Nautilus said: Jumpin said: On the AAA titles, I don’t see that as very much the Nintendo market. That’s Sony’s dominion, though thoroughly. Nintendo is much more about the creative and innovative games. In fact, I’d say Breath of the Wild is the only real “AAA game” Nintendo ever developed. And as a Nintendo fan, I don’t like the dishonesty among some of the fan base trying to pretend games like Fire Emblem or Pokemon as AAA games - while it’s true that Pokemon is a lot more popular than AAA games, the “AAA” is more about the high expense of time, moneys and resources (as in staff/tools) dumped into the production of the product (A lot of time, A lot of money, A lot of resources). Generally it’s more of a Western game dev concept and Zelda doesn’t quite follow the typical formula either: 1. Spend a lot of money, resources, and time on a game. 2. If it succeedes, greenlight a series of annual sequels. 3. Have gigantic factory-style dev teams of hundreds of people, lots of money for promotion, development, and the giant QA and producer staff involved. 4. Stay in the box, any innovation must be based on what the product managers and their researches tell you will sell. 5. Keep churning out title after title, spending tens of millions per year, and have your development pipeline working like a well greased factory assembly-like. That is not Nintendo, that is Activision, EA, and Ubisoft. And the formula works well - but Nintendo’s way of doing things also works extraordinarily well. No offence, but goddammit, what a twisted view of what an AAA game, or rather a high profile game, should be.Honestly, there is not much to say to out other than everything you just said is wrong.Being a high profile game is not about burning money on a game that dosent require such investment to be the best it can, rather that the developer thats behind it gives the best it can, effort or monetary, that the game needs to be the best it can.In another words, the game couldnt be better than that, for the type of game the creators invisioned it, even if the budget was twice the size.Of course some Nintendo games could use the extra budget, but Mario Oddyssey, BOTW, Xenoblade Chronicles 2, Smash Ultimate, Splatoon 2, Mario Tennis Aces and so on are all "AAA" games.Even second party games or third party exclusives, like Mario + Rabbids and Octopath are AAA(even if I can see the case of Octopath being an AA game) And honestly, do you even care if a game is AAA, AA or indie if its an excellent game?I give two fucks if a game had a higher budget or not as long as Im getting the best game that developer could make.

AAA is an acronym for A lot of money, A lot of resources, A lot of time; it’s basically the videogame version of a blockbuster - and like blockbusters, just because Vertigo and Casablanca are two of the most critically acclaimed films of all time, does not make them blockbusters. You may not like it, but your alternate definition is simply not correct. I bet you’re one of the guys who tried to argue Metroid and Ocarina of Time as RPGs as well.

Last edited by Jumpin - on 18 June 2018

Angelv577 said: It was the only conference that I didn't watch and based on most feedback, I am glad I didn't watch it.

People are making it out to be worse than it really was, in terms of content it was about the same as last year except for an extra 20 minutes of Smash info which could have been saved for the Treehouse or a Smash specific Direct.

If they would have just done a 3-5 mimute trailer for Smash than it would have been pretty similar to last year.

zorg1000 said: Angelv577 said: It was the only conference that I didn't watch and based on most feedback, I am glad I didn't watch it. People are making it out to be worse than it really was, in terms of content it was about the same as last year except for an extra 20 minutes of Smash info which could have been saved for the Treehouse or a Smash specific Direct. If they would have just done a 3-5 mimute trailer for Smash than it would have been pretty similar to last year.

Seriously.  The only new thing that really made people happy about last year's E3 was a Metroid Prime 4 logo that probably only existed because Nintendo was scared that Samus Returns would get the 'Federation Force' treatment because it wasn't on the Switch and wasn't Metroid Prime 4.  Other than that, the only really big new exclusives they showed off were Kirby Star Allies, Yoshi and Mario + Rabbids and I doubt many people were ultra excited about another 2D Kirby and Yoshi game since Planet Robobot and Woolly World came out recently. I'm not saying 2018 was spectacular, I'm just saying that some people romanticize 2017's E3 because of how great BotW was, a logo and a promise from a Pokemon Company executive.

wombat123 said: zorg1000 said: People are making it out to be worse than it really was, in terms of content it was about the same as last year except for an extra 20 minutes of Smash info which could have been saved for the Treehouse or a Smash specific Direct. If they would have just done a 3-5 mimute trailer for Smash than it would have been pretty similar to last year. Seriously.  The only new thing that really made people happy about last year's E3 was a Metroid Prime 4 logo that probably only existed because Nintendo was scared that Samus Returns would get the 'Federation Force' treatment because it wasn't on the Switch and wasn't Metroid Prime 4.  Other than that, the only really big new exclusives they showed off were Kirby Star Allies, Yoshi and Mario + Rabbids and I doubt many people were ultra excited about another 2D Kirby and Yoshi game since Planet Robobot and Woolly World came out recently. I'm not saying 2018 was spectacular, I'm just saying that some people romanticize 2017's E3 because of how great BotW was, a logo and a promise from a Pokemon Company executive.

The significance of what E3 2017 showed also holds weight I think. The Pokemon Switch announcement ment more than just the game itself, it put an end to all the questioning and doubts on whether the Switch was the 3DS successor. People probably count Samus Returns, which combined with the Prime 4 announcement showed that the series is not dead afterall. Still I gave the presentation a 7/10, good but not great, though I can definitely understand people who rate it higher. I might give whatever presentation confirms Animal Crossing isn't dead a 10/10 myself hehe.

wombat123 said: zorg1000 said: People are making it out to be worse than it really was, in terms of content it was about the same as last year except for an extra 20 minutes of Smash info which could have been saved for the Treehouse or a Smash specific Direct. If they would have just done a 3-5 mimute trailer for Smash than it would have been pretty similar to last year. Seriously.  The only new thing that really made people happy about last year's E3 was a Metroid Prime 4 logo that probably only existed because Nintendo was scared that Samus Returns would get the 'Federation Force' treatment because it wasn't on the Switch and wasn't Metroid Prime 4.  Other than that, the only really big new exclusives they showed off were Kirby Star Allies, Yoshi and Mario + Rabbids and I doubt many people were ultra excited about another 2D Kirby and Yoshi game since Planet Robobot and Woolly World came out recently. I'm not saying 2018 was spectacular, I'm just saying that some people romanticize 2017's E3 because of how great BotW was, a logo and a promise from a Pokemon Company executive.

I agree, this year wasnt amazing but people are acting like it was terrible and last year was the greatest thing ever when they were pretty similar. Here is a breakdown of each year.

 

2017

Compilation of upcoming multiplayer titles (ARMS, Splatoon, Pokken, FIFA and reveal of Rocket League)

Xenoblade 2 trailer

Kirby reveal and trailer

Pokemon in development, no footage or details

Metroid Prime 4 logo, no footage or details

Yoshi reveal and trailer

Fire Emblem Warriors trailer

Breath of the Wild DLC

Mario+Rabbids reveal and trailer

Mario Odyssey trailer

 

2018

Daemon x Machina reveal and trailer

Xenoblade 2 DLC

Pokemon Lets Go trailer

Mario Party reveal and trailer

Fire Emblem first trailer

Fortnite reveal and trailer

Overcooked 2 reveal and trailer

Queen Killer reveal and trailer

Compilation of various upcoming titles (ARK, Octo Expansion, Mario Tennis, Wolfenstein, Dragon Ball,  Wasteland etc)

Smash Bros first trailer

Jumpin said: Nautilus said: No offence, but goddammit, what a twisted view of what an AAA game, or rather a high profile game, should be.Honestly, there is not much to say to out other than everything you just said is wrong.Being a high profile game is not about burning money on a game that dosent require such investment to be the best it can, rather that the developer thats behind it gives the best it can, effort or monetary, that the game needs to be the best it can.In another words, the game couldnt be better than that, for the type of game the creators invisioned it, even if the budget was twice the size.Of course some Nintendo games could use the extra budget, but Mario Oddyssey, BOTW, Xenoblade Chronicles 2, Smash Ultimate, Splatoon 2, Mario Tennis Aces and so on are all "AAA" games.Even second party games or third party exclusives, like Mario + Rabbids and Octopath are AAA(even if I can see the case of Octopath being an AA game) And honestly, do you even care if a game is AAA, AA or indie if its an excellent game?I give two fucks if a game had a higher budget or not as long as Im getting the best game that developer could make. AAA is an acronym for A lot of money, A lot of resources, A lot of time; it’s basically the videogame version of a blockbuster - and like blockbusters, just because Vertigo and Casablanca are two of the most critically acclaimed films of all time, does not make them blockbusters. You may not like it, but your alternate definition is simply not correct. I bet you’re one of the guys who tried to argue Metroid and Ocarina of Time as RPGs as well.

LOL

Please.

Honestly, AAA is as much of a reliable term as exclusive is nowadays: its significance is bend over backwards depending on the agenda and/or what the company/gamer is defending.Or also depending on the mood of a fanbase and/or someone.If that company is winning or in their favour, they will sing with all the air on their lungs and preach like its the absolute truth that word and its meaning.If thats not the case, then they will say how useless and meaningless AAA/indies/exclusives/RPG/shooters are and how they dont mean what they mean and so on.

People are singing this tune now because Nintendo didnt deliver as they did last year.But when Smash releases, when Pokemon Lets Go does better than people expect, when 2019 is not the doom and gloom like some(not all) are saying its going to be, all this "worrying" will change yet again like it always does.And to be blunt, thats not exclusive to Nintendo, though its more proeminent with them.Same happens with Sony and MS when they are a bit under the weather.

People are so predictable.

Oh and just a sidenote:The other reason that Nintendo presentation this year wasnt all that big its because more than half of it was leaked to hell and back.While it still wouldnt be as good as last year, a surprise announcement of Fortnite and its shadow drop, along with DB Fighters Z, Overcooked 2, the smaller indie stuff could have easily made people less salty about the presentation.Wouldnt make it better than last year, but it would make it better.Just saying.

Nautilus said: Oh and just a sidenote:The other reason that Nintendo presentation this year wasnt all that big its because more than half of it was leaked to hell and back.While it still wouldnt be as good as last year, a surprise announcement of Fortnite and its shadow drop, along with DB Fighters Z, Overcooked 2, the smaller indie stuff could have easily made people less salty about the presentation.Wouldnt make it better than last year, but it would make it better.Just saying.

Hardly, atleast that wouldn't have made a difference to me. Fire Emblem n Yoshi still delayed with Yoshi not even shown, Smash would still get an underwhelming and overly long reveal, more time would still be lost showing off $50 dlc for Let's Go, and Mario Party would remain as the only new announcement from Nintendo while Animal Crossing is vaporware for all we know.

Thats your opinion, I think Nintendo won E3 last year, they should several new games

zorg1000 said: wombat123 said: Seriously.  The only new thing that really made people happy about last year's E3 was a Metroid Prime 4 logo that probably only existed because Nintendo was scared that Samus Returns would get the 'Federation Force' treatment because it wasn't on the Switch and wasn't Metroid Prime 4.  Other than that, the only really big new exclusives they showed off were Kirby Star Allies, Yoshi and Mario + Rabbids and I doubt many people were ultra excited about another 2D Kirby and Yoshi game since Planet Robobot and Woolly World came out recently. I'm not saying 2018 was spectacular, I'm just saying that some people romanticize 2017's E3 because of how great BotW was, a logo and a promise from a Pokemon Company executive. I agree, this year wasnt amazing but people are acting like it was terrible and last year was the greatest thing ever when they were pretty similar. Here is a breakdown of each year.   2017 Compilation of upcoming multiplayer titles (ARMS, Splatoon, Pokken, FIFA and reveal of Rocket League) Xenoblade 2 trailer Kirby reveal and trailer Pokemon in development, no footage or details Metroid Prime 4 logo, no footage or details Yoshi reveal and trailer Fire Emblem Warriors trailer Breath of the Wild DLC Mario+Rabbids reveal and trailer Mario Odyssey trailer   2018 Daemon x Machina reveal and trailer Xenoblade 2 DLC Pokemon Lets Go trailer Mario Party reveal and trailer Fire Emblem first trailer Fortnite reveal and trailer Overcooked 2 reveal and trailer Queen Killer reveal and trailer Compilation of various upcoming titles (ARK, Octo Expansion, Mario Tennis, Wolfenstein, Dragon Ball,  Wasteland etc) Smash Bros first trailer

It's interesting looking back on E3 2017's presentation. While it was nice that Metroid Prime 4 and Pokemon RPG were confirmed, it does fall into the trap of either having a logo or a CGI trailer for a game that may not release within 1-2 years like games we've maligned in the past (i.e., Kingdom Hearts 3, Final Fantasy VII R, Shenmue 3, Last Guardian, Crackdown 3, etc.). So while it created buzz, it's a little bit of a cheese considering we may not hear anything of Prime 4 until next year.

With E3 2018, we had some of the games, that were presented in Nintendo's Direct, leaked (DBFZ, Fortnite, Paladins, Killer Queen Black, etc.) so the surprise factor (which may have not been that big of a surprise since there were rumors of some of these games being developed for Switch earlier) was gone. It was like the E3 2015 Smash Direct when Ryu and Roy were leaked through someone hacking into Smash 4's update and finding all of the assets. While it was a good Smash Direct, the surprise factor was gone and we were like, "cool, they are in the game now," instead of ,"Holy $%#& Roy's back!" and "RYU?!?! How the $%&# did he get in???"

Though I am happy Xenoblade 2 has made a presence in both E3s and has garnered commercial and critical success, especially for a niche franchise in which the first game barely made it to the West by the time the Wii was making it's final curtain call.

To me, though, even though Smash's presentation was over 25 minutes long, I think it stands with Super Mario Odyssey's E3 trailer as some of the most incredible stuff I've seen from Nintendo, or any other company that presented, in the past few E3s. I cannot believe that every character is back (especially Snake). This sets up more incredible dream match-ups that no other video game crossover could imagine having (though maybe Project X Zone 1 and 2 could contend). As a long-time Smash Bros. fan, I am elated and excited to play this game, especially since they've added so many new elements to the gameplay and tweaked most (if not all) of the characters from the games of the past (whether it be Smash 4, Brawl, or Melee). It may look like an enhanced port of Smash 4 to some, but from the gameplay I've seen and the content that is presented (and yet to be presented), it looks to be so much more than a mere enhanced port. I've seen so many reaction videos of the Smash trailer and its presentation and its pretty amazing how many people are shocked, excited, and happy to see such a legendary roster.