

You haven't seen his post history....

He's obviously the guy who wrote the article on why VGChartz isn't reliable!



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unknown_soul89 on 02 August 2010
Jay520 said:
Mr Puggsly said:
Jay520 said:
Mr Puggsly said:
Jay520 said:
Mr Puggsly said:
unknown_soul89 said:

Okay seriously people saying the ps3 will never outsell the 360 need to do some fact checking, the 360 has been out for a year longer, so if ps3 is on the market for the same amount of time as the 360 it will outsell it (selling about 9.5 mil on average a year with about a 3.5 mil gab) and ps3 sells about 1 million more consoles a year then the 360 does, actually lets be more specific then that 

38.1/4= 9.525 million a year

41.7/5=8.34 million a year 

9.525-8.34= 1.185 million difference a year

41.7-38.1=3.6 million

3.6/1.185=3.037 years until the ps3 outsells the 360, assuming they both stay on the market

You ignore that the 360 has actually sold more starting from the PS3 launch.

 

VGChartz Hardware data for the period 05th Nov 2006 to 24th Jul 2010:

Console X360
Total
36,331,518

 

VGChartz Hardware data for the period 05th Nov 2006 to 24th Jul 2010:

Console PS3
Total
36,176,693

 

Its not impossible for the PS3 to sell more in the end. But face it, MS dominated Sony this gen mostly because of Sony's own mistakes. Everybody thought the PS3 would easily outsell the 360 and it didn't.

Didn't PS3 launch in Europe (its biggest region) in 2007.

I wasn't aware. Well like I said, MS won because of Sony's mistakes. Throw that in the pile of stupid decisions Sony made for the PS3 launch.

What exactly did MS win? They sold a few million more consoles than Sony. Just because 360 is very successful doesn't mean the PS3 is unsuccessful. The PS3 is in a very good position right with the best yet to come. It's sad that two consoles can't exist together happily.

They didn't just sell a few million more. They sold a few million more than the almighty Sony. But they couldn't haven't done it without Sony's dumb decisions.

How is the PS3 not unsuccessful? Not only will it not pay for itself. It probably won't even make the PS2 profits back. If the PS3 is a success than I don't know the meaning of failure. Anyone can have a mainstream console as long as they willing to piss away billions. That's how MS entered the console gaming industry.

Almighty Sony? uh...  okay

So know you're talking about profits. I don't know the specifics of the cost of the PS3 and how much SONY loses on each PS3, so I won't get into that. Either way, PS3 is on its way on selling a lot IMO (although that would be bad for SONY since they're losing money).

PS3 hasn't been selling at loss for years and before that it was selling at a loss of about a dollar that guys points are so outdated, and if we are talking about profits equal good no matter what the best move MS made was charging for online while offering no extra, and in some cases less service then it's free competitors



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BigBoobieHead on 02 August 2010
nightsurge said:
BigBoobieHead said:

Nighsurge,  I've already replied to your nonsense points about shipping yet you keep using them in other arguments.

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=113832&page=1

Would you please stop being ignorant and read what the actual admins of the site have to say?

Sheesh... some people are so ignorant and stubborn...

Says the guy who claims Sony overships.

'Because ioi and TheSource say so' is not in any way a response to why you claim Sony's numbers are 'off' - which is illegal.



nightsurge on 02 August 2010
BigBoobieHead said:
nightsurge said:
BigBoobieHead said:
nightsurge said:
unknown_soul89 said:
carlosmp said:

X360 is outselling PS3 right now, ¿what will change that?

I think X360 has more things, like the Arcade bundle, Halo Reach, Kinect, etc.

A month time, the 360 is selling more because they came out with a new model those numbers don't last, you're in denial if you think halo reach is going to sell 360s, anyone who cares about halo has a 360 everyone else sees it for the mediocre shooter it is, arcade bundles have been out for years ps3 still outsells the 360 year to year and kinect lol don't make me laugh 

Insecure about something?

First, no, not every Halo fan has a 360.  Far from it.  I can name at least 15 of my close friends who love Halo yet don't have any current gen console yet.  Anyone who thinks every Halo fan is already on 360 is purely ignorant.  Also, love how you troll it generalizing that everyone thinks it is a mediocre shooter.  It has way more features than current more recent shooters and Halo: Reach is going to expand on that even further.

Second, how can you say the PS3 outsells the 360 year after year when since it's release the PS3 has only outsold the 360 one year so far which was last year.  2005-2008 were all 360 with higher sales.

And lastly, it must really upset you that Kinect is receiving far more interest and way way way more preorders than Move even with its high price tag.  Must be a rough time for you.

Oh and why are you using shipment figures when ioi and TheSource themselves have gone over time and time again why Sony's shipment figures seem to be inflated/off from all the major tracking sites?

Horrible post, oozing of bias. I'l present you with some hard facts:

  • Microsoft has sold 3.6M more consoles than Sony
  • Microsoft had more than a years head start 
  • The PS3 had no games at the start
  • The PS3 has always been a lot more expensive (Key Point)
  • Sony keeps consoles out longer than MS
  • The PS3 is seen as more futureproof
  • PS3 likely has more price cuts left in it - although MS are trying to battle this

Bottom part is bullshit considering all these tracking services don't actually track many markets that Sony sell into.

So basically what you are saying is that Sony's sales in un-tacked regions don't count.

People who also talk about overshipped are just plain crazy, and don't know what the term actually means.

So, yes I see the PS3 having higher sales soon enough (talking about shipment figures).

Ugh... I'm sorry but I'm not being biased.  Just informed.  Try reading up on this site a bit more.  ioi and TheSource (you know, the admins and the operators of this sales tracking system) have explained all of this many times as to why Sony's numbers are off and how very little of a difference those "un-trackable regions" actually makes.  Also, they do include some numbers to cover those regions, just fyi.

ioi and TheSource - two men a vast majority of sales/game enthusiasts deem very unreliable (even if they are or not), do not know how much difference these 'un-trackable' regions make, because, they are...'un-trackable.'

I don't even think the PS3 is undertracked here, I'm just amazed at how little people know. Like those saying 'overshipped.' Could somebody please explain what exactly they think that means to me. Lol.

Fyi, it is illegal for Sony's numbers to be 'off.'

No one is saying they are manipulated illegally.  We are saying we don't know what all Sony counts into their shipment figures.  For example, Sony may count orders as they are received as "shipped" even before they ship out of the warehouse a few weeks later, thus giving their numbers an extra 4 weeks of shipment data over everyone else.  It has also been suggested that they may count repaired units as "shipped" since they are also being technically shipped out to customers.  No one knows for sure.  Neither of those would be illegal for Sony to count and it would still show the discrepancies we are seeing.

Also, please don't mistake me for claiming that it is a fact Sony's numbers are misleading.  I am merely suggesting that possibility since we can't know for sure and the evidence does seem to point to some sort of error.  I am inclined to think the issue is with what Sony counts as "shipped" since all the major tracking sites, NPD, gfk, vgchartz, etc. are well in line with one another and with MS and Nintendo figures.



Mr Puggsly on 02 August 2010
Jay520 said:

Almighty Sony? uh...  okay

So know you're talking about profits. I don't know the specifics of the cost of the PS3 and how much SONY loses on each PS3, so I won't get into that. Either way, PS3 is on its way on selling a lot IMO (although that would be bad for SONY since they're losing money).

Well Sony has lost about 5 billion since the launch of the PS3. And that's with PS2 and PSP sales since PS3 launch  included. God knows how much they really lost on the PS3 a lone. That's an unbelievable failure for a company that dominated the last two generations.

I do believe the PS3 is making a small profit for each unit sold now. But they'll never make much money on the PS3 units because of competition. All they can hope for is MS to keep console prices the same so they don't have retaliate with another price cut. The 360 has been making money for years, sales are great, so there is no need for them to cut prices unless Sony does.



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BigBoobieHead on 02 August 2010
nightsurge said:
BigBoobieHead said:
nightsurge said:
BigBoobieHead said:
nightsurge said:
unknown_soul89 said:
carlosmp said:

X360 is outselling PS3 right now, ¿what will change that?

I think X360 has more things, like the Arcade bundle, Halo Reach, Kinect, etc.

A month time, the 360 is selling more because they came out with a new model those numbers don't last, you're in denial if you think halo reach is going to sell 360s, anyone who cares about halo has a 360 everyone else sees it for the mediocre shooter it is, arcade bundles have been out for years ps3 still outsells the 360 year to year and kinect lol don't make me laugh 

Insecure about something?

First, no, not every Halo fan has a 360.  Far from it.  I can name at least 15 of my close friends who love Halo yet don't have any current gen console yet.  Anyone who thinks every Halo fan is already on 360 is purely ignorant.  Also, love how you troll it generalizing that everyone thinks it is a mediocre shooter.  It has way more features than current more recent shooters and Halo: Reach is going to expand on that even further.

Second, how can you say the PS3 outsells the 360 year after year when since it's release the PS3 has only outsold the 360 one year so far which was last year.  2005-2008 were all 360 with higher sales.

And lastly, it must really upset you that Kinect is receiving far more interest and way way way more preorders than Move even with its high price tag.  Must be a rough time for you.

Oh and why are you using shipment figures when ioi and TheSource themselves have gone over time and time again why Sony's shipment figures seem to be inflated/off from all the major tracking sites?

Horrible post, oozing of bias. I'l present you with some hard facts:

  • Microsoft has sold 3.6M more consoles than Sony
  • Microsoft had more than a years head start 
  • The PS3 had no games at the start
  • The PS3 has always been a lot more expensive (Key Point)
  • Sony keeps consoles out longer than MS
  • The PS3 is seen as more futureproof
  • PS3 likely has more price cuts left in it - although MS are trying to battle this

Bottom part is bullshit considering all these tracking services don't actually track many markets that Sony sell into.

So basically what you are saying is that Sony's sales in un-tacked regions don't count.

People who also talk about overshipped are just plain crazy, and don't know what the term actually means.

So, yes I see the PS3 having higher sales soon enough (talking about shipment figures).

Ugh... I'm sorry but I'm not being biased.  Just informed.  Try reading up on this site a bit more.  ioi and TheSource (you know, the admins and the operators of this sales tracking system) have explained all of this many times as to why Sony's numbers are off and how very little of a difference those "un-trackable regions" actually makes.  Also, they do include some numbers to cover those regions, just fyi.

ioi and TheSource - two men a vast majority of sales/game enthusiasts deem very unreliable (even if they are or not), do not know how much difference these 'un-trackable' regions make, because, they are...'un-trackable.'

I don't even think the PS3 is undertracked here, I'm just amazed at how little people know. Like those saying 'overshipped.' Could somebody please explain what exactly they think that means to me. Lol.

Fyi, it is illegal for Sony's numbers to be 'off.'

No one is saying they are manipulated illegally.  We are saying we don't know what all Sony counts into their shipment figures.  For example, Sony may count orders as they are received as "shipped" even before they ship out of the warehouse a few weeks later, thus giving their numbers an extra 4 weeks of shipment data over everyone else.  It has also been suggested that they may count repaired units as "shipped" since they are also being technically shipped out to customers.  No one knows for sure.  Neither of those would be illegal for Sony to count and it would still show the discrepancies we are seeing.

Also, please don't mistake me for claiming that it is a fact Sony's numbers are misleading.  I am merely suggesting that possibility since we can't know for sure and the evidence does seem to point to some sort of error.  I am inclined to think the issue is with what Sony counts as "shipped" since all the major tracking sites, NPD, gfk, vgchartz, etc. are well in line with one another and with MS and Nintendo figures.

Ok, good post, I know a sound a little cheesed off but anyway.

First post is right, but I'm not sure that those things you mentioned would make a big difference, and I wish people would put it across like you, instead of the 'Sony is lying' stance.

Since all other trackers are in line with VGC (who I think are accurate btw), that also could suggest that these shipment and sold numbers are correct. (I believe this).

2M PS3's on shelves is absolutely reasonable considering how many stores sell PS3's worldwide.

So, I think both Sony and VGC are spot on (not sure about PSP numbers though). The thing that annoys me is the 'overshipping' and 'lying' points of view.



unknown_soul89 on 02 August 2010
nightsurge said:
BigBoobieHead said:
nightsurge said:
BigBoobieHead said:
nightsurge said:
unknown_soul89 said:
carlosmp said:

X360 is outselling PS3 right now, ¿what will change that?

I think X360 has more things, like the Arcade bundle, Halo Reach, Kinect, etc.

A month time, the 360 is selling more because they came out with a new model those numbers don't last, you're in denial if you think halo reach is going to sell 360s, anyone who cares about halo has a 360 everyone else sees it for the mediocre shooter it is, arcade bundles have been out for years ps3 still outsells the 360 year to year and kinect lol don't make me laugh 

Insecure about something?

First, no, not every Halo fan has a 360.  Far from it.  I can name at least 15 of my close friends who love Halo yet don't have any current gen console yet.  Anyone who thinks every Halo fan is already on 360 is purely ignorant.  Also, love how you troll it generalizing that everyone thinks it is a mediocre shooter.  It has way more features than current more recent shooters and Halo: Reach is going to expand on that even further.

Second, how can you say the PS3 outsells the 360 year after year when since it's release the PS3 has only outsold the 360 one year so far which was last year.  2005-2008 were all 360 with higher sales.

And lastly, it must really upset you that Kinect is receiving far more interest and way way way more preorders than Move even with its high price tag.  Must be a rough time for you.

Oh and why are you using shipment figures when ioi and TheSource themselves have gone over time and time again why Sony's shipment figures seem to be inflated/off from all the major tracking sites?

Horrible post, oozing of bias. I'l present you with some hard facts:

  • Microsoft has sold 3.6M more consoles than Sony
  • Microsoft had more than a years head start 
  • The PS3 had no games at the start
  • The PS3 has always been a lot more expensive (Key Point)
  • Sony keeps consoles out longer than MS
  • The PS3 is seen as more futureproof
  • PS3 likely has more price cuts left in it - although MS are trying to battle this

Bottom part is bullshit considering all these tracking services don't actually track many markets that Sony sell into.

So basically what you are saying is that Sony's sales in un-tacked regions don't count.

People who also talk about overshipped are just plain crazy, and don't know what the term actually means.

So, yes I see the PS3 having higher sales soon enough (talking about shipment figures).

Ugh... I'm sorry but I'm not being biased.  Just informed.  Try reading up on this site a bit more.  ioi and TheSource (you know, the admins and the operators of this sales tracking system) have explained all of this many times as to why Sony's numbers are off and how very little of a difference those "un-trackable regions" actually makes.  Also, they do include some numbers to cover those regions, just fyi.

ioi and TheSource - two men a vast majority of sales/game enthusiasts deem very unreliable (even if they are or not), do not know how much difference these 'un-trackable' regions make, because, they are...'un-trackable.'

I don't even think the PS3 is undertracked here, I'm just amazed at how little people know. Like those saying 'overshipped.' Could somebody please explain what exactly they think that means to me. Lol.

Fyi, it is illegal for Sony's numbers to be 'off.'

No one is saying they are manipulated illegally.  We are saying we don't know what all Sony counts into their shipment figures.  For example, Sony may count orders as they are received as "shipped" even before they ship out of the warehouse a few weeks later, thus giving their numbers an extra 4 weeks of shipment data over everyone else.  It has also been suggested that they may count repaired units as "shipped" since they are also being technically shipped out to customers.  No one knows for sure.  Neither of those would be illegal for Sony to count and it would still show the discrepancies we are seeing.

Also, please don't mistake me for claiming that it is a fact Sony's numbers are misleading.  I am merely suggesting that possibility since we can't know for sure and the evidence does seem to point to some sort of error.  I am inclined to think the issue is with what Sony counts as "shipped" since all the major tracking sites, NPD, gfk, vgchartz, etc. are well in line with one another and with MS and Nintendo figures.

Show us PROOF Sony counts shipped differently then MS or shut up