"Why weren't those games the same experience, though? That's the point. The Wii isn't the best platform for those titles."

The Wii didn't make the multiplayer not be local. That was a design choice. And since the Wii still handles them with online, which has plenty of numbers from the online statistics report, it's clear the Wii can handle them.

Actually it was the limited development time, a Treyarch developer on GAF stated splitscreen was in the original plan but was cut when they didn't have enough time.

"Actually it was the limited development time, a Treyarch developer on GAF stated splitscreen was in the original plan but was cut when they didn't have enough time."

Then hopefully the next one will finally have it, and we can see how local multiplayer helps sell these games.

I take your point, but I bet it still won't happen!  I'd say it's pretty clear the die has been cast in this area.  

Infinity Ward

http://kotaku.com/5396559/infinity-ward-wii-cant-deliver-our-multi+platform-experience

Epic

http://www.destructoid.com/epic-s-rein-m-rated-wii-games-are-huge-financial-flops--141140.phtml

Now of course in any industry never doesn't mean never, but I think it's clear that in general most of the developers producing big hits for the HD consoles aren't falling over to support the Wii, and it's also clear they seriously doubt the sales of their titles on the platform.

I do too, obviously, but of course can't prove anything unless they try and fail as you say, but based on the sales of respective games, particularly by rating, I'm feeling pretty sure that the result is more likely to be a failure than a success (comparative to the potential sales on the HD consoles).

I just don't believe, and clearly neither do a lot of developers, that there really are huge numbers of Wii owners demanding certain titles vs the known genres that sell well on the Wii, or that millions of young male teenagers are looking at their Wii and wondering where the Epic, IW, Rockstar big titles are.  I think you represent a minority of Wii owners, TBH, and are more likely to remain unsupported than supported.  Note I'm not gloating or even saying this is right - it's just how I read the market and I don't see much chance for major changes.

Neither do I (or these developers) feel they are losing a shit ton of money.  MW2 is well over 10M, Gears 1 &2 has a huge haul, Uncharted 1 & 2 have a huge haul (going by Sony not VG), GTAIV is well past 10M, etc. etc. and those titles and many others I firmly believe would be more or less wasted appearing heavily cut down graphically on the Wii or adapted to its controllers.

So I'm still of the 'fragmented market' mindset, where different companies are going to bet on different consoles for the most part leaving this topic open until the end of the gen, whereupon, if the Wii has remained ignorned in the same vein, I'll claim victory by default.

The Wii is a huge success, and clearly Nintendo gave themselves the larger install base and great SW sales with the choices they made, but at the same time those choices also eliminated the chance for great SW sales and support in certain genres and areas, and I don't think that's going to change.

EDIT : one final point.  I'm not really sure Nintendo themselves would be that keen on a huge marketing push and hype for games like MW2 or Gears on the Wii.  The Wii is very, very heavily marketed as a family console, with neat familes of 4 or nice neat friends in groups of 4, enjoying it together having fun.  It's whole consistent image, I doubt, could easily support a major push for the console as being home to heavily online, competitive, violent games.  It just doesn't fit and I believe that's also part of the issue.

"and it's also clear they seriously doubt the sales of their titles on the platform"

This is also because they have it wrong about what sells their games. So when some make Wii games they go for the graphics about things like replay value and multiplayer. They seriously don't get that those sell games more, so when the games don't sell, they just assume it was the Wii audience.

In short, they are the reasons their titles don't sell, and they just don't get why.

I can understand Infinity Ward not wanting to make a Wii COD4 because they did not know the system's architecture or something, but they should have given it to Treyarch. With that absence on the Wii, they missed out on millions of dollars, at the point where the audience multiplied by nearly 350%. COD3 on the 360 sold 2.35 million, but COD4 went on to sell 8.15 million, more than tripling its sales. What is to say that if the Wii got a COD4 ON TIME, its sales wouldn't have tripled into the 4 million range like the 360 version?

In retrospect, you would think 2.35m isn't much to look at but when you see how much the franchise has expanded since then you wouldn't have much to say Reasonable. The Wii missed out on the entire expansion period, and you expect consumers to appear two years later? That in itself is....unreasonable. And Epic just outright hates the Wii, like when they called it a virus and Cliff Blezinski got a boner trashing the console back in 2008 after several repeated attempts.

All those games you mentioned above were large exceptions to the overall rule. For every GTA4 (the company posted losses the quarter after GTA4's release) and Modern Warfare, I can give you a Factor 5, a Grin Studios, a Golden Axe, Pandemic, Bionic Commando, & Midway that has outright failed in their attempts to please the PS360 base.

The entire marketing struggle between the PS3 and 360 only further confuses customers, however who adertises the most usually ends up reaping the benefits. How much money have these companies thrown down the tube over measly things like DLC and timed exclusivity? The only thing the Wii cannot do is graphics. AI is also thrown in the pot along with physics, but I have not really witnessed any outstanding title that proves that stuff. The fact that these titles can be downported leagues down to the PSP of all godforsaken software selling consoles is really close to a slap in the face when it is later claimed no Wii iteration can be created.

No one really complains about 3rd parties until they start complaining, usually about the most nonsensical of things. My favorite example is the recent THQ, who said Deadly Creatures failed. He also said titles like the Biggest Loser and Marvel Super Hero Squad succeeded. Do you know MarvSuper Hero Squad and Deadly Creatures SOLD THE EXACT SAME AMOUNT?? (150k)

I'm done.

*and the headache starts*

Ok yeah, of course Epic wants to troll the shit out of the Wii like they did in the link you provided, their engine was made for the consoles they want to support with games, it cost them a lot of money to make and they were gaining it back with third parties using it for PS3 and 360 while the Wii developers could still make their own engines at a lower development cost and make better looking games in the process, Epic was taking advantage of the insanly high development costs.

As for Epic's games look at their old bread and butter Unreal Tournament III combined PS3 and 360 sales are out sold by CoD W@W on Wii.  Yeah that proves they have no market on PS3 and 360 I'm guessing if we go by sales on that one am I right?

As for things like GTAIV, I'm guessing you missed when 2K games is still posting losses, they were almost bought out by EA, which has troubles of their own now, and now 2K will have to sell "5 million" copies of Red Dead Redemption to break even with that project, indeed their business model makes perfect sense.

The reason these people don't flat out say they're losing a shit ton of money is because they have investors they need to keep from losing, if they lost those investors it's game over for them in multiple ways.  But the one thing they can't ignore is the actual numbers on their reports... I can find you a list of dead developers and publishers, the common trait with most of them is they were all HD exclusive or had "big" HD games that didn't sell well.

This is probably the most unreasonable post I've seen in a while, since you can't really ignore facts and numbers, which is where my argument has it's basis, while you're claiming sales = doing well but completely ignoring the fact that even with million sellers these guys are hurting pretty badly...

Infinity Ward had to develop and engine and then release on 3 platforms with COD 4. Your assumptions are based upon the idea that they could have released without a drop in quality and therefore sales on the 3 other platforms to support the Wii. An extra platform means developers taken away from the DX9 version of the game and extra testing etc. The reason why COD 4 performed so well was because it was so outstanding in the market. A less outstanding COD 4 means lower sales. These lower sales would then transfer forwards to lower sales for COD WAW and COD MW2.

"Infinity Ward had to develop and engine and then release on 3 platforms with COD 4. Your assumptions are based upon the idea that they could have released without a drop in quality and therefore sales on the 3 other platforms to support the Wii. An extra platform means developers taken away from the DX9 version of the game and extra testing etc. The reason why COD 4 performed so well was because it was so outstanding in the market. A less outstanding COD 4 means lower sales. These lower sales would then transfer forwards to lower sales for COD WAW and COD MW2."

He was stating IF they had gotten AROUND that problem. Duh.

Maybe if Nintendo had used programmable shaders, maybe if third parties had been more willing, maybe if Nintendo had offered more help at the beginning... maybe... etc.