PS5/XSX versus PS4/XB1 is the most lame duck "generational leap" in the history of video games and it's probably not going to get much better.
Is the day of unique consoles mostly over? | |||
Yes | 6 | 19.35% | |
No | 5 | 16.13% | |
Maybe | 3 | 9.68% | |
Nintendo will still be unique | 17 | 54.84% | |
Total: | 31 |
PS5/XSX versus PS4/XB1 is the most lame duck "generational leap" in the history of video games and it's probably not going to get much better.
Pemalite said:
The thing with phones is that they are also seen as a necessity product... |
But the thing is... people also don't have any actual incentive to upgrade their phone when you stop and think about it. Even if your old one breaks (and most people don't wait that long), you're never gonna need the latest high end model, ever. Like you describe with consoles, it's the same just faster, except for phones it's been that way even longer. If you choose to buy a flagship anyway that's the same reason people will keep buying consoles.
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UnderwaterFunktown said: To an extent but not completely. The phone market is a good example of what happens once an industry reaches a point where there's no point in upgrading or innovating further. They either do it anyways or try to convince people they do so they can keep on selling. |
I can relate to what you’re saying.
I’m still on iPhone X. It doesn’t have neural cores, so I’ll upgrade when/if Apple Intelligence becomes indispensable or my phone breaks (never happened to me before) or my carrier forces me. Funny thing too, I used to be the guy that would buy/sell mobile phones all the time and had like 6 different phones on the go in the pre-smartphone era. But I did a lot of J2ME and BREW stuff back in the day. Now I’m a stingy bastard and have no plans of upgrading anytime soon.
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UnderwaterFunktown said: But the thing is... people also don't have any actual incentive to upgrade their phone when you stop and think about it. Even if your old one breaks (and most people don't wait that long), you're never gonna need the latest high end model, ever. Like you describe with consoles, it's the same just faster, except for phones it's been that way even longer. If you choose to buy a flagship anyway that's the same reason people will keep buying consoles. |
That's right. You aren't upgrading. You are essentially just replacing through natural attrition.
But when you replace your device, you aren't buying a several year old phone... Because they aren't on the market anymore.
As for the high-end, you are partially correct there.
A large volume of Samsung/Apple high-end device sales are actually through bundled plans where the device is rolled into your 4G/5G LTE service contract.
This is why a device like the S23 Ultra managed to outsell the plain S23, the higher price just was irrelevant due to plans being pushed by telco's.
https://www.sammobile.com/news/galaxy-s23-sales-higher-galaxy-s22-report/
For those on lower incomes or those who don't have a good credit rating, prepaid/post paid devices tend to be the largest volume sellers... I.E Samsung Galaxy A54... But again, people don't replace them yearly, they replace them through natural attrition and will likely buy another device in that similar class or better.
Samsung rolls over 200~ million phones a year. Most of it's customers are just replacing devices.
Phones are an essential commodity item... And being a handheld device are prone to being dropped, lost or broken through regular usage, where consoles can last decades.
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Jumpin said:
Sega’s Saturn and Dreamcast were unique, the PlayStation and PS2 just happened to clone them and have more usable features, a better price, and better marketing and third party relations. Nintendo tends to be at its best when it’s not trying to align with other console manufacturers (particularly Gamecube) - because they end up coming off like the kiddy/junior version of the original. NES, Gameboy, DS, Wii, and Switch all went against the current and discovered new oceans. Of course, once in a while they accidentally land in a smaller lake (N64), or travel up shit creek (Virtual Boy and Wii U). Regardless, I buy every Nintendo console. But most Nintendo fans don’t, and will be fine skipping whole generations. Look at guys like Mike Matei who is still a fanatical NES/SNES guy. |
Interesting take on the subject especially with PlayStation cloning the Saturn when the Saturn did a 11th hour change to it's CPU design making it a dual CPU setup when it got wind of the PS1's 3D capabilities.
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Pemalite said:
That's right. You aren't upgrading. You are essentially just replacing through natural attrition. |
I mean I can see your argument but I do think you're giving people too much credit for being "practical" in their phone buying habits when the reality is pretty far from that. Practical would be buying a Motorola up front for like ~100€ which is what I did. Wasn't even an outdated model, works fine, I have no complaints.
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UnderwaterFunktown said:
I mean I can see your argument but I do think you're giving people too much credit for being "practical" in their phone buying habits when the reality is pretty far from that. Practical would be buying a Motorola up front for like ~100€ which is what I did. Wasn't even an outdated model, works fine, I have no complaints. |
Welcome to the Motorola gang 👍 Been there since 10 years, only on my 2nd phone and I don't intend to go for the higher brand since it is completely unnecessary to the actual needs of a phone.
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Soundwave said:
VR is the true unexplored horizon, standard screen gaming (regardless of the size of the screen) kinda just is what it is, the leaps forward will be more incremental from this point on. You can only reinvent the wheel so often when we've already hit the point of being able to render anything at a reasonable high level of visual fidelity for standard consoles (I'll include even the Switch in that grouping).  |
I agree. And I look forward to that day. Hopefully, I won't be too old to enjoy it or get splitting migraines like I do with current tech.
Soundwave said: PS5/XSX versus PS4/XB1 is the most lame duck "generational leap" in the history of video games and it's probably not going to get much better. |
For the next generation AI will need to do a lot of heavy lifting or it'll be even worse since unlike the PS4 and Xbox One the CPU in the PS5 and Xbox Series aren't pathetic and they both have SSDs so the storage situation has already gotten good. I'm sure Sony will push PSSR 2.0 hard since it'll probably come with frame generation which will let a lot more games have 60fps and even 120fps modes on the PS6 but that by itself wouldn't constitute a big generational leap. How big it is will largely come down to just how much AI advances in the next four years.
Norion said:
For the next generation AI will need to do a lot of heavy lifting or it'll be even worse since unlike the PS4 and Xbox One the CPU in the PS5 and Xbox Series aren't pathetic and they both have SSDs so the storage situation has already gotten good. I'm sure Sony will push PSSR 2.0 hard since it'll probably come with frame generation which will let a lot more games have 60fps and even 120fps modes on the PS6 but that by itself wouldn't constitute a big generational leap. How big it is will largely come down to just how much AI advances in the next four years. |
The problem is going to be "the graphics are even prettier" means less and less when the point you're already at is already pretty good.
Case in point ... how many people are super excited for 8K televisions? Not many. Why, because 4K is already more than good enough for most people, a lot of people today still watch a lot of their programming/movies at a mere 1080p or less (cable TV).
The other problem is going to be that most developers and publishers are already at their breaking point budget wise now. You ask them to double their budgets again from where they are today and it will break a lot of publishers, even Sony we can see from their internal leaked docs is already extremely worried about the budgets for games like Spider-Man 2. So what's going to happen when you need to double/triple that budget to get a large leap forward from Spider-Man 2/3 on PS6? It isn't going to be feasible.
Honestly I think if you showed even a lay person a video game that had photorealistic graphics today, a lot of people wouldn't care much. Like if you went from this:
To literal photorealism (or close enough), I mean ok. Does it make the game that much better? How many people outside of Digital Foundry enthusiast types really care? How much would that cost to get there? Triple the amount? Are you selling 3x the copies? This already looks pretty good, even relative to real life.
Last edited by Soundwave - 3 hours ago