By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Xbox Series X: The Most Powerful and Compatible Next Gen System

smroadkill15 said:

The games MS showed at the First look reveal was mainly from smaller developers. Acting like those games will be the bench mark of what Series X games will look like is not correct at all. I was a bit disappointing with the show as well, but I never thought,  "I guess this is all we can expect from the Series X." The showcase didn't ruin everything MS has accomplished with the Series X. It was a hiccup and most people are over it. 
Greenberg: "If helpful the Thursday IX will have Xbox Series X gameplay from some of our partners. Note many of our biggest partners are working on summer timelines, so this is the start of these monthly reveals. Expect a variety of unique games with some new 3rd party IP as well this month." 

Can you confirm all the games shown in July will be cross-gen titles?

MS has likely been more focused on the PC side of things because it's still severally lagging behind when it comes to the console offering. Gamepass on PC is not close to the level gamepass on Xbox one is. Xbox still has a lot of work to do to get their PC side of things up to par to consoles.

I get what you're saying, but I don't think the disappointment came from just the quality of the titles. Some looked pretty decent to me actually. The disappointment came from not showing any games that look like they couldn't possibly run on current gen consoles too. It makes sense as MS has been pretty clear about their cross-gen approach and flat out told us that Series X isn't going to have any exclusives for the first 1 or 2 years. Which makes me believe that there aren't going to be any Series X exclusives in July either.  



Around the Network
goopy20 said:
LudicrousSpeed said:
I don’t have any idea why people would be negative about a look at new third party IPs to start a gen. You’re the one who reads minds. Maybe they were disappointed that they didn’t see Forza or Fable?

Also, that wasn’t a conference lol. It was a 20 or whatever minute Inside Xbox video.

It wan't just a 20 minute inside Xbox video, it was the first official look at what MS said were next gen games running on Series X. It was an open goal for MS to kick off next gen gaming and you don't have to be a mind reader to get why it bombed so hard. Just look at the comments...

"Really disappointed, nothing really caught my eye. Felt like these games can be on the Xbox one."

"Thats one small step up in graphics. One giant leap in console prices"

"Some of these "gameplays" have worse graphics than current games. What a waste of teraflops."

"So far I haven’t spotted a difference that human eyes can see"

There was nothing really wrong with the games themselves, some actually looked pretty cool. Also, MS showed exactly what they've been promising for months. Games that, just like pc, scale up and down their family of devices and will run the best on Series X. Like I said, it all sounded great on paper when no games were shown. But now that they have, people were pissed. 

Now for arguments sake, lets say they're going to do the same thing at July's event and we'll just be seeing 1st party Xbox One games with an optimized for Series X logo. Can you then honestly say you're not going to be disappointed? 

And I’m sure in your usual optimistic way, you expect all the games in their July “conference” to look as “disappointing” as some found them to be during the Inside Xbox “conference”. I’m not sure why I’m supposed to care about what others thought or why it is relevant to the discussion. 

There were next gen only games in the “conference”. Per usual you are getting your facts wrong.



goopy20 said:

I get what you're saying, but I don't think the disappointment came from just the quality of the titles. Some looked pretty decent to me actually. The disappointment came from not showing any games that look like they couldn't possibly run on current gen consoles too. It makes sense as MS has been pretty clear about their cross-gen approach and flat out told us that Series X isn't going to have any exclusives for the first 1 or 2 years. Which makes me believe that there aren't going to be any Series X exclusives in July either.  

People were mostly disappointed in the lack of gameplay. Once I realized these were focused on smaller 3rd party developers, I stopped expecting games to being pushing the envelope of graphical fidelity, especially the ones that are cross-gen. I have no idea if they will only show cross-gen games or not in July, but I'm not going to assume they are or not. What I will tell you, we will see some really good games at this event. Games being cross-gen doesn't matter to me, especially within the 1st year. We have barely seen any games at all, so I think most people are jumping to conclusions about what to expect from Series X. The unreal Engine 5 demo was great example of what to expect, but not for a second do I believe it was only possible on the ps5. 



goopy20 said:

"especially considering PC developers aren’t yet building games that take advantage of such speeds. That may change in the future when both new consoles arrive and, as Sweeney predicts, inspire significant upgrades to PC component design and PC-specific game development.

StarCitizen.

goopy20 said:

I just think next gen consoles should be about pushing overall visuals and seeing new gameplay experiences that aren't possible on current gen. Its normal that 3rd party developers release a ton of cross gen titles but its the 1st party developers that should be setting a new standard early on. Just a bump in resolution and fps isn't that imo. That's why I prefer Sony's strategy much better than MS's smart delivery thing. Not saying native 4k and 120fps isn't awesome, but that is what pc is for. 

How many exclusives really push a Playstation or Xbox every year?

It's the exception of game releases not the overall norm.

goopy20 said:

"especially considering PC developers aren’t yet building games that take advantage of such speeds. That may change in the future when both new consoles arrive and, as Sweeney predicts, inspire significant upgrades to PC component design and PC-specific game development.

StarCitizen.

goopy20 said:

Consoles are always going to be the base platform for 99% of the developers, so if they're aiming for native 4k on consoles already, what would be the point of buying a RTX3080? Maybe Ray Tracing could make the pc versions stand out, but I don't think we will see full blown path tracing in multiplatform games on high end pc's. More likely we will see toggle on/ off Raytracing like we're seeing now on RTX cards that ad some reflections here and there. Not because full dynamic path tracing isn't doable on next gen gpu's, but more because of parity with consoles.

The PC aren't the consoles.

Why do PC gamers buy the latest and greatest? Simple really.  Consoles tend to go with around medium-quality settings comparative to the PC, we can sink all that extra processing into chasing those higher visuals on the PC, which is why the PC has the best graphics.

For example many console games leverage Screen-Space Ambient Occlusion where-as on PC games will typically run with Horizon Based Ambient Occlusion, it's more expensive, it's higher quality. - Console gamers probably won't tell the difference as they aren't sitting just a foot away from a display, but on a PC panel, you can certainly tell the difference.

The PC just has better quality visual settings which are more demanding on hardware, consoles are all about a game of sacrifices, the extra performance saved by opting for SSAO means a developer might be able to invest a little extra processing into improving the lighting of a scene... The PC can just have it all.

Not only that... 4k is all well and good, but you do realize the PC can have resolutions higher than 8k?

None of this is free on hardware.

Last edited by Pemalite - on 06 June 2020

--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

People seem to put a awful lot of stock in a 20 minute Inside Xbox video full of spillover content that would make the July event too cluttered and long.

The whole point of this topic is that Series X has the power and can play that card whenever MS sees fit. But for now it’s their strategy to showcase they are the #1 destination for choice, low barrier entry to great games, and preserving/enhancing the past to carry into the future. That is a message exclusive to the Xbox brand and it’s in their interest to appeal to those that even remotely care about this stuff. 

In July alone I know Forza 8 will be a graphical showcase that will blow us away. Turn 10 makes high quality games in 2 years, what they can do in 3 I can’t wait. Ray tracing, and all that next gen goodness that it’s lesser ports will only be a shadow of its greatness. Same goes for Halo. I’ll be too interested in how it plays and how fun it looks. The idea that I would be disappointed if it looks anything less then photo realism is silly to say the least.

Nm the AAA reveals of The Initiative, Playgrounds AAA RPG, Hellblade 2 gameplay (fingers crossed), and hopefully Obsidians AAA game gets an announcement. People worry too much or aren’t paying attention to what’s cooking. 

Last edited by sales2099 - on 06 June 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

Around the Network
Pemalite said:
goopy20 said:

"especially considering PC developers aren’t yet building games that take advantage of such speeds. That may change in the future when both new consoles arrive and, as Sweeney predicts, inspire significant upgrades to PC component design and PC-specific game development.

StarCitizen.

goopy20 said:

I just think next gen consoles should be about pushing overall visuals and seeing new gameplay experiences that aren't possible on current gen. Its normal that 3rd party developers release a ton of cross gen titles but its the 1st party developers that should be setting a new standard early on. Just a bump in resolution and fps isn't that imo. That's why I prefer Sony's strategy much better than MS's smart delivery thing. Not saying native 4k and 120fps isn't awesome, but that is what pc is for. 

How many exclusives really push a Playstation or Xbox every year?

It's the exception of game releases not the overall norm.

goopy20 said:

"especially considering PC developers aren’t yet building games that take advantage of such speeds. That may change in the future when both new consoles arrive and, as Sweeney predicts, inspire significant upgrades to PC component design and PC-specific game development.

StarCitizen.

goopy20 said:

Consoles are always going to be the base platform for 99% of the developers, so if they're aiming for native 4k on consoles already, what would be the point of buying a RTX3080? Maybe Ray Tracing could make the pc versions stand out, but I don't think we will see full blown path tracing in multiplatform games on high end pc's. More likely we will see toggle on/ off Raytracing like we're seeing now on RTX cards that ad some reflections here and there. Not because full dynamic path tracing isn't doable on next gen gpu's, but more because of parity with consoles.

The PC aren't the consoles.

Why do PC gamers buy the latest and greatest? Simple really.  Consoles tend to go with around medium-quality settings comparative to the PC, we can sink all that extra processing into chasing those higher visuals on the PC, which is why the PC has the best graphics.

For example many console games leverage Screen-Space Ambient Occlusion where-as on PC games will typically run with Horizon Based Ambient Occlusion, it's more expensive, it's higher quality. - Console gamers probably won't tell the difference as they aren't sitting just a foot away from a display, but on a PC panel, you can certainly tell the difference.

The PC just has better quality visual settings which are more demanding on hardware, consoles are all about a game of sacrifices, the extra performance saved by opting for SSAO means a developer might be able to invest a little extra processing into improving the lighting of a scene... The PC can just have it all.

Not only that... 4k is all well and good, but you do realize the PC can have resolutions higher than 8k?

None of this is free on hardware.

Can they?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcUv-TzVWUc

joking



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:

Can they?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcUv-TzVWUc

joking

I was running 5760x1080 and then 7680x1440 during the Xbox 360 era, which was higher than 4k on 4x Radeon 6950's unlocked into 6970's... When console games struggled to be 1280x720... And yet we still had console gamers praising -insert game here- as the second coming of Jesus in the graphics department.

Today I could replace those panels for 11520x2160 which a few Turing cards might turn up decent results. That is insane pixel counting.

Obviously ditched all that and went with a single 2560x1440 panel and simply upgraded less often, my bank account thanks me for it.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Pemalite said:
goopy20 said:

"especially considering PC developers aren’t yet building games that take advantage of such speeds. That may change in the future when both new consoles arrive and, as Sweeney predicts, inspire significant upgrades to PC component design and PC-specific game development.

StarCitizen.

goopy20 said:

I just think next gen consoles should be about pushing overall visuals and seeing new gameplay experiences that aren't possible on current gen. Its normal that 3rd party developers release a ton of cross gen titles but its the 1st party developers that should be setting a new standard early on. Just a bump in resolution and fps isn't that imo. That's why I prefer Sony's strategy much better than MS's smart delivery thing. Not saying native 4k and 120fps isn't awesome, but that is what pc is for. 

How many exclusives really push a Playstation or Xbox every year?

It's the exception of game releases not the overall norm.

goopy20 said:

"especially considering PC developers aren’t yet building games that take advantage of such speeds. That may change in the future when both new consoles arrive and, as Sweeney predicts, inspire significant upgrades to PC component design and PC-specific game development.

StarCitizen.

goopy20 said:

Consoles are always going to be the base platform for 99% of the developers, so if they're aiming for native 4k on consoles already, what would be the point of buying a RTX3080? Maybe Ray Tracing could make the pc versions stand out, but I don't think we will see full blown path tracing in multiplatform games on high end pc's. More likely we will see toggle on/ off Raytracing like we're seeing now on RTX cards that ad some reflections here and there. Not because full dynamic path tracing isn't doable on next gen gpu's, but more because of parity with consoles.

The PC aren't the consoles.

Why do PC gamers buy the latest and greatest? Simple really.  Consoles tend to go with around medium-quality settings comparative to the PC, we can sink all that extra processing into chasing those higher visuals on the PC, which is why the PC has the best graphics.

For example many console games leverage Screen-Space Ambient Occlusion where-as on PC games will typically run with Horizon Based Ambient Occlusion, it's more expensive, it's higher quality. - Console gamers probably won't tell the difference as they aren't sitting just a foot away from a display, but on a PC panel, you can certainly tell the difference.

The PC just has better quality visual settings which are more demanding on hardware, consoles are all about a game of sacrifices, the extra performance saved by opting for SSAO means a developer might be able to invest a little extra processing into improving the lighting of a scene... The PC can just have it all.

Not only that... 4k is all well and good, but you do realize the PC can have resolutions higher than 8k?

None of this is free on hardware.

Star Citizen is the only exception on pc, and even that wasn't full designed around SSD as you can play it with a HDD as well.

I know multi platform games will always have higher graphics settings on pc. However, the core game is typically still designed around base consoles. Things like SSD and Ray Tracing have been around for a long, long time but there's a reason why developers aren’t yet building games that truly take advantage of them.

That's my problem with the strategy behind Series X. It has amazing hardware but they're taking a very pc-like approach, where core games will be designed for much weaker hardware and all those precious Tflops are "wasted" on things like 4k and higher graphics settings. Things that, like you said, most people won't notice when your sitting quite a distance away from the tv. Console games shouldn't be about scalability, developers should be allowed to push the limits of the hardware to get the best results out of it. 

I mean you could take a Xone game like Gears 5, crank the settings up to ultra/4k and it would be impossible to hit 60fps on a RTX2070 Super already.

But here's the thing, would you consider Gears 5 in ultra settings a true next gen game? Because that seems to be MS's definition of what next gen gaming is about. Sony is doing it the old fashioned way and are all about raising fidelity first and looking at fps/resolution later. The reason why that UE5 demo looked so impressive isn't because it's impossible to run it on anything but a ps5. It's because it was the first time ever that we got to see what a RTX2080 and a NVME SSD could potentially do, besides running current gen games in 4k, inefficient graphics settings and faster loading times. What some people don't seem to grasp it that if it was running in 4k/ 60fps with ray tracing enabled, it probably wouldn't have looked the way it did.

That's why I think we'll be seeing a lot of 1st party games at MS's July event running in 4k/60fps on Series X, while Sony will be showing games running in 30fps/1440p. MAybe some peope care more about 4k than others but we've already seen how the masses are going to react to both strategies and which platform is going to have the bigger next gen wow factor.

Last edited by goopy20 - on 07 June 2020

LudicrousSpeed said:
goopy20 said:

It wan't just a 20 minute inside Xbox video, it was the first official look at what MS said were next gen games running on Series X. It was an open goal for MS to kick off next gen gaming and you don't have to be a mind reader to get why it bombed so hard. Just look at the comments...

"Really disappointed, nothing really caught my eye. Felt like these games can be on the Xbox one."

"Thats one small step up in graphics. One giant leap in console prices"

"Some of these "gameplays" have worse graphics than current games. What a waste of teraflops."

"So far I haven’t spotted a difference that human eyes can see"

There was nothing really wrong with the games themselves, some actually looked pretty cool. Also, MS showed exactly what they've been promising for months. Games that, just like pc, scale up and down their family of devices and will run the best on Series X. Like I said, it all sounded great on paper when no games were shown. But now that they have, people were pissed. 

Now for arguments sake, lets say they're going to do the same thing at July's event and we'll just be seeing 1st party Xbox One games with an optimized for Series X logo. Can you then honestly say you're not going to be disappointed? 

And I’m sure in your usual optimistic way, you expect all the games in their July “conference” to look as “disappointing” as some found them to be during the Inside Xbox “conference”. I’m not sure why I’m supposed to care about what others thought or why it is relevant to the discussion. 

There were next gen only games in the “conference”. Per usual you are getting your facts wrong.

If you will be disappointed totally depends on your exceptions of what next gen games should be about. If you're expecting Xone games like Halo Infinite, Forza 8 to be amazing and running on ultra settings, 60fps and some ray tracing effects on Series X, you probably won't be disappointed. However, if you're hoping to see games that are unlike any current gen games running on a high-end pc, you probably will be.  

And no, there weren't any next gen only games at the Series X first look event. There were a couple of games that were pc and series X, but that doesn't mean you're going to need a SSD and RTX2080 to run them. Hell, this is what Scorn looks like running on a pc in 2017: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpk4p5AriPs or Bright Memory: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWgOHjAyiyk

It's the same thing with Godfall on ps5, which also isn't going to get people super excited for next gen games as the pc requirements will probably be a lot lower than what's in these next gen consoles.

Last edited by goopy20 - on 07 June 2020

DonFerrari said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Just implying or pointing out the fact many will be early adopters of 9th gen consoles for superior experiences of cross gen games.

You COULD just keep playing your 8th gen hardware, there will be cross gen content for a couple years. Yet many will upgrade and it seems like cross gen disparity will be bigger this time.

And from those many very few will be buying their new console to play older games on it, crossgen sure they will play some (but the newer version) but very few will buy the new console to replay their old games.

Yes that seems to be logical indeed,most just play the games they still want to play on the old console before buying the new gen.