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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Microsoft: Xbox Series S and X only next-gen consoles with full RDNA 2 feature set

Hynad on 01 November 2020
shikamaru317 said:

To be perfectly honest, I'm kind of baffled by the fact that some people in this thread think that Demons Souls is the best looking next-gen game so far. Personally, I'm more impressed by Kena, Scorn, The Medium, Bright Memory Infinite, Flight Sim 2020 (coming to Xbox Series in 2021 most likely), Ratchet and Clank, Forza Motorsport reboot, Gran Turismo 7, Hellblade 2, and Horizon Forbidden West.

Funny how calling the best looking launch game works...



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SvennoJ on 01 November 2020
shikamaru317 said:

To be perfectly honest, I'm kind of baffled by the fact that some people in this thread think that Demons Souls is the best looking next-gen game so far. Personally, I'm more impressed by Kena, Scorn, The Medium, Bright Memory Infinite, Flight Sim 2020 (coming to Xbox Series in 2021 most likely), Ratchet and Clank, Forza Motorsport reboot, Gran Turismo 7, Hellblade 2, and Horizon Forbidden West. Maybe on a purely technical level Demons Souls looks better than a few of the above, but certainly not all of them, and when you factor art design into the overall visual presentation, I personally don't think it looks as good as ay of the above, and possibly a few others as well. 

FS 2020 doesn't fit the bill anymore, it's getting worse after each patch.

LOD is messed up, AA is messed up, sharpening filter is messed up. Since the last patch the text on the flight instruments is less readable, more blurry, while near terrain looks over sharpened / grainy. Cloud rendering has been hit as well, not looking as good anymore. And then you have areas like this

That's a problem with Bing map data, but there plenty of those outside the US

I love the game but by the time it's 'optimized' enough to fit on consoles there might be little left at the rate its going :/
Exploring the world as fast as I can before it becomes unplayable lol
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/exploring-the-world-in-the-beechcraft-bonanza/266981

This is my most recent shot, at 200 renderscale (4K rendered and down sampled)



This is from a couple patches ago, I want this back

I don't know what they're doing, but it still crashes nearly every day, performance degrades over time and fluctuates a lot, it needs about 20 GB of RAM to function, and while rendering at 4K internally to take a screenshot, it runs at about 8 fps, about 18 fps with 1440p ish internally (lower is no use, bound by cpu from there). I don't have the best gaming laptop but it had no issues with FH4 on ultra 1080p60, so I'm not having very high expectations for consoles where it has to run at a stable fps.

Anyway got sidetracked, patch ptsd lol. (patch day is finding new workarounds day ugh) I agree with Demons Souls, bad screenshots maybe. I have also not played Demon's Souls thus no rose tinted glasses. Scorn does look a bit like an Unreal tech demo like Forsaken back in '98



PotentHerbs on 01 November 2020
smroadkill15 said:
PotentHerbs said:
Considering Demon's Souls is the best looking next gen title, the Xbox Series X/S having full RDNA2 won't matter, until the Series X has a title that looks heads and shoulders better than any PS5 titles.

Otherwise, its a minor advantage that doesn't compare to the potential of the SSD/ IO throughput, with near instant load times being the tip of the iceberg.

Just because Demon Souls is arguably the best looking next-gen game(as of now), doesn't mean the extra power the XSX has won't make a difference later into the generation. Could Demon Souls run on the XSX? Most definitely. 

It's like Saying, Ryse was the best looking Launch game last gen, but does that take away from the power advantage the ps4 had? No, it just means the game was optimized really well for the X1 and could have ran on the ps4 if they built the game for it. 

Will it be a major advantage? As in, you won't need to pixel count to see which multiplatform game looks better, and Series X titles look significantly better? I doubt that. A slight resolution edge? Sure. But we're at a point of diminishing returns when it comes to graphics. 

At this point in time, it sounds like the SSD/IO has more potential for game design, as well as QoL improvements, and may end up being the biggest advantage between both consoles.



Machiavellian on 01 November 2020
eva01beserk said:
sales2099 said:

Don’t need to. The very idea of the IPs they own coming to Xbox is more then enough to gain excitement. 

Thats true. But the exitement you feel is not for the games since none have anounced, its for the prospect of exclusivity. as you where getting any game already. SO this is full console warior mentality. 

Isn't that the excitement every gamer who is married to a system feels.  People were already excited about Demon Souls before they saw any footage.  People were excited about God of War and other properties from Sony before they saw anything.  Excitement builds based on previous accomplishments and that is no different then people being excited for the games coming from MS latest purchase deal.  Reading a lot of forums, I see that this has actually gain MS a lot of mind share where a lot of people who would easily skip an Xbox purchase now considering getting one.  It doesn't have to be on release, over the course of the console lifecycle when games from all of these studios come out, if they maintain their high mark will move systems.  Console war mentality is when people just pick a side and only see what interest them with their chosen console.  Lets not act like everything is decided yet.



Vodacixi on 01 November 2020
KratosLives said:
Mark cerny isn't an idiot, he and engineers know exactly what's happening in latest technologies, which have been going on a for a while.

I mean... He created Knack. And then he went and made Knack II. He can't be THAT smart xD



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smroadkill15 on 01 November 2020
PotentHerbs said:
smroadkill15 said:

Just because Demon Souls is arguably the best looking next-gen game(as of now), doesn't mean the extra power the XSX has won't make a difference later into the generation. Could Demon Souls run on the XSX? Most definitely. 

It's like Saying, Ryse was the best looking Launch game last gen, but does that take away from the power advantage the ps4 had? No, it just means the game was optimized really well for the X1 and could have ran on the ps4 if they built the game for it. 

Will it be a major advantage? As in, you won't need to pixel count to see which multiplatform game looks better, and Series X titles look significantly better? I doubt that. A slight resolution edge? Sure. But we're at a point of diminishing returns when it comes to graphics. 

At this point in time, it sounds like the SSD/IO has more potential for game design, as well as QoL improvements, and may end up being the biggest advantage between both consoles.

Never said it was going to be significant difference. What we will likely see is XSX hitting Native 4k more often and a more consistent 60fps in 3rd party games ie AC Valhalla native 4k on XSX and Upscale on ps5. 

Both system have their advantages over the other, like XSX dedicated hardware for raytracing and shader cores for machine learning, and ps5 with it's SSD and IO output. When next gen is all said and done, exclusives for both consoles will look fantastic. 



kirby007 on 01 November 2020
smroadkill15 said:
PotentHerbs said:

Will it be a major advantage? As in, you won't need to pixel count to see which multiplatform game looks better, and Series X titles look significantly better? I doubt that. A slight resolution edge? Sure. But we're at a point of diminishing returns when it comes to graphics. 

At this point in time, it sounds like the SSD/IO has more potential for game design, as well as QoL improvements, and may end up being the biggest advantage between both consoles.

Never said it was going to be significant difference. What we will likely see is XSX hitting Native 4k more often and a more consistent 60fps in 3rd party games ie AC Valhalla native 4k on XSX and Upscale on ps5. 

Both system have their advantages over the other, like XSX dedicated hardware for raytracing and shader cores for machine learning, and ps5 with it's SSD and IO output. When next gen is all said and done, exclusives for both consoles will look fantastic. 

this thread has gone from the wild west to dandy europe, good job salvaging it with this reply!



 "I think people should define the word crap" - Kirby007

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SvennoJ on 01 November 2020
shikamaru317 said:

Well, I was basing that mainly on the official trailers, which are just total eye candy for someone like me that wishes he had money to travel the world but does not have money:

But also was basing it on some non official youtube videos I've seen of it, such as this one:

Obviously the game still has some kinks to work out, not all that surprising considering the sheer size of the simulation they have created, but by the time it comes to Xbox Series X (in 2021 probably) it should be in much better shape hopefully. Based on the benchmarks I've seen, Series X should be able to run the game at 4K 30fps with a mix of ultra and high settings, which is just fine for me, I don't need 60 fps in a game where the world seems to move slowly due to how high up you are when flying most of the time. 

The problem is, people on the flightsim forums want what's shown in the official trailers back as well. It hasn't looked like that since (pre-)release. You did need a very beefy PC to run it as shown in the trailers, and it does run faster now, yet the visuals have taken a huge hit in the process.

This is a sample from right now

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/lod-problems-trees-water/276055/943
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/terrible-night-lighting-after-patch-5/310086
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/after-the-patch-you-killed-the-clouds/311780
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/long-stutters-freezes-since-patch-3/293104/58
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/ms-frustration-simulator/295625/16
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/tbm-ap-bug-vs-selection-bug-sticky-key-behavior-on-mouse-select/310594/20
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/terrible-salt-and-pepper-clouds/312675/3
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/ctd-after-latest-update-update-5/309576/444
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/washed-out-poor-colour-and-oversharpened/310479/12
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/sharpening-overdone-since-last-update-everything-looks-way-too-sharp-and-pixelated/311550/42
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/flickering-clouds-after-update-oct-29th/309898
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/hot-fix-1-10-8-0-did-not-fix-stuttering-flickering-clouds/311960
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/cloud-textures-pixelated-and-grainy/179116/55
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/light-distance-issue/312987
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/blurry-cockpit-in-update-5/312447/14
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/lightning-in-mostly-sunny-skies/287836/244
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/places-to-avoid-in-ms2020/301708/85

Some kinks is a bit of an understatement, it wasn't ready for release. I feel for Asobo, such an amazingly ambitious project, yet it had to get out of the door before it was finished. Now it seems they're making knee jerk patches that break more than they fix. One of the problems of an always online game, you can't decline patches or revert to an older version :/



LudicrousSpeed on 01 November 2020
shikamaru317 said:
Hynad said:

Funny how calling the best looking launch game works...

Ah, well, if we are purely talking launch games, then sure, I do think that Demons Souls looks better than Spider-Man or Microsoft's launch exclusives (which are mainly graphical updates for last gen games and indies), though I do think that the updated Gears 5, which runs at better than PC ultra graphics on Series X, largely trades blows with Demons Souls, with Demons Souls only slightly coming out on top. MS isn't exactly bringing their A game at launch, though they do have The Medium coming in December which looks very good to me personally, made with just a 7m euro budget. 

Even has raytracing:

You’re good, no one was specifying launch games only. Potent said best looking next gen title, not launch title, unless he just misspoke. 

Not that it matters, Watch Dogs with the effects it has looks better and Gears 5 runs at 120fps in MP. Both more impressive than Demon’s Soul imho.



PotentHerbs on 01 November 2020
LudicrousSpeed said:
shikamaru317 said:

Ah, well, if we are purely talking launch games, then sure, I do think that Demons Souls looks better than Spider-Man or Microsoft's launch exclusives (which are mainly graphical updates for last gen games and indies), though I do think that the updated Gears 5, which runs at better than PC ultra graphics on Series X, largely trades blows with Demons Souls, with Demons Souls only slightly coming out on top. MS isn't exactly bringing their A game at launch, though they do have The Medium coming in December which looks very good to me personally, made with just a 7m euro budget. 

Even has raytracing:

You’re good, no one was specifying launch games only. Potent said best looking next gen title, not launch title, unless he just misspoke. 

Not that it matters, Watch Dogs with the effects it has looks better and Gears 5 runs at 120fps in MP. Both more impressive than Demon’s Soul imho.

I meant from a gameplay perspective, I don't think anything rivals DeS overall look, with its lighting, textures and particle effects. UE5 demo, Hellblade 2, and HFW are the only things that match up to Demon's Souls, but the latter two haven't shown a gameplay walkthrough.