Yooka Laylee 1 made me want to play Rare Replay to relive Banjo Kazooie/Tooie cause Yooka Laylee isnt as polished or as fun as those two games.

Deadly Premonition on 360 was so mind-bogglingly garbage it made me feel I'd been too harsh on the likes of Resident Evil 5.

Wind Waker was such a limp handshake of a game that it made their return to form with Twilight Princess all the more satisfying.

Another thing I can think of is every game in the bullet heaven/reverse bullet hell genre shows how good Vampire Survivors done it. I'm still waiting on Halls of Torment to be ported to PS5 but every game, while some are good are so much more inferior to VS.

I wouldn't say perfect. But yeah, that is an example where motion controls didn't get in the way. I still prefer Prime on Gamecube, though. lol

Horrible take lol

How so? I've spent 50 or 60 euro on this genre now and the only thing that comes close to VS is Brotato and it isn't really the same genre asides from being rouglite and the structure. It's a sea of 7/10 games, not bad but not the 10/10 VS is. I bet Halls of torment is better, it looks better but they won't port it. 

We are talking Hoard Survivors specifically here, the rouglite subgenre. If you know of one with VS quality, please fill me in. 

Thought you were talking shmups not roguelites. Shmups and only 50 euro, that's like 1 game. I have shelves full of shmups so I can say. You are not too experienced in the genre.

Nah, they are like 5 euro each, 10 max. Reverse bullet hells or hoard Survivors, they are like a rouglite subgenre that like end game diablo but no CD's, it's entirely auto shoot mechanics where you do a run of 10-30 mins and get EXP for killing mobs and when you level up you choose a few weapons that synergise together, a modifier for one of the weapons or some stat change or some kind of a buff to help and you earn some curency for permanent progression outside of runs. Eventually the mobs become hoards and you either die or build yourself to become an untouchable God. I'd say it's spawned it's own genre now, an extremely dopamine heavy genre but like Soulsborne the competition can't reach Vampire Survivors. Halls of Torment on PC is supposed to surpass it but from what is available on console, they are weaker even when made with much higher quality as Vampire Survivors is a bit retro in style, copying assets right from Castlevania, like 1 to 1, Capcom didn't sue them and instead done a DLC partnership with them. 

Anyway. Not shmups or rouglites at least not traditional rouglites. 

Fair. Your post mentions bullet hells and I thought you meant shmups.  Not into roguelites myself. I finished Hades and that was ok but meh. Never finished Time Stalkers on Dreamcast. That is a genre I have little experience in.

Honestly, these are now their own genre, very far removed from the parent genre and they are awesome. Look up Vampire Survivors OP build footage.