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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Capcom: Japanese devs 'delighted' with Sony's wands; Expect Wii Ports

whatever on 16 September 2009

Both the PS3 wand and Natal are going to be brutal failures. There is no way there will be any major adoption of either this far into the generation.



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bardicverse on 16 September 2009

Interesting, as there seems to be one fatal flaw with porting Wii games to PS3 - No nunchuck. So I guess this would be ok for games that only use the main wii-remote, which generally are all the really basic shovelware games.

So shovelware for PS3 confirmed, is what I get out of this news. I wouldn't exactly call that good news.



scottie on 16 September 2009
sc94597 said:
scottie said:

A remake isn't a port. Why would I think that? Because you are remaking the game. A port is taking essentially the same game and putting it on another console. People who already own the original buy remakes much more often than ports. So they aren't the same thing. Also I was making a generalization, a few exceptions from the largest gaming franchise of all time, and another large franchise doesn't prove any point other than that large franchises sell no matter what. Even then they sold much less than newly made titles fromt he series on the DS. Monster Hunter is an example of the values of a game being changed to sell more, and Grand Theft Auto another example of a large franchise. I tell you this. Look at the sales of Tales of Eternia(Psp), and Star Ocean 2 compared to the originals. How about Chrono Trigger DS? On a handheld where porting a game is probably just as expensive as half of making one, you don't see much reason to port anymore. That is why they "remake" them. This is even more true if you talk about current generation games.Like always there are exceptions though, such as Disgaea.

Console ports seem to sell much more though. Look at Resident Evil 4 Wii Edition. It is on track to outsell the Gamecube version. How about Okami? It at least matched the sales of the PS2 game.  A great example of a game that shows that porting doesn't work to well on handhelds is Manhunt 2(Wii Version) compared to the orignal PS2 Version, and the PSP Version. It sold 240k on Wii, 270k on PS2, and a measly 30k+(no Japanese Data, Wasn't released in Others) on PSP. I think that it is because some games work better on consoles. When you port it to a handheld it may be the same in content, but it isn't the same experience. This also goes the other way around too. So the ports that do work, have to translate to handhelds. Which gets back to my point, they are entirely different experiences so you need to compensate for the experience. When you compensate for the experience it isn't a port anymore because the original content would have to be changed to a large degree.

Some of them are remakes, that is true.

 

As for the 'console ports sell well' point. All you showed is that the Wii is better at selling certain types of games than the GC and the PS2. That has nothing to do with original/port



tombi123 on 16 September 2009

Okami PS3



Staude on 16 September 2009
sc94597 said:
Staude said:
woopah said:
i dont understand this idea that wii games are equal to PSN games. also although the sony wands had motion i remember the pointing to be no where near as good as IR

Wat ? it's much more precise. And I don't know of any wii games that should release on the ps3 as full priced games. In general the expanded technology allows you for more so the games of the wii feels more limited when you play them. Atleast that's my experience.

 

Sub Pixel Accuracy !

 

Not to mention it has more motion detecting gadgets than the wii mote (inside the wands)

 

And ! Look when hes writing their name. That's fucking accurate.

Sub millimeter not Sub Pixel. Millimeter>Pixel by a lot. It looks to me that everything in that video can be done with WM+. As of right now they seem pretty much the same in functionality. So neither of them is more precise from the looks of both of them.

"...The biggest difference between our device and any other device that I've ever seen is we get such accurate position data from the camera. So, especially where in the image it is, we get down to a really sub-pixel level, so we can get very very precise position information, and that's something that people really haven't been able to do before. So that new capability, mixed with all the angle capability that other people have also worked on, really gives you a complete system and that's kind of the first time that we've seen a complete description of position and rotation."

http://ps3.kombo.com/article.php?artid=10773

Sub

“What you see on screen will actually match the movements your making at home down to a sub-pixel accuracy.”

http://videogamesrepublic.com/?p=8442

Pixel

Accuracy.

 

Also it has rumble. Which is neat. And it doesn't just define where it is in full 3d but also the angle of the device.



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the_bloodwalker on 16 September 2009
whatever said:
Both the PS3 wand and Natal are going to be brutal failures. There is no way there will be any major adoption of either this far into the generation.

I belive Natal will do much better for PC applications and will suvive well there. On gaming it will prove quite hard to do a high budget title, probably will do well on XBLA.

The PS3 wand will face a lot of issues, first because the console owners are already used to the dualshock 3 and prefer the games on with that input, so games will come with the tow options (wand and dualshock) which will kill the mommentum; the second is the lack of experience developers have in motion controllers. If thay couldn't even get it right on the Wii, that without WM+ has many limitations, how can they nail it from the start with the wand?.... it will be a slow process, not an explosion. But will not exceed what many fanboys predict



the_bloodwalker on 16 September 2009
Soriku said:
the_bloodwalker said:
whatever said:
Both the PS3 wand and Natal are going to be brutal failures. There is no way there will be any major adoption of either this far into the generation.

I belive Natal will do much better for PC applications and will suvive well there. On gaming it will prove quite hard to do a high budget title, probably will do well on XBLA.

The PS3 wand will face a lot of issues, first because the console owners are already used to the dualshock 3 and prefer the games on with that input, so games will come with the tow options (wand and dualshock) which will kill the mommentum; the second is the lack of experience developers have in motion controllers. If thay couldn't even get it right on the Wii, that without WM+ has many limitations, how can they nail it from the start with the wand?.... it will be a slow process, not an explosion. But will not exceed what many fanboys predict


And the third is you can't even move by yourself. I still think the Wand is stupid. Natal isn't too bad though.

That can be fixed with a thumbstick, which is why I didn't include it.



sc94597 on 16 September 2009
scottie said:
sc94597 said:
scottie said:
 

A remake isn't a port. Why would I think that? Because you are remaking the game. A port is taking essentially the same game and putting it on another console. People who already own the original buy remakes much more often than ports. So they aren't the same thing. Also I was making a generalization, a few exceptions from the largest gaming franchise of all time, and another large franchise doesn't prove any point other than that large franchises sell no matter what. Even then they sold much less than newly made titles fromt he series on the DS. Monster Hunter is an example of the values of a game being changed to sell more, and Grand Theft Auto another example of a large franchise. I tell you this. Look at the sales of Tales of Eternia(Psp), and Star Ocean 2 compared to the originals. How about Chrono Trigger DS? On a handheld where porting a game is probably just as expensive as half of making one, you don't see much reason to port anymore. That is why they "remake" them. This is even more true if you talk about current generation games.Like always there are exceptions though, such as Disgaea.

Console ports seem to sell much more though. Look at Resident Evil 4 Wii Edition. It is on track to outsell the Gamecube version. How about Okami? It at least matched the sales of the PS2 game.  A great example of a game that shows that porting doesn't work to well on handhelds is Manhunt 2(Wii Version) compared to the orignal PS2 Version, and the PSP Version. It sold 240k on Wii, 270k on PS2, and a measly 30k+(no Japanese Data, Wasn't released in Others) on PSP. I think that it is because some games work better on consoles. When you port it to a handheld it may be the same in content, but it isn't the same experience. This also goes the other way around too. So the ports that do work, have to translate to handhelds. Which gets back to my point, they are entirely different experiences so you need to compensate for the experience. When you compensate for the experience it isn't a port anymore because the original content would have to be changed to a large degree.

Some of them are remakes, that is true.

 

As for the 'console ports sell well' point. All you showed is that the Wii is better at selling certain types of games than the GC and the PS2. That has nothing to do with original/port

Even then that is stretching it. Am I suppose to believe that a late port on the Wii sells just as good  or more than the original versions because the Wii sells games better, but that isn't the case for the handhelds? I also showed an example, Manhunt 2 sold much closer on Wii than it did on PSP despite both of them being ports.

 

 

@Staude I see some inconsistency in their statements. The one guy in the first video states sub-millimeter and the other sub-pixel? Also Wii motion plus measures angle as well.

Edit: Tombi, can't you already play okami on PS3? I never tried it when I borrowed the PS2 version. I know some games don't work right.



Staude on 16 September 2009
Soriku said:
the_bloodwalker said:
whatever said:
Both the PS3 wand and Natal are going to be brutal failures. There is no way there will be any major adoption of either this far into the generation.

I belive Natal will do much better for PC applications and will suvive well there. On gaming it will prove quite hard to do a high budget title, probably will do well on XBLA.

The PS3 wand will face a lot of issues, first because the console owners are already used to the dualshock 3 and prefer the games on with that input, so games will come with the tow options (wand and dualshock) which will kill the mommentum; the second is the lack of experience developers have in motion controllers. If thay couldn't even get it right on the Wii, that without WM+ has many limitations, how can they nail it from the start with the wand?.... it will be a slow process, not an explosion. But will not exceed what many fanboys predict


And the third is you can't even move by yourself. I still think the Wand is stupid. Natal isn't too bad though.

Well concidering the wand can do everything the wii can do and more, you must think the wii is stupid too.. Then why do you have one .. not to mention praise it in this on going discussion of dominance on these and other forums ?



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Staude on 16 September 2009
sc94597 said:
scottie said:
sc94597 said:
scottie said:
 

A remake isn't a port. Why would I think that? Because you are remaking the game. A port is taking essentially the same game and putting it on another console. People who already own the original buy remakes much more often than ports. So they aren't the same thing. Also I was making a generalization, a few exceptions from the largest gaming franchise of all time, and another large franchise doesn't prove any point other than that large franchises sell no matter what. Even then they sold much less than newly made titles fromt he series on the DS. Monster Hunter is an example of the values of a game being changed to sell more, and Grand Theft Auto another example of a large franchise. I tell you this. Look at the sales of Tales of Eternia(Psp), and Star Ocean 2 compared to the originals. How about Chrono Trigger DS? On a handheld where porting a game is probably just as expensive as half of making one, you don't see much reason to port anymore. That is why they "remake" them. This is even more true if you talk about current generation games.Like always there are exceptions though, such as Disgaea.

Console ports seem to sell much more though. Look at Resident Evil 4 Wii Edition. It is on track to outsell the Gamecube version. How about Okami? It at least matched the sales of the PS2 game.  A great example of a game that shows that porting doesn't work to well on handhelds is Manhunt 2(Wii Version) compared to the orignal PS2 Version, and the PSP Version. It sold 240k on Wii, 270k on PS2, and a measly 30k+(no Japanese Data, Wasn't released in Others) on PSP. I think that it is because some games work better on consoles. When you port it to a handheld it may be the same in content, but it isn't the same experience. This also goes the other way around too. So the ports that do work, have to translate to handhelds. Which gets back to my point, they are entirely different experiences so you need to compensate for the experience. When you compensate for the experience it isn't a port anymore because the original content would have to be changed to a large degree.

Some of them are remakes, that is true.

 

As for the 'console ports sell well' point. All you showed is that the Wii is better at selling certain types of games than the GC and the PS2. That has nothing to do with original/port

Even then that is stretching it. Am I suppose to believe that a late port on the Wii sells just as good  or more than the original versions because the Wii sells games better, but that isn't the case for the handhelds? I also showed an example, Manhunt 2 sold much closer on Wii than it did on PSP despite both of them being ports.

 

 

@Staude I see some inconsistency in their statements. The one guy in the first video states sub-millimeter and the other sub-pixel? Also Wii motion plus measures angle as well.

Edit: Tombi, can't you already play okami on PS3? I never tried it when I borrowed the PS2 version. I know some games don't work right.

Well concidering a pixel is sub millimeter i see no problem with that statement :p



Check out my game about moles ^