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Forums - Nintendo - How Will be Switch 2 Performance Wise?

 

Switch 2 is out! How you classify?

Terribly outdated! 3 5.26%
 
Outdated 1 1.75%
 
Slightly outdated 14 24.56%
 
On point 31 54.39%
 
High tech! 7 12.28%
 
A mixed bag 1 1.75%
 
Total:57
curl-6 on 06 August 2025
HoloDust said:
curl-6 said:

If people cared strongly about high end graphics then they wouldn't buy a Switch 2 in the first place as it is well known to be mid-range portable tech.

The DF guys are tech enthusiasts, most of the general audience is not; John for instance got annoyed by Donkey Kong Bananza using FSR rather than DLSS, but I'd bet money that 90% of DK's audience couldn't even tell you what DLSS or FSR are.

I understand when John is coming from - I find Bananza on TV to be quite jarring on the edges at times...surprisingly, as they also noted, it looks quite fine in handheld mode. But those shadows that Oliver pointed out really look bad anyway you take it.

That said, they are doing their jobs - Persona 3 has no RT reflections, and they pointed that out. Which is strange, we have upcoming Outlaws that is nothing but RT lighting, and there you have Persona in something that can probably be treated as "lazy" port from PS4. So maybe fans that are interested in that stuff can make a stink with Atlus about it, while there's still time before it launches - and in some way, I guess Oliver did called them on out on that.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against DF doing their jobs; as someone who finds this stuff fascinating, I am their target audience and I appreciate the work they do.

I'm just pretty sure that neither them nor I are representative of the average Switch/Switch 2 player.

That doesn't mean of course that we can't discuss it, this is a graphics thread after all. We just have to remember that a lot of their input is their subjective opinion.

Last edited by curl-6 - on 06 August 2025

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HoloDust on 06 August 2025
curl-6 said:
HoloDust said:

I understand when John is coming from - I find Bananza on TV to be quite jarring on the edges at times...surprisingly, as they also noted, it looks quite fine in handheld mode. But those shadows that Oliver pointed out really look bad anyway you take it.

That said, they are doing their jobs - Persona 3 has no RT reflections, and they pointed that out. Which is strange, we have upcoming Outlaws that is nothing but RT lighting, and there you have Persona in something that can probably be treated as "lazy" port from PS4. So maybe fans that are interested in that stuff can make a stink with Atlus about it, while there's still time before it launches - and in some way, I guess Oliver did called them on out on that.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against DF doing their jobs; as someone who finds this stuff fascinating, I am their target audience and I appreciate the work they do.

I'm just pretty sure that neither them nor I are representative of the average Switch/Switch 2 player.

That doesn't mean of course that we can't discuss it, this is a graphics thread after all. We just have to remember that a lot of their input is their subjective opinion.

I'd say that most of what they're analyzing is quantifiable, but yeah, you can certainly look at low frame rates, low res shadows, DLSS disoclussions, missing features and all other stuff from the subjective perspective of "am I bothered by it?".



Otter on 06 August 2025
curl-6 said:
Otter said:

If people cared strongly about high end graphics then they wouldn't buy a Switch 2 in the first place as it is well known to be mid-range portable tech.

The DF guys are tech enthusiasts, most of the general audience is not; John for instance got annoyed by Donkey Kong Bananza using FSR rather than DLSS, but I'd bet money that 90% of DK's audience couldn't even tell you what DLSS or FSR are.

I think you're forcing a binary. Plenty of people can buy a Switch 1, let alone 2... Not care about high end graphics on the platform and then still completely stay clear of ugly switch 1 ports like Ark Evolved or Mortal Combat One. 

And again, DF are only in the discussion for talking about Star Wars outlaws, so this is the context. John critiquing a missed opportunity for DLSS in DK isn't really to the point. Their tech review of that game is pretty positive.

Last edited by Otter - on 06 August 2025

curl-6 on 06 August 2025
HoloDust said:
curl-6 said:

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against DF doing their jobs; as someone who finds this stuff fascinating, I am their target audience and I appreciate the work they do.

I'm just pretty sure that neither them nor I are representative of the average Switch/Switch 2 player.

That doesn't mean of course that we can't discuss it, this is a graphics thread after all. We just have to remember that a lot of their input is their subjective opinion.

I'd say that most of what they're analyzing is quantifiable, but yeah, you can certainly look at low frame rates, low res shadows, DLSS disoclussions, missing features and all other stuff from the subjective perspective of "am I bothered by it?".

Framerate and resolution metrics are quantifiable, yes, all those are facts, it's more how people perceive them that's subjective.

Otter said:
curl-6 said:

If people cared strongly about high end graphics then they wouldn't buy a Switch 2 in the first place as it is well known to be mid-range portable tech.

The DF guys are tech enthusiasts, most of the general audience is not; John for instance got annoyed by Donkey Kong Bananza using FSR rather than DLSS, but I'd bet money that 90% of DK's audience couldn't even tell you what DLSS or FSR are.

I think you're forcing a binary. Plenty of people can buy a Switch 1, let alone 2... Not care about high end graphics on the platform and then still completely stay clear of ugly switch 1 ports like Ark Evolved or Mortal Combat One. 

And again, DF are only in the discussion for talking about Star Wars outlaws, so this is the context. John critiquing a missed opportunity for DLSS in DK isn't really to the point. Their tech review of that game is pretty positive.

I mean I am one of those people, I enjoy pretty games as much as the next person and I'm a Switch 1/2 buyer who avoided bad ports like Arkham Knight or Ark. I'm an an enthusiast on a dedicated gaming forum though, I'm a minority of the audience.

DF's input is worthwhile and I welcome it. I just think their views on Outlaws need to be seen in the context that they'll have different standards to most Switch 2 players.



Leynos on 06 August 2025
HoloDust said:
curl-6 said:

If people cared strongly about high end graphics then they wouldn't buy a Switch 2 in the first place as it is well known to be mid-range portable tech.

The DF guys are tech enthusiasts, most of the general audience is not; John for instance got annoyed by Donkey Kong Bananza using FSR rather than DLSS, but I'd bet money that 90% of DK's audience couldn't even tell you what DLSS or FSR are.

I understand when John is coming from - I find Bananza on TV to be quite jarring on the edges at times...surprisingly, as they also noted, it looks quite fine in handheld mode. But those shadows that Oliver pointed out really look bad anyway you take it.

Any game that has highly destructible environments always took hits somewhere.



Bite my shiny metal cockpit!

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zorg1000 on 06 August 2025
Soundwave said:
HoloDust said:

You views are very...narrow and shortsighted.

We'll see who's right. 

Nintendo's sales numbers speak for themselves, and they're not the ones going multiplatform anywhere, if anything they're even scaling back the concession they made about 10 years ago to make smartphone games because those games haven't matched the success they have found with the Switch. 

Once the Switch 2 generation is done, IMO no one in the history of the business is ever going to see that much console volume in two back to back generations (PS1 + PS2 is going down). Their big franchises in many cases are also having record breaking sales ... Zelda has never been bigger than it is now. Mario Kart has never been bigger than it is now. Smash Brothers has never been bigger than it is now. Animal Crossing has never been as big as it is now. 3D Mario on Switch is bigger than its ever been. Pokemon is quite at absolute peak, but it's up from even the DS era. 

I would even argue that Pokemon is at its sales peak.

Gameboy/Color/N64 games

Red/Blue/Green-31.05m

Gold/Silver-23.73m

Yellow-14.64m

Crystal-6.39m

Stadium-5.46m

Pinball-5.31m

Trading Card Game-3.72m

Snap-3.63m

Stadium 2-2.54m

Hey You Pikachu-1.83

Puzzle League-0.45m

Puzzle Challenge-???

Switch games

Scarlet/Violet-27.15m

Sword/Shield-26.84m

Let’s Go-15.07m

Brilliant Diamond/Shining Pearl-15.06m

Arceus-15.00m

Snap-2.40m

Pokken DX-2.04m

Mystery Dungeon-1.99m

And that’s not counting the eShop titles like Quest, Cafe Mix, Unite, Friends



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

SvennoJ on 06 August 2025
Soundwave said:
HoloDust said:

You views are very...narrow and shortsighted.

We'll see who's right. 

Nintendo's sales numbers speak for themselves, and they're not the ones going multiplatform anywhere, if anything they're even scaling back the concession they made about 10 years ago to make smartphone games because those games haven't matched the success they have found with the Switch. 

Once the Switch 2 generation is done, IMO no one in the history of the business is ever going to see that much console volume in two back to back generations (PS1 + PS2 is going down). Their big franchises in many cases are also having record breaking sales ... Zelda has never been bigger than it is now. Mario Kart has never been bigger than it is now. Smash Brothers has never been bigger than it is now. Animal Crossing has never been as big as it is now. 3D Mario on Switch is bigger than its ever been. Pokemon is quite at absolute peak, but it's up from even the DS era. 

DS sold 154 million, 3DS sold 76 million, Wii sold 101 million, so Nintendo at it's peak mobile + console combined is about 216 million.

Nintendo didn't increase the market with the Switch. Switch is just about to overtake the DS... Taking off the blue ocean from the Wii, 153 million Switch is about the core Nintendo mobile + console base.

It is/was a very smart move to consolidate console and mobile business in one, towards the mobile side as that's where the stability is/was. But indeed sales numbers speak for themselves, the handheld crowd is the main supporter of the Switch. Vita was the only competitor before at 14 million, now all likely gone to Switch, while Steam Dock sits at 4 million.

And Nintendo DS has big sellers before, 30 million on New Super Mario Bros for example, just edging out Super Mario Odyssey on Switch.

The only platform really still growing is mobile phones...



Very crude measurement, 2009 about 37 billion Handheld+console combined
2020 about 33 billion for console + Switch.

Even without inflation adjustment the market for console+handheld has shrunk. Hence only the Switch now in that space with some PC handhelds on the side. 

Home console sales are shrinking as well tracking behind ps4+XOne. PS5 is tracking behind PS4 as well.


The Wii isn't show there, ps3+360+Wii blows ps5+series out of the water, WiiU still puts the p4+XOne further out of reach.

Yeah combining your 2 revenue stream makes for one bigger revenue stream, however the sum is not greater than its parts. Mobile is still growing however. 

MS does the same thing, combining their console user base with PC user base to boast about engagement numbers going up. Sony has to release on PC as well as they don't have anything to combine to prop up numbers. 

This is Nentendo's assessment in 2023
https://www.start.io/blog/nintendo-target-market-segmentation-marketing-strategy-main-competitors-statistics/



Kinda supports the theory that the new generation isn't engaging as much with Switch, or traditional video games in general.



redkong on 06 August 2025
SvennoJ said:
Soundwave said:

We'll see who's right. 

Nintendo's sales numbers speak for themselves, and they're not the ones going multiplatform anywhere, if anything they're even scaling back the concession they made about 10 years ago to make smartphone games because those games haven't matched the success they have found with the Switch. 

Once the Switch 2 generation is done, IMO no one in the history of the business is ever going to see that much console volume in two back to back generations (PS1 + PS2 is going down). Their big franchises in many cases are also having record breaking sales ... Zelda has never been bigger than it is now. Mario Kart has never been bigger than it is now. Smash Brothers has never been bigger than it is now. Animal Crossing has never been as big as it is now. 3D Mario on Switch is bigger than its ever been. Pokemon is quite at absolute peak, but it's up from even the DS era. 

DS sold 154 million, 3DS sold 76 million, Wii sold 101 million, so Nintendo at it's peak mobile + console combined is about 216 million.

Nintendo didn't increase the market with the Switch. Switch is just about to overtake the DS... Taking off the blue ocean from the Wii, 153 million Switch is about the core Nintendo mobile + console base.

It is/was a very smart move to consolidate console and mobile business in one, towards the mobile side as that's where the stability is/was. But indeed sales numbers speak for themselves, the handheld crowd is the main supporter of the Switch. Vita was the only competitor before at 14 million, now all likely gone to Switch, while Steam Dock sits at 4 million.

And Nintendo DS has big sellers before, 30 million on New Super Mario Bros for example, just edging out Super Mario Odyssey on Switch.

The only platform really still growing is mobile phones...



Very crude measurement, 2009 about 37 billion Handheld+console combined
2020 about 33 billion for console + Switch.

Even without inflation adjustment the market for console+handheld has shrunk. Hence only the Switch now in that space with some PC handhelds on the side. 

Home console sales are shrinking as well tracking behind ps4+XOne. PS5 is tracking behind PS4 as well.


The Wii isn't show there, ps3+360+Wii blows ps5+series out of the water, WiiU still puts the p4+XOne further out of reach.

Yeah combining your 2 revenue stream makes for one bigger revenue stream, however the sum is not greater than its parts. Mobile is still growing however. 

MS does the same thing, combining their console user base with PC user base to boast about engagement numbers going up. Sony has to release on PC as well as they don't have anything to combine to prop up numbers. 

This is Nentendo's assessment in 2023
https://www.start.io/blog/nintendo-target-market-segmentation-marketing-strategy-main-competitors-statistics/



Kinda supports the theory that the new generation isn't engaging as much with Switch, or traditional video games in general.

It's only gonna get worse from here with games taking longer to release and console prices that keep going up. Also for the most part games have peaked graphically and gameplay wise. The only games that i could see being massive in terms of moving consoles now is GTA6, Battle field 6 and animal crossing.



Teno on 06 August 2025
SvennoJ said:





Kinda supports the theory that the new generation isn't engaging as much with Switch, or traditional video games in general.

The declining interest in consoles among influencers has significantly reduced their appeal to younger gamers, particularly teenagers. Meanwhile, major gaming markets in industrialized countries are generally failing to achieve the minimum replacement birth rate of 2.1 children per woman, which naturally shifts the gaming demographic towards an older age group. To mitigate this trend, it is essential to win over emerging markets in Asia, South America, and Africa. However, both Nintendo and PlayStation have so far been unsuccessful in reaching  millions of gamers in China, Korea, or India. Successfully tapping into these markets could have steadily increased annual revenue and rendered price hikes unjustifiable for consoles. But those places have become mobile and PC gaming markets instead.



sc94597 on 06 August 2025
Teno said:

  millions of gamers in China, Korea, or India.

The bolded have even lower fertility rates than Western Europe and the Americas. 

Although China is still #2 in absolute births, so it might still make sense to target them in the short/medium term (albeit not the long term as its population rapidly declines in the 2040's-50's, unless we achieve LEV or something close to it.) 

I think what is more likely is that gaming companies are going to target older and older populations. We already see this currently, to an extent, with pricing trends and remaster/remake frequencies. 

Game purchase distributions tend to follow a power law relationship, with a small dedicated user-base having a high attach ratio/purchase count and then it drops off from there pretty rapidly. 

So you might see companies shifting to reduce this the intensity of this power law relationship in order to maximize sales. Basically convert casual gamers who buy a few games, often at a discount, to more dedicated fans. 

This is where companies like Nintendo excel. Their game prices rarely decrease and they have a relatively large very enthusiastic fan base who buys many titles.