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Forums - Gaming Discussion - (Business Perspective) Does MS really need Xbox Hardware?

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Azzanation said:
twintail said:

I don't know if I commented in this thread, so these are updated thoughts potentially:

I don't think it's great that MS essentially moves away from hardware, but it does make console buying a lot easier for everyone: just get a PS and a Nintendo device and you're covered. PC if you're into that.

My concern is really how do they sell GamePass if they exit hardware? Their hardware is clearly the easiest gateway into that GP subscription. Would Sony/ Nintendo allow it (like how they do EA Ubisoft)? Honestly, I feel like if they don't then this gonna work out for MS.

That said, it's clear that going multiplatform with their games is all about revenue. They aren't getting it from physical on their own hardware, and I imagine that GP isn't really as profitable as it needs to be to get it from there. 

Asd for moving away from physical media... not great for ppl who want it, but it doesn't matter to me since I've basically moved digital for the most part. 

Why don't you think it's great if MS move away from Hardware? You don't game on Xbox so how does this affect you in anyway shape or form?

The way I see MS working GP into other eco-systems is to stop selling competitive products like Hardware. Many fail to understand the pull GP has. Sony actually gains more customers if it became an option. More people will buy PS knowing they have the option. More PS sales = more money.

Sony won't accept GP now, because MS has the Xbox Series S/X as a competing platform, the moment MS drop hardware, Sony won't have a threat in the highend console market, and they will gain a treasure trove of IPs from GP and an extra audience to follow. 

ice said:

"Be careful what you wish for" is going to come to mind in a decade's time, competition was good and will always be for consumers.

Good for who exactly? Because I can tell you from a PC standpoint, MS dropping out of the console industry has no effect on me and many others.

Less competition for one, which may or may not be a good thing. Just because I don't buy MS consoles, doesn't mean I don't necessarily get the competitive benefits of it existing.

And without the hardware, MS is betting a lot on other platforms to keep their subscription service viable. There's no reason for Sony to have to agree to GP on the platform if those games are being sold on their digital store, which I assume (maybe incorrectly) is more financially lucrative for Sony. 

As for GP on PS, it'll be slow going for a while: these games need to be working on PS hardware to begin with and I imagine it'd be a MS only catalogue presented, which kind of diminishes part of the appeal of GP. 



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Azzanation said:
DonFerrari said:

I have already said earlier on the thread why I didn't want MS leaving console space.

Regarding your second point yes they can do it (don't depend on they having a console or not getting out of hardware imho, but for me even if they leave console making space be 100% or through licensing the HW for 3rd parties if GP have other publishers Sony won't allow).

What page is your reply on, and I'll read it again, if you haven't changed your opinion, since for some odd reason, you simply don't want to update your reply or at least repost it.

Anyway, Sony will want MS's 1st party games, did you forget MS own Bethesda and ABK? All MS have to do it make CoD exclusive to GP and all future Blizzard games. Thats MS's GP killer app. Otherwise, another company will take GP and Sony customers will miss out which will hurt sales. 

Man it is your thread. My opinion didn't change but I won't write several paragraphs again or go looking for it for you to give the same type of answer you gave back there.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Azzanation said:
IcaroRibeiro said:

Yes

I don't think Xbox has any exclusive appealing to me. Sony will still releasing their first party and getting many japanese games and those kind of games don't sell on Xbox, so right now I just want Playstation to keep lower price

Without Xbox to keep Sony in check Playstation will be 800 USD and games 80 USD

Sooo.. you have no faith in Sony doing the right thing by you? You need a platform you don't care about or its games to stay in the industry just so Sony wouldn't raise their prices? How has that worked out so far? Last time I checked, the PS5 recently had a price rise and the PS3 launched at $599 USD while Xbox and Nintendo exist in that industry.

You have to remember, Xbox isn't a charity, someone has to pay for it to exist.

Lol faith in company is for fanboys 

Yes and Yes for your first/second questions

For your third question I'd say it worked fairly well, Sony kept prices as low as they could during PS4 days.  PS5 prices are okay for what it delivers.  Also Sony invest in studios and games because they can't rely on third parties only which are multiplat. Without Xbox all AAA third parties will be on Playstation by default so basically PS2 days again with nobody to stand a chance against Sony. I don't like that, I'm not a Sony fan just someone who thinks Playstation offers the best value, if this is no longer the case I will buy a PC and call it a day 

As for someone to pay to Xbox, this is for Xbox customers to care about not me. I'm not demanding people to keep buying Xbox, I'm just sad nobody see value on them anymore because it will lower the bar for Sony lol 



Zippy6 said:
IcaroRibeiro said:

Sad. I don't want to pay 700 USD in my next Playstation 

 I don't understand responses I have seen from many people like this, expecting Sony to run rampant with horrific negative consequences for consumers. If Xbox left the console hardware business it would not give Sony free reign to do whatever they want and screw over consumers however they wish. Negative decisions that are harmful to their userbase will hurt Sony regardless of if Xbox consoles exist or not. Gaming is a massive industry and there will always be competition from other platforms and services whether that is from traditional console hardware or something else. Where there is opportunity someone will take it and providing a poor level of value to your customers greatly increases that opportunity for others.

There will always be competition in some form because there will always be companies looking for opportunities to make money.

Steam have basically a monopoly on PC gaming, but they haven't become horrifically anti-consumer. Why? Because they won't stay at their incredibly dominant position for long if they start screwing their consumers over.

Console market is very hard one to get into if a Big Tec like Microsoft can't prosper on it I don't think any company can challenge Sony

Sony poor choices can push people away from console gaming and look for PC or mobile gaming, that's all. If people still liking console gaming it's Sony or nothing, which means they can get away with losing customers if this means maximizing profits from the userbase who wants to stick with consoles. They couldn't afford this with Xbox having a healthy foot in the market



JRPGfan said:

Xbox finally has the studios it needed all along.
Why should they stop now? when their so close to being able to turn things around? It feels a little too early to give up, after the efforts they put in.


This was like 8 months ago now.... Wow.


Also man, Azzanation comeing off like a prophet in this one.
I guess he saw the writeing on the wall before most of us.



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Azzanation said:
zeldaring said:

I think this is a ridiculous take. Let's say wii dominated the console market and killed Xbox and ps then we would have been stuck with crap hardware for decades. Same with Xbox one if it was the only console we would have been forced to buy kinect 2, much weaker hardware then ps4 and online games only. competition is always good for the consumer. 

The Wii did dominate the console market..

It doesn't matter if competition exists or not, these companies will continue to try and exploit you. Customers speak with their wallets, if a device came out with an attachment no one wants, they just wont buy the console. Its as simple as that. No one is forced to buy a Nintendo, PS or Xbox, its all optional and companies know that they need to impress their customers to get them to buy the hardware otherwise customers will just game on their phones and PCs.

The wii did not dominate in terms of mind share or console sales, in the end it sold 13% more then ps3 and 15% more then 360, It did not kill those console like ps5 is doing to xbox. If the console comes with attachments and its the only option it will sell no matter what because what's the other option do people that are used to buy consoles for generations. yes companies will exploit you but it will only get worse with out competition.  like imagine if there was no amd competition for nividia yes things would way more expensive for gamers that want home consoles and gpu's for PC. 



twintail said:
Azzanation said:

Why don't you think it's great if MS move away from Hardware? You don't game on Xbox so how does this affect you in anyway shape or form?

The way I see MS working GP into other eco-systems is to stop selling competitive products like Hardware. Many fail to understand the pull GP has. Sony actually gains more customers if it became an option. More people will buy PS knowing they have the option. More PS sales = more money.

Sony won't accept GP now, because MS has the Xbox Series S/X as a competing platform, the moment MS drop hardware, Sony won't have a threat in the highend console market, and they will gain a treasure trove of IPs from GP and an extra audience to follow. 

ice said:

"Be careful what you wish for" is going to come to mind in a decade's time, competition was good and will always be for consumers.

Good for who exactly? Because I can tell you from a PC standpoint, MS dropping out of the console industry has no effect on me and many others.

Less competition for one, which may or may not be a good thing. Just because I don't buy MS consoles, doesn't mean I don't necessarily get the competitive benefits of it existing.

And without the hardware, MS is betting a lot on other platforms to keep their subscription service viable. There's no reason for Sony to have to agree to GP on the platform if those games are being sold on their digital store, which I assume (maybe incorrectly) is more financially lucrative for Sony. 

As for GP on PS, it'll be slow going for a while: these games need to be working on PS hardware to begin with and I imagine it'd be a MS only catalogue presented, which kind of diminishes part of the appeal of GP. 

If you want the competitive advantage of competition than you need to support it otherwise, the competition will get up and leave like we have seen since the beginning.

So many gamers were upset that Sega left the hardware market, the very same people that wouldnt buy a Sega product. It makes zero sense.

No company in their right mind will compete just to make you happy while spending billions. Xbox have witnessed how bias the industry is towards them. Give them reasons to stay that actually benefit them, otherwise like we are seeing with the rumours, will get up and leave. They dont care what Sony does, they can survive without them aswell, so weather Sony does right by you isnt MS, Xbox or Phils responsibility. If you choose not to support them, dont expect them to support you either. Its the Sega situation all over again.

Lets not forget, MS own the brands that make Sony the most amount of money, so if anything, its Sony that needs MS because those Shareholders dont want to lose that CoD money. 



Saying competition never helped us in the video game industry is wild. Many consoles became far cheaper solely to get ahead of the curb in sales against their competitors, there are so many examples I could list. N64 was originally supposed to launch at 250$ but lowered the price to 200$ to keep up with the PS1 & Saturn in sales and price. Throughout the 6th generation literally the day after Sony announced price cuts on the PS2, Microsoft & Nintendo would price cut their systems to keep up. Sony also clearly wouldn't have priced the PS3 at 600$ if the 6th gen competition was closer, but they priced it that high because they thought they were so dominant that consumers would buy their consoles no matter what after dominating the 6th gen, the reason the PS4 was as affordable and developer friendly as it was was to make a better system that would make sure Xbox wouldn't take away their sales again.

Competition just overall gives us more options too, if the competition wasn't so stiff in the 6th generation Nintendo likely would've never gone the innovative direction with their consoles, consoles that have proven to be more appealing than standard Nintendo consoles as proven by the sales numbers of the DS,Wii,3DS, and Switch. We now benefit as a consumer having another option like the Switch to get a hybrid experience different from PS & Xbox.

Competiton also encourages companies to release the best games to sell the most hardware.



IcaroRibeiro said:
Azzanation said:

Sooo.. you have no faith in Sony doing the right thing by you? You need a platform you don't care about or its games to stay in the industry just so Sony wouldn't raise their prices? How has that worked out so far? Last time I checked, the PS5 recently had a price rise and the PS3 launched at $599 USD while Xbox and Nintendo exist in that industry.

You have to remember, Xbox isn't a charity, someone has to pay for it to exist.

Lol faith in company is for fanboys 

Yes and Yes for your first/second questions

For your third question I'd say it worked fairly well, Sony kept prices as low as they could during PS4 days.  PS5 prices are okay for what it delivers.  Also Sony invest in studios and games because they can't rely on third parties only which are multiplat. Without Xbox all AAA third parties will be on Playstation by default so basically PS2 days again with nobody to stand a chance against Sony. I don't like that, I'm not a Sony fan just someone who thinks Playstation offers the best value, if this is no longer the case I will buy a PC and call it a day 

As for someone to pay to Xbox, this is for Xbox customers to care about not me. I'm not demanding people to keep buying Xbox, I'm just sad nobody see value on them anymore because it will lower the bar for Sony lol 

You cannot have your cake and eat it too. You cannot expect Xbox to stay around without the support. Xbox have literally no reason to stay in the hardware market, when they can capture the hearts of more gamers elsewhere. Selling 20m more consoles or selling 100m more software in a year. Its an obvious anwser 

The industry isnt run for the small minority. Xbox leaving wont affect you in anyway, no idea why you would care for Xbox fans. Sony will do what they have always done, with or without competition, makes no difference.



javi741 said:

Saying competition never helped us in the video game industry is wild. Many consoles became far cheaper solely to get ahead of the curb in sales against their competitors, there are so many examples I could list. N64 was originally supposed to launch at 250$ but lowered the price to 200$ to keep up with the PS1 & Saturn in sales and price. Throughout the 6th generation literally the day after Sony announced price cuts on the PS2, Microsoft & Nintendo would price cut their systems to keep up. Sony also clearly wouldn't have priced the PS3 at 600$ if the 6th gen competition was closer, but they priced it that high because they thought they were so dominant that consumers would buy their consoles no matter what after dominating the 6th gen, the reason the PS4 was as affordable and developer friendly as it was was to make a better system that would make sure Xbox wouldn't take away their sales again.

Competition just overall gives us more options too, if the competition wasn't so stiff in the 6th generation Nintendo likely would've never gone the innovative direction with their consoles, consoles that have proven to be more appealing than standard Nintendo consoles as proven by the sales numbers of the DS,Wii,3DS, and Switch. We now benefit as a consumer having another option like the Switch to get a hybrid experience different from PS & Xbox.

Competiton also encourages companies to release the best games to sell the most hardware.

You are clouded by the notion of Competition is better. There is always a catch when companies play around with pricing. Companies find other ways to make you pay them back for their discounted prices. Nothing is for free. They literally all locked up Multiplayer behind a paywall, that was Competition that did that, not a monopoly. 

Competition does not equal better games, and to debunk your points on pricing, look at the industry today. We have price increases across the board, in a industry with Competition. Companies will price hike regardless. Because they know when one does it, they all follow to push the agenda

The industry is better when we move away from exclusive boxes and focus on open platforms. Exactly how PCs and the mobile marker work.

We have literally seen more bad things happen when it comes to competition than we have seen with gains.