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Forums - Politics Discussion - Trump pulls out of Iran nuclear agreement

"Trump pulls out" And this time he didn't even walk away with $130,000 bill and a bad case of herpes.

Although, as usual, Trump reeks of piss.

Last edited by Jumpin - on 09 May 2018

I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

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setsunatenshi said:
thismeintiel said:

Sure. That's why Iran can delay inspections, as well as giving them at least a few weeks notice before we even attempt to enter the country to inspect. And not all sites are inspected. We also gave them $1.7B. Supposedly, we owed them for weapons we never delivered. Of course, there's a reason they were never delivered.

And no, your analogy is a very poor one. A more accurate one would be the government freezing the assets of a known kingpin because he is getting those funds illegally, like drugs and selling weapons to local gangs, who then use them to terrorize the surrounding community. Then, they unfreeze them because he pinkie promises not to do it anymore, plus if we inform him within 24 days (not even hours) of an inspection, we are allowed to look at some of his warehouses. Oh, and he can delay the inspection up to a few months. You know he can hide a lot of evidence if you're giving that much time, plus only allowed to go to certain areas of his business. 

#1 the assets were Iran's, period. 

#2 Iran has followed the agreement to the letter. An agreement that meant losing the barganing chip of a nuclear program. 

#3 the current US president unilaterally decided to terminate the agreement. this was not caused by iran or any other 3rd party. it was exclusively trump's decision with absolutely no justification

#4 there's nothing in the agreement about any pinky promisses. international independent scientists have confirmed over and over again that no nuclear program is in place

#5 a uranium enrichment program is not something you can hide easily. the IAEA scientists would report any questionnable behavior if this was to happen. and finally,

#6 iran has now no incentive to abide by the agreement and stop the nuclear program from going forward. the agreement we had was pretty much the best possible one. nothing short of an all out war could prevent them from achieving their goal. and if this happens you can 100% blame that orange retard. the world better cross their fingers it will never go that far because this could really be the start of ww3. and this time the US would be on the wrong side

#1: So?  Are you saying that I should be able to make money, whether it be from ill-gotten gains or not, and use it to terrorize you and your family, without any repercussions whatsoever?  Just because those funds were technically mine to begin with?

#2: Sure...

#3: That's funny, I don't recall the representatives of the people being allowed to vote on this deal in the first place.  But, I guess when it was Obama deciding things, it doesn't matter if the people get a say.

#4:  Yes.  In the specific places they are allowed to inspect.  Weeks/months after they announce they wish to inspect them.  Great system there. /s

#5:  I guess its a good thing for Iran that the inspectors can only go where Iran wants them to, huh?

#6:  The agreement was the best possible one for Iran.  They have access to all of their assets, now.  Inspectors only get to look at certain locations, when Iran says its okay to do so, which apparently is good enough for naive people to fully accept that Iran is abiding by the deal.  War was/is/will be the only thing to truly stop them.  They are the #1 sponsor of terrorism, after all.  And now with more assets, they can continue to do so more easily.



Not legally binding and they wouldn't let us check whenever or wherever we wanted ? Well, this was a pretty stupid deal after all since there was absolutely no way to prove that they weren't secretly developing nuclear weapons ...

If Iran was truly adamant on proving that they weren't developing or had already developed nuclear weapons then I'm sure making their military bases transparent for inspection purposes wouldn't be that much of a hassle, now would it ?



HollyGamer said:
Wyrdness said:

Shia muslim groups have gained strong footholds since the Arab Spring movement and the US wars, in Lebanon for example Shias now have a significant influence in parliament, in Iraq Saddam's removal increased Iran's influence in the region, Syria is Iranian backed and aided by Shia groups, Yemen continues to battle Saudi Arabia etc... The Sunni's influence has taken a hit in recent years increasing Iran's influence.

Iran are one of the few Muslim countries who are mainly Shia Muslims most of the middle east were Sunni but since a number of significant leaders have been toppled Shia groups have began gaining influence.

Not all country you mention are totally gained influence from the Rafida.  Some coutry are still at war, it's called proxy war. Yaman is still in war and not yet fall in the hand of shia  , Syrian  still got a lot of sunny rebellion (FSA) except ISIS which is a mafia that not fight for SUNNI nor Shia. Iraq probably yes they got influenced and also Qatar.  One more countries which is Bahrain should be on the list, but politically the are with the Saudi. 

Yemen is not fully in the hands of the Shia but they're backed heavily by Iran against the Saudis while Syria is an issue because Assad is backed by Iran and Russia and its their support that has helped his regime gain the upper hand, forgot about Bahrain and Qatar which adds further problems especially the latter.

The problem here is the Saudis grip on the region and their ties with the US is increasing their enemies and Iran backs their adversaries.



Now nothing is stopping them from continuing their nuclear program. I'm sure upstanding Russia and China will keep them in check though...



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Superman4 said:

No, You can than Obama for giving them millions.Just lie you can than all the other presidents for NK getting nukes. Trump is the reason they will get rid of them.

You mean giving them millions that we owed them? That was their money. It wasn't a gift. 



thismeintiel said:

They are the #1 sponsor of terrorism, after all.  And now with more assets, they can continue to do so more easily.

That's by the US's really fucked up definition of terrorism. In reality, Iran is the #1 sponsor of counter-terrorism. Their sponsored militaries have been the primary forces fighting against ISIS and other radical terrorists in the Middle East.

Meanwhile, the US is supplying Saudi Arabia with billions of dollars in weaponry; the homeland of Osama Bin Laden and the people who hijacked the planes that flew into your World Trade Center buildings.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/isis-us-saudi-arabia-arms-fighters-jihadis-military-capability-enhanced-weapons-syria-terrorism-a8112076.html

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/12/isil-weapons-traced-saudi-arabia-171214164431586.html - even Al Jazeera admits that the Saudis supplied ISIS.

That's the issue with the US, you guys don't know anything about the Middle East, and everything you do keeps making terrorism and war worse and worse, and it's largely the fault of your Republican leaders; particularly Reagan, Bush, W Bush, and now TGrump.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Trump is the gift that keeps on giving. Trump is either an evil genius or a bumbling idiot.

Last edited by Dark_Lord_2008 - on 09 May 2018

thismeintiel said:
setsunatenshi said:

#1 the assets were Iran's, period. 

#2 Iran has followed the agreement to the letter. An agreement that meant losing the barganing chip of a nuclear program. 

#3 the current US president unilaterally decided to terminate the agreement. this was not caused by iran or any other 3rd party. it was exclusively trump's decision with absolutely no justification

#4 there's nothing in the agreement about any pinky promisses. international independent scientists have confirmed over and over again that no nuclear program is in place

#5 a uranium enrichment program is not something you can hide easily. the IAEA scientists would report any questionnable behavior if this was to happen. and finally,

#6 iran has now no incentive to abide by the agreement and stop the nuclear program from going forward. the agreement we had was pretty much the best possible one. nothing short of an all out war could prevent them from achieving their goal. and if this happens you can 100% blame that orange retard. the world better cross their fingers it will never go that far because this could really be the start of ww3. and this time the US would be on the wrong side

#1: So?  Are you saying that I should be able to make money, whether it be from ill-gotten gains or not, and use it to terrorize you and your family, without any repercussions whatsoever?  Just because those funds were technically mine to begin with?

#2: Sure...

#3: That's funny, I don't recall the representatives of the people being allowed to vote on this deal in the first place.  But, I guess when it was Obama deciding things, it doesn't matter if the people get a say.

#4:  Yes.  In the specific places they are allowed to inspect.  Weeks/months after they announce they wish to inspect them.  Great system there. /s

#5:  I guess its a good thing for Iran that the inspectors can only go where Iran wants them to, huh?

#6:  The agreement was the best possible one for Iran.  They have access to all of their assets, now.  Inspectors only get to look at certain locations, when Iran says its okay to do so, which apparently is good enough for naive people to fully accept that Iran is abiding by the deal.  War was/is/will be the only thing to truly stop them.  They are the #1 sponsor of terrorism, after all.  And now with more assets, they can continue to do so more easily.

1- so according to youe logic it's ok to steal other people's money if you "claim" they are terrorizing you? especially when they have literally no way of hitting you in any shape or form plus you have the best defense capabilities in the world and nuclear weaponry to blow the entire planet 10 times over? yeah... poor you...

2- exactly... 

3- you don't have direct democracy there, your elected leaders have signed the agreement which pretty much the entire international community praised. in this case the retarded orange ripped the agreement unilaterally, thus painting the US as the de facto bad guy in this whole story. so he's got every right to do so, just like the Obama admn had to sign the agreement in the first place. both will be criticized accordingly and the consequences will come from it

4- they were inspecting every month and making sure the agreement was being followed. literally no one has complained about it. just step bavk for a moment if you will. no sovereign nation has to give access for foreing inspection of military instalations. i'm pretty sure you'd have questions if outsiders wanted to just walk in to top secret military instalations in the US. and as far as I know the US actually has a nuclear weapon program that the current administration is on the record saying they wanted to EXPAND. how the fuck is thst ok?

5- bullshit and read 4- again

6- bullshit again, the agreement was the best possible for EVERYONE. Hence why the US is the only one trying to back up from it. now I expect the EU to keep honoring the agreement as well as china and russia. as the US has no trade with Iran, nothing really will affect them. the only option the US has to enforce the sanctions is to try and force europe, china and russia to do so. what now? are you goibg to point nukes to Paris, Berlin, Moscow and Beijing? congratulations to trump by making the US look like assholes yet again. such assholery level wasn't achieved since the Iraq WMD debacle. 



thismeintiel said:
setsunatenshi said:

#1 the assets were Iran's, period. 

#2 Iran has followed the agreement to the letter. An agreement that meant losing the barganing chip of a nuclear program. 

#3 the current US president unilaterally decided to terminate the agreement. this was not caused by iran or any other 3rd party. it was exclusively trump's decision with absolutely no justification

#4 there's nothing in the agreement about any pinky promisses. international independent scientists have confirmed over and over again that no nuclear program is in place

#5 a uranium enrichment program is not something you can hide easily. the IAEA scientists would report any questionnable behavior if this was to happen. and finally,

#6 iran has now no incentive to abide by the agreement and stop the nuclear program from going forward. the agreement we had was pretty much the best possible one. nothing short of an all out war could prevent them from achieving their goal. and if this happens you can 100% blame that orange retard. the world better cross their fingers it will never go that far because this could really be the start of ww3. and this time the US would be on the wrong side

#1: So?  Are you saying that I should be able to make money, whether it be from ill-gotten gains or not, and use it to terrorize you and your family, without any repercussions whatsoever?  Just because those funds were technically mine to begin with?

#2: Sure...

#3: That's funny, I don't recall the representatives of the people being allowed to vote on this deal in the first place.  But, I guess when it was Obama deciding things, it doesn't matter if the people get a say.

#4:  Yes.  In the specific places they are allowed to inspect.  Weeks/months after they announce they wish to inspect them.  Great system there. /s

#5:  I guess its a good thing for Iran that the inspectors can only go where Iran wants them to, huh?

#6:  The agreement was the best possible one for Iran.  They have access to all of their assets, now.  Inspectors only get to look at certain locations, when Iran says its okay to do so, which apparently is good enough for naive people to fully accept that Iran is abiding by the deal.  War was/is/will be the only thing to truly stop them.  They are the #1 sponsor of terrorism, after all.  And now with more assets, they can continue to do so more easily.

1. How about we take away your money and see if you're happy. Really, when did Iran terrorise anybody since Hassan took office?

2. UN, several European secret services, NSA and DOD all saying Iran is complying. But let's take the word of a notorious compulsive liar over all of them.

3.Well, it got debated and adapted  for 4 years starting the negotiations in Geneva 2009 between all the signatories of the treaty (the P5+1, being the  permanent UN members + Germany; Germany is on board because the nuclear tech in Iran is german, which stems from Germany being one of Irans biggest trade partners) minus Iran itself , who could only accept or reject it. Trump didn't, he just pulled the plug. Anouncing to do something and discussing it between some group of people to reach a consensus ain't the same thing.

4. They can inspect everything whenever they want to, what you are alluding to is the situation before the treaty - and now certainly also after the treaty unless the rest of the world continues without the US

5. Even then, enrichment facilities are huge and can't be hidden because of pretty distinct shapes. The world would know if they would be doing it from satellite imagery alone. The one underground facility is open to public since it has since become a private research facility for exploration of stable transuranium isotopes. Building a new one would be taking very long and obvious with nowadays satellite technology (tons of trucks driving out a mountain is obvious on the imagery nowadays, not so much 20 years ago when the cameras where much weaker)

6. Iran could keep part of the facilities and lost all the sanctions. I agree it was a good deal for them, but that's also part of the point: Why would they want to risk that deal by not fully collaborating with the west? Hence why inspectors can come and go now whenever they want to. But with the US withdrawing and putting back their sanctions, there's no reason anymore for Iran to comply as the US sanctions where the largest of the bunch.

Sanctions, btw, can be very counterproductive at times. When the great recession hit the world in 1929, nobody was trading with the soviets who as a result didn't got hit at all by the crisis. Iran was in a similar position in 2008, and most of the goods Iran traded for before the sanctions are getting replaced with some produced in Iran, lessening the effect of sanctions along the way.