Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Xbox Series X's cross-gen approach is robbing players of the next-gen thrill

goopy20 said:
Mr Puggsly said:
"Where was the pizzazz? The mind-blowing graphics? The huge step in gaming experiences that we've been waiting for?"

I think these morons forget we didn't really have that in 2013 either. Most was cross gen, while the next gen exclusives weren't amazing. Some of the most impressive games this gen came years later or will be here at the end.

Anyhow, another great find by goopy.

We've been through this many times. It isn't so much about the quality of the early next gen titles. People just want to be amazed by these next gen consoles. Even Knack 3, looking like that Unreal demo is going to get people more excited than most cross platform games. Maybe they'll not rush out to buy it, but they'll be excited about the promise of what's next. Sure, you could say games like Infamous SS and Shadowfall were glorified tech demo's but they were still a very important marketing tool to showcase their hardware and get people fired up for next gen. Hell, we've just seen that even an actual engine tech demo gets people more excited than any of the cross gen games MS showed so far.

Maybe MS will show us the good stuff in July, but if that'll just be their usual exclusives with an "optimized for Series X" logo, won't they get the same reaction as their last conference? 

Are you saying you want to see games years away from release so you can get your graphic fix.  That is all find and dandy but it means, I can wait years from the PS5 or XSX release date until that eye candy is realize.  This is the problem with showing games that are not even close to releasing when a new gen starts.  Yes it may hype you up but it also means you can easily wait until that dream is realize.

Now personally, when either console release, I want to see what games will be playable within that year.  If I am going to spend my money on release, there needs to be games that show its worth the money.  I rather have more realistic graphical features and expectations on release than tech demo or a game trailer that is 2 to 3 years from coming out.  Its find to have a few of those future type of trailers but more realistic games on release is preferable to me.  I already know we will see some good stuff mid gen for either console and PC.



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HollyGamer said:
Conina said:

So in your opinion PS4 also has potato specs, since two third of the Steam PCs are already faster.

But Sony first party already focusing on next gen after TLOU2 and Ghost of Tsushima.

Sony still hasn't announced their 2021 games and which of them will be only PS4, only on PS5 or on both. So far it is pure speculation.

Sony will move away from PS4 that's for sure so.

Probably, but not "for sure".

Also your claim about two third steam user are already faster is still not proving anything, i made a thread about how PC will be changing and most of the reply most of PC gamer don't want to upgrade and wait to upgrading.

That's wrong! You claimed that PC gamers will have to upgrade this winter when they still want to play the newest 2021 games. Wanting to upgrade and the necessity to upgrade are two totally different things.

Also not all game gaming on Steam some of them use Epic, GOG and pirated games. 

Then show us the hardware surveys of Epic, Origin und Uplay... have you indications that the average hardware specs on these platforms are lower than on Steam? Probably not, since most PC gamers will have a combination of Steam and one or more other launchers.

GOG may be an exception, since their focus is on older games and indie games (The Witcher 3 + Cyberpunk 2077 are the only exceptions that come to mind).

And who cares about the PC specs of dirty pirates? Publishers and developers won't and the rest of us shouldn't either.

Last edited by Conina - on 17 May 2020

Kyuu said:
Smart Delivery and CrossGen aren't he same thing. Without Smart Delivery, CrossGen would still exist, but in a crappy anti-consumer form if you will. I'm all for Smart Delivery.

MS's marketing team did a good job coining it as Smart Delivery, but isn't it what they've been doing for years now on X1X? I mean what's the difference between games patched for X1X and the "optimized for Series X" logo? 



goopy20 said:
Shiken said:
So being pro consumer is now letting down said consumers....?

Kinda looks like it considering the reactions both companies got on their stream. Personally, I also find it odd. For months MS has been telling us about their next gen strategy and most thought it was great. Everybody and their grandmother was applauding "Smart delivery" but now that they finally showed those games and they didn't have that wow factor, people were disappointed. 

Seems some people still don't realize that the "wow factor" that used to be present with new hardware died with the PS360.  We will never see leaps like we used to.

There will be some visual improvements sure, but most of what these leaps will entail will be more geared toward physics, special effects, and AI moving forward.



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Conina said:
HollyGamer said:

But Sony first party already focusing on next gen after TLOU2 and Ghost of Tsushima.

Sony still hasn't announced their 2021 games and which of them will be only PS4, only on PS5 or on both. So far it is pure speculation.

Sony will move away from PS4 that's for sure so.

Probably, but not "for sure".

Also your claim about two third steam user are already faster is still not proving anything, i made a thread about how PC will be changing and most of the reply most of PC gamer don't want to upgrade and wait to upgrading.

That's wrong! You claimed that PC gamers will have to upgrade this winter when they still want to play the newest 2021 games. Wanting to upgrade and the necessity to upgrade are two totally different things.

Also not all game gaming on Steam some of them use Epic, GOG and pirated games. 

Then show us the hardware surveys of Epic, Origin und Uplay... have you indications that the average hardware specs on these platforms are lower than on Steam? Probably not, since most PC gamers will have a combination of Steam and one or more other launchers.

GOG may be an exception, since their focus is on older games and indie games (The Witcher 3 + Cyberpunk 2077 are the only exceptions that come to mind).

And who cares about the PC specs of dirty pirates? Publishers and developers won't and the rest of us shouldn't either.

It's obvious it's just everyone opinion based on Sony Studios current and past behavior. Which also back up my many jurno and other business insider and Sony it self 

They have not announced doesn't mean then dont have, they will announce it in June to July

I never said they have to upgrade, i am just suggesting and  just saying if they want to keep the rig which is natural way in every damn electronic stuff because new GPU is coming and the old on will be replaced and new tech is coming,  Unless they enjoy current one and choosing the option to wait and see.  

Well that's why Steam is not the rule of thumb, on top of that next gen is not just about GPU, unlike PS4 and Xbox One which has unremakrable CPU and Storage  . Next gen will include 8 core CPU with multi threading capability, a good amount of SSD which is NVME will be the standard and at least RX 5700 XT. So the upgrade is very crazy actually.

 



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goopy20 said:
Kyuu said:
Smart Delivery and CrossGen aren't he same thing. Without Smart Delivery, CrossGen would still exist, but in a crappy anti-consumer form if you will. I'm all for Smart Delivery.

MS's marketing team did a good job coining it as Smart Delivery, but isn't it what they've been doing for years now on X1X? I mean what's the difference between games patched for X1X and the "optimized for Series X" logo? 

Technically it is the same, but Xbox One + Xbox One S + Xbox One X were counted as the same generation and between them the compatibility was mandatory. Only a part of the total XBO-library got enhanced versions for the Xbox One X.

With "smart delivery" as an option, third parties aren't forced to further enhance XBO + XBO X games for the Series X and they aren't forced to support XBO + XBO X for their new games.

XBO games will be compatible to the Xbox Series, but if the developers/publishers want to advertise them with "smart delivery", they have to enhance these games (further) on the new hardware. It is a good indicator for consumers if a game gets optimized to the new hardware or is just a lazy port.



If it's consumer friendly in your opinion then you can't complain about it. Should have stopped there or not calling it consumer friendly.

A simple PS5 logo got also hyped up and that after MS showed their console already. Everything what Sony does will get hyped up even If it's nothing. That's the Internet and crazy fans for you

MS will show their big guns months before release. Not sure why this May event is such a big thing for many. We also got trailers for games coming to PS5 already which didn't blow minds.

Will Xbox exclusives look as good as PS5 exvlusives or even better? No idea...the last years Sony devs definitely showed more skill if it comes to graphics or some tricks to let games look better. Could be the same next gen but who knows



goopy20 said:
Mr Puggsly said:
"Where was the pizzazz? The mind-blowing graphics? The huge step in gaming experiences that we've been waiting for?"

I think these morons forget we didn't really have that in 2013 either. Most was cross gen, while the next gen exclusives weren't amazing. Some of the most impressive games this gen came years later or will be here at the end.

Anyhow, another great find by goopy.

We've been through this many times. It isn't so much about the quality of the early next gen titles. People just want to be amazed by these next gen consoles. Even Knack 3, looking like that Unreal demo is going to get people more excited than most cross platform games. Maybe they'll not rush out to buy it, but they'll be excited about the promise of what's next. Sure, you could say games like Infamous SS and Shadowfall were glorified tech demo's but they were still a very important marketing tool to showcase their hardware and get people fired up for next gen. Hell, we've just seen that even an actual engine tech demo gets people more excited than any of the cross gen games MS showed so far.

Maybe MS will show us the good stuff in July, but if that'll just be their usual exclusives with an "optimized for Series X" logo, won't they get the same reaction as their last conference? 

So you're suggesting we need developers to focus on making great looking games... even if consumers aren't gonna buy it? Quite honestly, that's stupid. If Killzone:SF got people excited about next gen then more people would have bought it. Instead other cross gen shooters did much better. I think we ultimately learned that logic is flawed.

Consumers rather throw their money at a cross gen game (with improved visuals and performance) than a mediocre visual showcase.

I think its also worth considering the mid gen upgrades took some of the wind out next gen. Because they already delivered on some performance and resolution upgrades we expect for next gen. So when developers advertise something like 4K many just say, "meh."

Look Jack, here's the deal. Ideally we should want good games that push next gen specs, but I'm not gonna request mediocre games with pretty graphics.



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Shiken said:
goopy20 said:

Kinda looks like it considering the reactions both companies got on their stream. Personally, I also find it odd. For months MS has been telling us about their next gen strategy and most thought it was great. Everybody and their grandmother was applauding "Smart delivery" but now that they finally showed those games and they didn't have that wow factor, people were disappointed. 

Seems some people still don't realize that the "wow factor" that used to be present with new hardware died with the PS360.  We will never see leaps like we used to.

There will be some visual improvements sure, but most of what these leaps will entail will be more geared toward physics, special effects, and AI moving forward.

Dint Geoff Keelly said thats a absurd prediction? And shortly after the UE5 tech demo blew everyone away so why still make this kind of remark? 



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

Mr Puggsly said:
goopy20 said:

We've been through this many times. It isn't so much about the quality of the early next gen titles. People just want to be amazed by these next gen consoles. Even Knack 3, looking like that Unreal demo is going to get people more excited than most cross platform games. Maybe they'll not rush out to buy it, but they'll be excited about the promise of what's next. Sure, you could say games like Infamous SS and Shadowfall were glorified tech demo's but they were still a very important marketing tool to showcase their hardware and get people fired up for next gen. Hell, we've just seen that even an actual engine tech demo gets people more excited than any of the cross gen games MS showed so far.

Maybe MS will show us the good stuff in July, but if that'll just be their usual exclusives with an "optimized for Series X" logo, won't they get the same reaction as their last conference? 

So you're suggesting we need developers to focus on making great looking games... even if consumers aren't gonna buy it? Quite honestly, that's stupid. If Killzone:SF got people excited about next gen then more people would have bought it. Instead other cross gen shooters did much better. I think we ultimately learned that logic is flawed.

Consumers rather throw their money at a cross gen game (with improved visuals and performance) than a mediocre visual showcase.

I think its also worth considering the mid gen upgrades took some of the wind out next gen. Because they already delivered on some performance and resolution upgrades we expect for next gen. So when developers advertise something like 4K many just say, "meh."

Look Jack, here's the deal. Ideally we should want good games that push next gen specs, but I'm not gonna request mediocre games with pretty graphics.

Yeah during this whole Xbone cross gen ordeal, people have been forgetting conveniently that launches are typically cross gen games and pretty games that don't offer much of anything new but sure look good. Even goop in one of his many threads about it, started out saying Microsoft would be robbing customers of unique gameplay experiences only made possible by new gen but quickly shifted to pretty graphics once multiple people reminded him that the PS4 launch games he was listing offered nothing new plus PS4 was chock full of tons of cross gen content during its first couple years. Look at this UE5 demo, looked gameplay wise like it could have been any different number of generic action titles from the last gen or two, just with graphics turned up to 12. It's difficult to know which narrative to follow, but something tells me when July hits and the first party XSX games look fantastic, we'll be shifting back to the whole "well they are just upscaled Xbone games!!".

Games like Killzone 6 or Ryse were perfect launch games. The Order would have been a good launch game. Infamous was good for launch. But we're not still seeing those types of games for a reason. Idk why this writer is expecting mid/late gen magic from a third party showcase. And no one has even touched on the COVID effect yet. She wanted CDPR and Activision and other big guns, maybe they could have been there if everyone wasn't working from home.

You made a good point regarding mid gen upgrades, too. This is the first gen where we are launching after the previous gen had upgrades. It's bound to change things.