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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - NEW Halo Infinite 4k/60 official trailer

hinch on 27 July 2020
Pemalite said:
hinch said:

NX Gamer covers gives his impressions on the Xbox conference and analysis including Halo Infinite. He doesn't even think Slipspace is a new engine.

 Probably because it isn't.
Like most game engines, developers/publishers don't discard the old and start again from scratch, they build upon and rewrite parts of the engine and rebadge it as something new.

Case in point... The Creation engine from Skyrim Bethesda marketed as a "new" game engine, but in reality it's still based on Gamebryo which in turn is still based on Net Immerse from the 90's.

Call of Duty still has snippets of code from the Quake Engine, Source still has snippets of code from Quake as well, they don't discard everything and start from scratch, they improve on already established foundations, it's cost effective and allows for faster development time.

To me Slipspace has a very clean look as it lacks heavy post-processing, which reminds me of Quake, but some of the shader effects reminds me of the Halo engine aka. Blam!
So I will go out on a limb and say they took the old Halo Engine and overhauled it from top to bottom, which comes with it a heap of old and new nuances.

Yeah you're probably right, it would take a lot of upheaval and wouldn't be worth building from scratch. Like you said it was probably built upon Blam! and they just added new stuff to it. I think Destiny's engine is based on that as well, quite an interesting read here.

I feel a lot of concessions were made to meet 4K 60FPS target for Series X. And possibly 60fps for One S. On top of other issues.



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Shaunodon on 27 July 2020
hinch said:
Pemalite said:

 Probably because it isn't.
Like most game engines, developers/publishers don't discard the old and start again from scratch, they build upon and rewrite parts of the engine and rebadge it as something new.

Case in point... The Creation engine from Skyrim Bethesda marketed as a "new" game engine, but in reality it's still based on Gamebryo which in turn is still based on Net Immerse from the 90's.

Call of Duty still has snippets of code from the Quake Engine, Source still has snippets of code from Quake as well, they don't discard everything and start from scratch, they improve on already established foundations, it's cost effective and allows for faster development time.

To me Slipspace has a very clean look as it lacks heavy post-processing, which reminds me of Quake, but some of the shader effects reminds me of the Halo engine aka. Blam!
So I will go out on a limb and say they took the old Halo Engine and overhauled it from top to bottom, which comes with it a heap of old and new nuances.

Yeah you're probably right, it would take a lot of upheaval and wouldn't be worth building from scratch. Like you said it was probably built upon Blam! and they just added new stuff to it. I think Destiny's engine is based on that as well, quite an interesting read here.

I feel a lot of concessions were made to meet 4K 60FPS target for Series X. And possibly 60fps for One S. On top of other issues.

The game has also gone through development cycle hell from the sound of it, and Covid restrictions are just the newest layer of hell. The game needs a fair bit more time in the oven for sure, but the core still looks great.

Targeting 60fps shouldn't have been a problem for the next-gen hardware. You'd expect it to look like that on Xbox One X, comparatively worse to other open world games right now, but not the Series X. It needs more polish.

Targeting native 4k is an issue. There are already much better workarounds to get the same level of picture clarity. Doesn't make sense that they're either so far behind the industry standards, or just refuse to use them.



Mr Puggsly on 27 July 2020
Pemalite said:
The game doesn't look next-generation sadly. It does look clean.

But the pop-in, flat lighting, the sprite-work that sticks out... Doesn't leave me with much faith.

In saying that, it also doesn't look bad, so as long as they nail the gameplay it might be okay, unfortunately though, first impressions last and the first impression is always going to be a visual one... Even this trailer doesn't really show the visuals in the best light.

But some of the new gameplay toys look fun.

I am not exactly sure why people thought this would even look next gen. Its being built for X1 and time is limited to suddenly make it next gen level.

I am actually okay with the presentation because it essentially looks like a cleaner version of Halo 5. From my memory you were pretty critical of the significant compromises made in that game. This is kinda what I wanted from Halo 5 on more powerful hardware, just a clean looking game.

As far as lighting goes, that may never be addressed unless we get a ray tracing update. That addition could be a fairly easy way to make a massive change in the overall presentation.



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Mr Puggsly on 27 July 2020
SammyGiireal said:

This is true. Halo 1's visuals sold me on an OG Xbox back in 2001. A game like that just wasn't possible on the PS2. Halo Infinite has failed to deliver that " I must buy this console, just for this" type of reaction out of me. I am sticking with my Xbox One X for now.

In my opinion graphics for the past few generations hasn't been super exciting because aren't seeing significant leaps out of the blue like Xbox in the 6th gen.

Halo wasn't just the graphics, but also the scale and felt unique. Wowing people now is more difficult than 2001 I imagine. Even with PS2 graphics it could have been a notable title.

At this moment I have not seen anything that says I need a next gen console. Its kinda 8.5 right now.

However, one of the best incentives might be Gamepass. I like MS games, I already have a few years of Gamepass, if I simply buy the hardware I will get better experiences than my Xbox One X can devliver. So it might be trailers and Digital Foundry videos that sway me.



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Shaunodon on 27 July 2020
Mr Puggsly said:
Pemalite said:
The game doesn't look next-generation sadly. It does look clean.

But the pop-in, flat lighting, the sprite-work that sticks out... Doesn't leave me with much faith.

In saying that, it also doesn't look bad, so as long as they nail the gameplay it might be okay, unfortunately though, first impressions last and the first impression is always going to be a visual one... Even this trailer doesn't really show the visuals in the best light.

But some of the new gameplay toys look fun.

I am not exactly sure why people thought this would even look next gen. Its being built for X1 and time is limited to suddenly make it next gen level.

I am actually okay with the presentation because it essentially looks like a cleaner version of Halo 5. From my memory you were pretty critical of the significant compromises made in that game. This is kinda what I wanted from Halo 5 on more powerful hardware, just a clean looking game.

As far as lighting goes, that may never be addressed unless we get a ray tracing update. That addition could be a fairly easy way to make a massive change in the overall presentation.

'Powered by the Slipspace Engine'

They marketed it this way. They've had time to get it right, and they targeted the launch of Xbox Series X to showcase this title. It should look next-gen. No excuses.

If it's not up to par at launch, it should be delayed.



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MasonADC on 27 July 2020

Cant wait. GOTY will probably be between this and FF7 for me



Mr Puggsly on 27 July 2020
Shaunodon said:
Mr Puggsly said:

I am not exactly sure why people thought this would even look next gen. Its being built for X1 and time is limited to suddenly make it next gen level.

I am actually okay with the presentation because it essentially looks like a cleaner version of Halo 5. From my memory you were pretty critical of the significant compromises made in that game. This is kinda what I wanted from Halo 5 on more powerful hardware, just a clean looking game.

As far as lighting goes, that may never be addressed unless we get a ray tracing update. That addition could be a fairly easy way to make a massive change in the overall presentation.

'Powered by the Slipspace Engine'

They marketed it this way. They've had time to get it right, and they targeted the launch of Xbox Series X to showcase this title. It should look next-gen. No excuses.

If it's not up to par at launch, it should be delayed.

Halo 4 and 5 had exceptional graphics during cutscenes. I'm wondering if Halo Infinite is doing that as well?

Either way, I remember that trailer, but I also remember this one... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBb88gLmJZY

I was always skeptical about the trailer you posted because that was before 9th gen was announced. Maybe that would be PC graphics? Bearing in mind this was always a Xbox One game I guess it kept my expectations realistic.



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Shaunodon on 27 July 2020
Mr Puggsly said:
Shaunodon said:

'Powered by the Slipspace Engine'

They marketed it this way. They've had time to get it right, and they targeted the launch of Xbox Series X to showcase this title. It should look next-gen. No excuses.

If it's not up to par at launch, it should be delayed.

Halo 4 and 5 had exceptional graphics during cutscenes. I'm wondering if Halo Infinite is doing that as well?

Either way, I remember that trailer, but I also remember this one... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBb88gLmJZY

I was always skeptical about the trailer you posted because that was before 9th gen was announced. Maybe that would be PC graphics? Bearing in mind this was always a Xbox One game I guess it kept my expectations realistic.

It it was always an Xbox One game they would've demo'd it on Xbox One. They saved the first gameplay showcase for Xbox Series X to promote next-gen, and it doesn't look next-gen.



Mr Puggsly on 28 July 2020
Shaunodon said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Halo 4 and 5 had exceptional graphics during cutscenes. I'm wondering if Halo Infinite is doing that as well?

Either way, I remember that trailer, but I also remember this one... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBb88gLmJZY

I was always skeptical about the trailer you posted because that was before 9th gen was announced. Maybe that would be PC graphics? Bearing in mind this was always a Xbox One game I guess it kept my expectations realistic.

It it was always an Xbox One game they would've demo'd it on Xbox One. They saved the first gameplay showcase for Xbox Series X to promote next-gen, and it doesn't look next-gen.

I imagined the Series X version is going to be a Xbox One game visually with higher visual settings, like a PC port. So I got what I expected.

But if you were living the dream of the 2018 trailer and ignored the 2019 trailer, I understand.



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Shaunodon on 28 July 2020
Mr Puggsly said:
Shaunodon said:

It it was always an Xbox One game they would've demo'd it on Xbox One. They saved the first gameplay showcase for Xbox Series X to promote next-gen, and it doesn't look next-gen.

I imagined the Series X version is going to be a Xbox One game visually with higher visual settings, like a PC port. So I got what I expected.

But if you were living the dream of the 2018 trailer and ignored the 2019 trailer, I understand.

Both trailers had 'game engine footage', and both looked more impressive than the actual gameplay showcase. The 2018 reveal was the only one that actually had a view of the in-game world, so it's easier to compare.

Edit: If this "was always an Xbox One game" as you put it, then I'd expect the game to look close to those original trailers on Xbox One X, while even better on next-gen. The fact it was massively downgraded running on an XSX build makes it painful to even watch those old trailers now.

Last edited by Shaunodon - on 28 July 2020