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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Digital Foundry- CoD Black Ops Cold War

ice said:

Why are we trying to crown a winner? Just be happy it seems optimized on both consoles. Lol

It's bonkers



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smroadkill15 said:

I disagree. Both XSX and Ps5 fps are in the 90s during 120 mode so being 4 fps higher when both are struggling isn't really a bragging point. Where as XSX performance is 60 fps with raytracing on with no drops vs ps5 dips into the 40s with it on. This a much bigger deal than any advantage ps5 has. Loading times are not a big enough difference to really brag about.

If we're going to be adding advantages that have nothing to do with performance, then XSX can quick resume at any point during the game, or Xbox has cloud saving without needing a sub. Lets keep the comparisons related to graphical performance shall we. 

The Series X having better RT isn't as big a factor as you think. If the PS5 version dropped into the 40's consistently, frequently in gameplay, than yeah it would be a huge advantage for the Series X. However, DF states the PS5 version dips in RT mode during select scenes (they gave two examples) but otherwise runs at 60FPS most of the time. I'd say the advantage the PS5 has in 120hz mode is about the same as the Series X advantage in RT. 

Graphical performance isn't the only point of comparison. DF themselves note the Dualsense, controls that actually impact how you play, and not something completely irrelevant to performance like cloud saves. In a multiplatform game that runs nearly identical on both consoles, the Dualsense features help the PS5 version stand out, and adds another layer of immersion to the gameplay. 

Last edited by PotentHerbs - on 24 November 2020

also how come DF doesn't mention stuff like this:

or that there is a bug that sometimes hurts PS5, but its not consistant:

Cutscene that drops to 46fps, re-trested and runs 60fps same spot:


*edit:

Also Xbox Series S does support Raytraceing (DF said it didn't) (or choose not to show it).

https://www.reddit.com/r/XboxSeriesX/comments/jzsjx3/ray_tracing_is_available_on_xbox_series_s_version/

"Ray Tracing is avaible on Series S

Apparently, you need to correctly download the right file packs to get the Ray Traced shadows to appear in game. Digital Foundry incorrectly stated in their video that RT isn’t available in the Series S version, however that just isn’t true. Here’s a source for downloading the packs: https://youtu.be/Ke3cB8yJOD8

And here’s some gameplay of a mission showing Ray Traced shadows at the very beginning of the mission from the helicopter: https://youtu.be/4_0Lmt6qEKA

Compare the last video with the footage Digital Foundry had, I think it’s clear they don’t have the correct files downloaded, which would be understandable considering there’s a bug preventing someone from downloading all the files correctly (apparently). Hopefully they make a updated video, or maybe someone can tweet at them about it? Regardless Ray Tracing is there. Also, there’s also a “HD Texture” pack as well that can be downloaded. If Digital Foundry checks out this thread, please download that as well. Thanks!"   -CITY_F0X

DF might not be useing HD texture pack (on one or both?), and forgot to download Raytraceing pack for the Xbox series S.

*face palm*

Last edited by JRPGfan - on 24 November 2020

smroadkill15 said:

So Series X performs better with Raytracing on than ps5 does. I tally this one in the Series X favor overall.

This is from VG tech ( guys that did the video with 15mins+ of frame rate graph):

60 FPS mode:

1. XSX = Mean frame rate 60 FPS | 16.67 ms at 99.99%
2. PS5 = Mean frame rate 59.99 FPS | 16.67 ms at 99.96%

120 FPS mode:

1. XSX = Mean frame rate 114.93 FPS | 8.33 ms at 91.9%
2. PS5 = Mean frame rate 117.02 FPS | 8.33 ms at 94.15%

Source:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CXW167MudfhuhOjscNSc8Vvs6YEuQ21dXDWkjJCpJQk/edit#gid=0

We're argueing about 0,03% of the time or so.   (60fps vs 59.99)
Which mostly happends during cutscenes.

Less than 0.1 fps differnce, in 60fps mode with RT on.

(did anyone that watched the Digital foundry video come away thinking this was how the results would be? and still claim DF arnt biased?)




Last edited by JRPGfan - on 24 November 2020

Seems like a tie with perhaps Xbox small advantage, why didn't the tools affect this game?

EDIT: looking at the answers on the thread seems like that advantage was wrongly given to Xbox. The drop in fps in PS5 was very selective and when considering the whole game PS5 had much better 120hz consistency than the disadvantage on the 60fps.

EDIT 2: About 10:30 on the video he says Xbox runs 60fps at 95% of the time, so perhaps they didn't show it dipping but this would be a conclusion that it does. And well the drops in PS5 happens when they make absolutely no difference as you are in a corridor without a single enemy or anything to do besides walk straight and see exposion.

EDIT 3: It is funny that they have clear reasons for PS5 dropping in framerate on the 60fps RT (even if they don't say, but they don't question the drop), but on Xbox 120fps they find it important to say there is no clear reason on why it is dropping, and say the resolution is the same as the PS5. As in the other videos they are struggling to overcome their own preconceptions of Xbox Series X being more powerful and performing better than PS5 as they have been touting before launch. And yes they like to crutch on the VRR for Series X =p

EDIT 4: Richard is so confused that he says "They took advantage of Dualsense, specially in PS5", how would they take advantage of it on Series X?

Last edited by DonFerrari - on 24 November 2020

duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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Tons of damage control in this thread... did Xbox “win” or something? Video seemed pretty even to me. Glad Xbox has a great performance on RT 60fps mode, that’s the mode I’ll use most likely.



Manlytears said:

Correct me if wrong..., in short.

PS5 wins at 120 fps modes, both options, with RT and without RT.

XSX and PS5 are tied at 60fps and no RT.

XSX wins at 60 FPS RT.

XSS, again, fails to deliver MS promise. Major features cut ( RT / 120fps mode), lesser preformance in FPS than XSX.
All the talk of "just resolution downgrade" and "no major differences on performance and other features" is looking more and more like lies from MS marketing. Truly shameful if you ask me.

When it comes to the series S promise, if it doesn't happen in a 3rd party game it doesn't make MS a liar. If gears 5 can run 120 fps on series S, I have no reason to believe a cod title can't. comes down to optimization and the devs willingness to do what's necessary to get it to work. Ms can't mandate effort from 3rd party, especially a company that has deals with Sony. Ms promised capability, the console has proven its capability. Ms is only responsible for it's 1st party content which thus far has kept the promise.



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^Yes that's me ripping it up in the GIF. :)

JRPGfan said:

also DF are late with their videos, for weeks we've been hearing people say it runs better on PS5.
DF basically had to cherry pick 2 minor instances, where they found the XSX to run better than PS5 and show that, while other videos from other 3rd party have actually found area's where the xsx runs worse (hence why this game was said to run better on the PS5).


Seems like cherry-pick your console war to me. take whatever side you favor more at believe the sections of videos they uploaded and the validity of what THEIR graphs show.

For me whether it fits my bias narrative or not, if there are conflicting reports, I'll put more weight on whatever the report is from DF over the new kids on the block, as DF has been doing this stuff for years, and have earned the credibility miles over anyone else attempting to enter this space of content.

Aside from the credibility of the content creator knowing what they're doing and having the right tools to do so, there is this shroud of narrative interests. And over the years, I've seen DF report big wins for both sides, at this point, I have no reason to believe they'd try to swing the narrative in any other direction than what is factual. As for the new kids, I don't know their agenda or their body of work, so I'm not finna jump on their wagon if it's contradictory to what DF reports JUST BECAUSE I like their verdict more.



http://imageshack.com/a/img801/6426/f7pc.gif

^Yes that's me ripping it up in the GIF. :)

eva01beserk said:

Seems like we found our trend for the gen. RT on will favour the xbox and RT off will favour the ps5. At this game at least both are virtually the same anyways as both only strrugle during set pieces but gamplay seem solid in all versions and modes. As someone who favours the ps5, ima take the loss as I have zero interest in high framerate. Im 100% in for image quality. Not that ima ever play a COD game lol

All these modes and versions worry me. Instead of having one HW profile and one mode to optimize for, now we not only have multiple HW profiles but also, quality, performance, high frame rate and ray trace modes. What happened to the version the directors are making the game for. What is the 'intended' way to experience the game, the way the director had it in mind.

VRR will likely come to PS5 as well with an update, however it most likely won't come to my tv with an update. HDMI 2.0b ancient tech :p
Imo 120 fps is just as much a waste of resources as native 4K. I've seen the difference between native 120 fps and re-projected 60 fps on PSVR and I have to look at rotating helicopter blades and fences zooming by on the sides to notice the difference.

Ray tracing does enhance image quality, however there I fear it's simply a bit too early. To get RT performing a lot of cuts have to be made, quartering the resolution for reflections for example. The idea was that RT would save a lot of development time since you don't need baked lighting and reflections anymore. However this gen it's only more work since the former is still needed with RT sprinkling some sugar on top.

No wonder game prices have to go up!



One funny addition. Seems like that at least one of the scenes were PS5 in 60fps mode with RT dropped to 40fps isn't consistant. VGTech capture done the scene twice and it was 60fps on the second time. So it is possible to patch to correct, and considering the averages posted, it doesn't even make a difference.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."