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Final-Fan on 17 January 2009

I have to side against you on this akuma587 in that the abortion question depends on at what point the fetus can be considered a person.

mrstickball, I find it ridiculous that you attempt to discredit an opposing argument by pointing out that some of the people giving it are activists, and then give a source like that one to justify your own position. And that's leaving aside the fact that it was ad hominem in the first place.



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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

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The Ghost of RubangB on 17 January 2009

Pro-Choice.



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akuma587 on 17 January 2009
Final-Fan said:
I have to side against you on this akuma587 in that the abortion question depends on at what point the fetus can be considered a person.

mrstickball, I find it ridiculous that you attempt to discredit an opposing argument by pointing out that some of the people giving it are activists, and then give a source like that one to justify your own position. And that's leaving aside the fact that it was ad hominem in the first place.

The abortion question has always been about both science and constitutional freedom.  That's how Roe v. Wade was decided.  The two are inextricable from each other on the abortion issue.  The Supreme Court looked at the historical treatment of abortion by the judicial system and by the legislature and they also looked at what the medical profession thought about abortion.  You can read the opinion yourself.

http://www.tourolaw.edu/Patch/Roe/

Anytime the abortion issue comes to court it always involves a combination of 1) Constitutional freedoms and 2) Science.  I didn't just pull those categories out of thin air.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

L.C.E.C. on 17 January 2009

Pro-Life, and proud of it...




Final-Fan on 17 January 2009

Right, but I think that most of these debates (including this one) are more concerned with the morality than the legality, in which case the constitutional angle is considerably less important. Particularly in a forum like this where many people may not even be in the USA.



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
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I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

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Lolcislaw on 17 January 2009

Personally im against abortion, but i do respect other peoples choices in life, therefore im pro choice, even when im against abortion itself.

What pisses me off to certain extent that abortion is seen as only womens choice, and there is nothing that father can do in a situation when woman decides to get abortion, i know its her body (and thats how abortion is justified)but the child inside is not her property, but a man is still denied any chance of protecting it. For me ideal situation would be if that would be legalised but with consent of two parents, people should be responsible for choices they make and unwanted pregnancy is one of the consequences in life



SnesTea on 18 January 2009
Rath said:
@MrStickBall.
Prove it. Prove that an unborn fetus is a person.

You can't because there is no universal definition of what constitutes a person. To a very large number of people a fetus isn't a person any more than a blood cell is a person.

Your black people argument is a straw man. Nobody here is debating whether black people are people (and I hope nobody believes they are not) and proving that black people are people does not prove the fetus' are people. Its an entirely different situation.

@Snesboy. So you think its right that because a person made a moronic decision that their entire life should be utterly fucked over? I can understand the argument against abortion that its killing a person (because many people believe that a person is from conception) but I'd hope that most pro-lifers don't think its good for peoples lives to be wrecked as a punishment for a bad decision.

Yes. I do. Piss on society. I hate everything but I believe even fetus' should have a shot at life so I can hate them too.

 



super_etecoon on 18 January 2009

rofl...because Mr.Spock deleted his account all the tallies are gone for this thread.

Good riddance.



Rath on 18 January 2009
Snesboy said:
Rath said:
@MrStickBall.
Prove it. Prove that an unborn fetus is a person.

You can't because there is no universal definition of what constitutes a person. To a very large number of people a fetus isn't a person any more than a blood cell is a person.

Your black people argument is a straw man. Nobody here is debating whether black people are people (and I hope nobody believes they are not) and proving that black people are people does not prove the fetus' are people. Its an entirely different situation.

@Snesboy. So you think its right that because a person made a moronic decision that their entire life should be utterly fucked over? I can understand the argument against abortion that its killing a person (because many people believe that a person is from conception) but I'd hope that most pro-lifers don't think its good for peoples lives to be wrecked as a punishment for a bad decision.

Yes. I do. Piss on society. I hate everything but I believe even fetus' should have a shot at life so I can hate them too.

 

Oh, ok then. Awesome.

 



SnesTea on 18 January 2009
super_etecoon said:
rofl...because Mr.Spock deleted his account all the tallies are gone for this thread.

Good riddance.

 

 

what's that supposed to mean?