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Forums - Gaming - What does it even mean to “own” a video game?

firebush03 said:
Chrkeller said:

I like having fun with the whole PC master race, but for me it is more of a joke.  Mainly because while PC is superior, it gets decimated for bang for buck.  Sure, my rig significantly outperforms a ps5 pro, but it was also 5x more expensive.  Bang for buck, consoles win by a massive margin. 

As for digital, I just don't like dealing with physical, because I am lazy and my wife doesn't like clutter.    

IMO PC has far FAR more bang for its buck than something like a PS5. Windows has an Xbox Mode, meaning that right off the bat you’ve already saved $700USD. And then there’s ease of emulation, free online, a massive supply of cloud storage for save data (which isn’t tied to ToS of a games provider… meaning far less liklihood of losing all your save data and/or ROM/ISO files), universal backwards compatibility with QoL enhancements such as 244FPS 1440p, realistic CRT filters (so no need for a CRT), cheap Steam releases, as well as…erm…free access to really any game from any system released prior to 2020, AND it makes life significantly easier. As somebody who frequently uses my PC for studies/work, I cannot even begin to express how convenient it is to not have my PC overheating and crashing with more than two tabs open at a given time lol.

For gamers, myself included, that do a lot of things, yeah fair point.  A PC offers tons of emulation (don't need to pay for Nintendo Online), free online, etc.  But for the average gamer, someone who plays a few of the newest games, consoles are much more budget friendly.  Most gamers aren't going to do half of what we do.  

Cost of PC will vary greatly based the user.  

The biggest complaint I have with my PC is heat.  Good god, it heats up the room to a crazy amount.  I have actually measured the exhaust, 107 F when running AAA games.  



rtx 4090, 32 gb ram, i7-13700k

Switch 2

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Chrkeller said:

For gamers, myself included, that do a lot of things, yeah fair point.  A PC offers tons of emulation (don't need to pay for Nintendo Online), free online, etc.  But for the average gamer, someone who plays a few of the newest games, consoles are much more budget friendly.  Most gamers aren't going to do half of what we do.  

Cost of PC will vary greatly based the user.  

The biggest complaint I have with my PC is heat.  Good god, it heats up the room to a crazy amount.  I have actually measured the exhaust, 107 F when running AAA games.  

That’s a fair point. Also, on the topic of AAA games, I never knew this but appearently I have like a reslly beefy PC setup. AMD R5 7600X + RX9070XT. According to Microsoft, this setup is capable of playing a game like FH6 at max settings. (And yet the most graphically intensive game I’ve played so far is the Wii U version of BotW lol.)



That this is even a question shows how much big companies have perverted things. This should never be a question in the first place. Once I purchased it, it is my to do as I wish.



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2024

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [GTA6]

BraLoD said:
Chrkeller said:

If Godzilla destroyed your house and broke all your physical games, how many would work?  

I know my comment sounds cheeky, but I stand by it.  The odds of Steam going anywhere, in my lifetime, is roughly the same as Godzilla destroying your game collection.  

We should ignore possible and talk about probable.  Steam isn't going anywhere.  

edit

I honestly think the odds of you losing your game collection is higher than Steam shutting down via fire, being robbed, tornado, etc.  

That would require an external factor not related to any of my games, unlike the case of Steam.

So yeah, quite cheeky, it points out the fragility of it quite a lot, as Valve literally could ruin your games meanwhile no game company in the world could ruin mine.

I'd like add something I've pointed out in other threads, namely, if you lose your digital library (or any portion thereof) and there's no way to get it back, you're screwed. Meanwhile, if I become the victim of a burglary or house fire that results in me losing my games, not only does my homeowner's insurance fully cover the loss, but the existence of the second-hand market makes reacquiring most physical games reasonably possible.

I don't have a single NES, SNES, or Genesis game that cannot be found on the used games market. Some might cost a good bit more these days if they're rare enough, but they're available. Physical games don't just evaporate into the ether when the publisher goes belly-up or the title goes out of print. I don't have to resort to piracy or finagle some sort of bespoke backup system or whatever. Physical games are your property, with all that entails.



Visit http://shadowofthevoid.wordpress.com

Art by Hunter B

In accordance to the VGC forum rules, §8.5, I hereby exercise my right to demand to be left alone regarding the subject of the effects of the pandemic on video game sales (i.e., "COVID bump").

Shadow1980 said:

That's an issue of property rights, and therefore it's a question for the law to answer. And I'm going to go over that in depth here, so there won't be a short version. Also, since I'm an American, I will be focusing on U.S. law. The laws will obviously differ in other nations.

I won't (and can't) argue with your post. But I just want to point out, that laws are an artificial thing humans created. They are not natural. They can be shaped in any form we want.

There was a time no copyright laws existed, then it was willed into existance. In theory we could change laws. In practice big companies profit from the way things are (otherwise they wouldn't have grown big in the first place) and so they use their power to keep things as they are or even escalate them in their favor. It is hard for consumers to fight against that. That money interests can shape the laws is only possible, because the law is actually artificial, man-made. No company can change the realities of the natural sciences. But they can influence the change of created things, like laws.

So for me the question how law currently is, is not unimportant (after all i have to follow laws), but I think the more interesting question is: how should the laws be shaped in an ideal world?



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2024

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [GTA6]

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BraLoD said:
Chrkeller said:

Steam has an entire backup system built in.  I have backup copies of my digital games.  A few clicks and my entire library is on a secondary drive.  

If Gabe decided he likes boats so much that he would like to spend every single penny on buying as many of them as possible and Steam would be permanently shut down today, how many of these backed up games would still work without going thorugh Steam client tho?

Replace Steam with GOG and let us make this discussion. Sure, I have to backup my GOG games as well, but I also have to store my physical games. And as long as GOG is still around, I actually can get a new copy from them. But when they shut down, I can still play my games.

I would actually argue that in theory digital games are better for the consumer than physical. The only reason why they are actually worse is because of DRM. So let us replace Steam with GOG.



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2024

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [GTA6]

firebush03 said:

IMO PC has far FAR more bang for its buck than something like a PS5. Windows has an Xbox Mode, meaning that right off the bat you’ve already saved $700USD. And then there’s ease of emulation, free online, a massive supply of cloud storage for save data (which isn’t tied to ToS of a games provider… meaning far less liklihood of losing all your save data and/or ROM/ISO files), universal backwards compatibility with QoL enhancements such as 244FPS 1440p, realistic CRT filters (so no need for a CRT), cheap Steam releases, as well as…erm…free access to really any game from any system released prior to 2020, AND it makes life significantly easier. As somebody who frequently uses my PC for studies/work, I cannot even begin to express how convenient it is to not have my PC overheating and crashing with more than two tabs open at a given time lol.

Does PC come with extra time to play? :p

As you get older you'll realize that time is the limiting factor, not bang for buck. Consoles are simply still faster to get in the game and less maintenance than PC. I can be playing a new VR game in 30 seconds from turning the PS5 on. Digitally buy it on my laptop, set it to download and it's ready to play by the time I turn the ps5 on. 

But sure when you get really invested in a game then PC offers unlimited ways to enhance the game. I'm curious how I'll find FS2024 on PSVR2. I played FS2020 on PC with mods, 3rd party tracking programs, 3rd party planes, editing the config files. But it also was a lot of work to keep it running optimally without my system overheating, and every month a patch changed things again so had to re-balance the graphics settings again and fix the key bindings. Plus even from SSD it took over 5 minutes to get it loaded to being in a plane.

PC is like a motorcycle, you can go anywhere, tinker with it to your heart's content.
Consoles are like a comfy Sedan, it just works.




Being able to play it without someone or something allowing it. Having control over the ability to play.
Being able to transfer ownership to someone else. Selling it, giving it away.



Mnementh said:
Shadow1980 said:

That's an issue of property rights, and therefore it's a question for the law to answer. And I'm going to go over that in depth here, so there won't be a short version. Also, since I'm an American, I will be focusing on U.S. law. The laws will obviously differ in other nations.

I won't (and can't) argue with your post. But I just want to point out, that laws are an artificial thing humans created. They are not natural. They can be shaped in any form we want.

There was a time no copyright laws existed, then it was willed into existance. In theory we could change laws. In practice big companies profit from the way things are (otherwise they wouldn't have grown big in the first place) and so they use their power to keep things as they are or even escalate them in their favor. It is hard for consumers to fight against that. That money interests can shape the laws is only possible, because the law is actually artificial, man-made. No company can change the realities of the natural sciences. But they can influence the change of created things, like laws.

So for me the question how law currently is, is not unimportant (after all i have to follow laws), but I think the more interesting question is: how should the laws be shaped in an ideal world?

To answer that question at the end: "In a way that favors workers and customers."

Under capitalism, the deck will be stacked in favor of the capitalist class. Again, ownership is power, and nowhere is that more consequential than the means of production being owned by large for-profit corporations. A person I'm familiar with once said "Every single regulation libertarians oppose exists because someone abused their freedom when the regulation didn’t exist." You get laws regulating pollution because rivers caught fire or drinking water was poisoned. And you get laws protecting customers because crooked businessmen screwed over their customers. "Let the buyer beware" was not sufficient legal grounds to sell dangerous or defective products or defraud the customer.

And in the world of video games, there ought to be rules favoring the people who actually buy the games. There have been plenty of businesses throughout history that have actually done their due diligence and were profitable without having to screw over their workers or customers. If big video game publishers don't want government getting involved in their business, then they ought to do a better job instead of doing bullshit like shutting down games or pushing aggressive monetization schemes that border on gambling.



Visit http://shadowofthevoid.wordpress.com

Art by Hunter B

In accordance to the VGC forum rules, §8.5, I hereby exercise my right to demand to be left alone regarding the subject of the effects of the pandemic on video game sales (i.e., "COVID bump").

Mnementh said:
BraLoD said:

If Gabe decided he likes boats so much that he would like to spend every single penny on buying as many of them as possible and Steam would be permanently shut down today, how many of these backed up games would still work without going thorugh Steam client tho?

Replace Steam with GOG and let us make this discussion. Sure, I have to backup my GOG games as well, but I also have to store my physical games. And as long as GOG is still around, I actually can get a new copy from them. But when they shut down, I can still play my games.

I would actually argue that in theory digital games are better for the consumer than physical. The only reason why they are actually worse is because of DRM. So let us replace Steam with GOG.

Yes, GoG claims to sell you games and not licenses, and that's a way better model than Steam on PC.

Sadly GoG is basically non-existent compared to Steam up until now. I don't know if I can even say it's 2% of it.