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Forums - Sony Discussion - SPOILERS The Last Of Us P2 SPOILERS

vonny said:
John2290 said:
I thought they said they wouldn't make TLOU2 if they didn't have a story to tell and why would they even think, any large portion of the people who praised TLOU would go along with a revenge story. My main criticism of this, something I've siad since the cultist trailer dropped, is it's a revenge story and now we know that that is true and the execution from a glance looks shoddy as fuck. Maybe it works better on screen but I highly doubt it and lord I hope Abby isn't transgender or they used the extra time to scrub that out cause it just adds salt to the wound, I mean a post apocalypse transgender person it just doesn't add up.

NaughtyDog have gone way past the point of addin things to there games for the sake of adding them already, like turning Chloe half Indian but It didn't bother me all too much, now though, it's really starting to stink of a forceful hand instead of an organic creation... okay that's not entirely true I nearly stopped playing LL because Chloe's ethnicity change was such a fucking weird choice for them to make and eventually did stop cause the dialouge in that game was like somrthing out of a disney star wars film. That change had absolutely no reason and that's what exactly why it bothered me, they add these things in but fail to have them make sense or have a purpose aside from stroking their Californian collective smugness. I want new and unique themes explored so it fucking bugs me as to why these people can't leave it on the cutting room floor if you can't make it work cause you're only having other media producers avoid it when it fails.

She's not the leak footage clearly shows that, people are jumping to conclusion and pasting together a narrative that's not even hinted at it. We played as joel for 3/4 of game, we now will play as Abby for 1/2 of game... why do people think ND can't build that character up to be someone we care about. When Joel almost died in the first game that was half way... ask you're self did you care about him them? Well that's the same amount time we will get with Abby.

Because she killed someone that you admitted players spent more time actually playing as. Also fighting Ellie as a final boss. The image of Abby choking out Ellie is very unsettling, and not in a good way. Compared to Abby (the shot of her arm muscles in particular) Ellie looks like a defenceless victim. And this is the other fan favourite that you spend the first half of the game playing as, on top of the first games character building. Killing Joel and forcing the gamer to beat Ellie within an inch of her life makes any character building of Abby by ND a seriously uphill battle. 



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sales2099 said:
vonny said:

She's not the leak footage clearly shows that, people are jumping to conclusion and pasting together a narrative that's not even hinted at it. We played as joel for 3/4 of game, we now will play as Abby for 1/2 of game... why do people think ND can't build that character up to be someone we care about. When Joel almost died in the first game that was half way... ask you're self did you care about him them? Well that's the same amount time we will get with Abby.

Because she killed someone that you admitted players spent more time actually playing as. Also fighting Ellie as a final boss. The image of Abby choking out Ellie is very unsettling, and not in a good way. Compared to Abby (the shot of her arm muscles in particular) Ellie looks like a defenceless victim. And this is the other fan favourite that you spend the first half of the game playing as, on top of the first games character building. Killing Joel and forcing the gamer to beat Ellie within an inch of her life makes any character building of Abby by ND a seriously uphill battle. 

Ellie is not a defenseless victim, she's killed dozen of Abby's friend by that point. You reap what you sow and Joel and Ellie have caused nothing but pain we cna love the characters but we weren't meant to side with their actions.

So it's going to be challenging? Yea sure that what makes it interesting, so maybe people stop complaining and she how they actually tackle her development and if they fail to make a connection than complain other wise it's pissing into the wind 



While it wasn't a 10/10 for me like it is for many, I did enjoy the first game, and I've always loved Naughty Dog, so it's been pretty sad hearing all this shit surrounding them right now. Eventually caved and decided to spoil it, and yeah I definitely don't approve of possibly the main characters dying to make room for someone of no consequence to the original game. If Abby's connection to the main characters is really one of those no name doctors with half a minute of screen time, seems like a good sign this sequel was forced and not well planned. Once we see the execution my view could change, but I'm not confident. It strangely feels like this has happened before, hmm.

vonny said:

Ellie is not a defenseless victim, she's killed dozen of Abby's friend by that point. You reap what you sow and Joel and Ellie have caused nothing but pain we cna love the characters but we weren't meant to side with their actions.

So it's going to be challenging? Yea sure that what makes it interesting, so maybe people stop complaining and she how they actually tackle her development and if they fail to make a connection than complain other wise it's pissing into the wind 

Complaining about about complainers is pissing to the wind as it will achieve nothing. If the game turns out great, then the complainers will stop complaining and likely become avid praisers, so you don't need to defend a million dollar company by trying to stop them. Also, criticism is not pissing into the wind, it's how anything gets better. While criticisms aren't always 100% valid, at least you know they care actually about the game and want it to be good.



Killing off a main character that the player has a bond to, and then have the player take control of the killer is a risky move for sure, as the writers risk losing the player if that transition is executed poorly. But at the same time it's decisions like these that ultimately moves writing forward and expand the ways for how we can tell stories in games. As far as I'm concerned it's also a great example of how gaming as a medium can take writing to places that books and films can not, in how games forces us to not only view the story from the perspective of the antagonist but also interact with that character. To me that's intriguing.



vonny said:
sales2099 said:

Because she killed someone that you admitted players spent more time actually playing as. Also fighting Ellie as a final boss. The image of Abby choking out Ellie is very unsettling, and not in a good way. Compared to Abby (the shot of her arm muscles in particular) Ellie looks like a defenceless victim. And this is the other fan favourite that you spend the first half of the game playing as, on top of the first games character building. Killing Joel and forcing the gamer to beat Ellie within an inch of her life makes any character building of Abby by ND a seriously uphill battle. 

Ellie is not a defenseless victim, she's killed dozen of Abby's friend by that point. You reap what you sow and Joel and Ellie have caused nothing but pain we cna love the characters but we weren't meant to side with their actions.

So it's going to be challenging? Yea sure that what makes it interesting, so maybe people stop complaining and she how they actually tackle her development and if they fail to make a connection than complain other wise it's pissing into the wind 

You can’t tell fans to not side with characters they are attached to without some form of blowback. Until the game comes out the leaks and characters fans know are all there is to talk about. 

Complaining gets things to change. It happens because people care. Complainers are literally people telling the company how to earn their money. I firmly believe ND put their personal message above fans, and they will make themselves heard. 

Last edited by sales2099 - on 04 May 2020

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sales2099 said:
vonny said:

Ellie is not a defenseless victim, she's killed dozen of Abby's friend by that point. You reap what you sow and Joel and Ellie have caused nothing but pain we cna love the characters but we weren't meant to side with their actions.

So it's going to be challenging? Yea sure that what makes it interesting, so maybe people stop complaining and she how they actually tackle her development and if they fail to make a connection than complain other wise it's pissing into the wind 

You can’t tell fans to not side with characters they are attached to without some form of blowback. Until the game comes out the leaks and characters fans know are all there is to talk about. 

Complaining gets things to change. It happens because people care. Complainers are literally people telling the company how to earn their money. I firmly believe ND put their personal message above fans, and they will make themselves heard. 

I can't wait to play this. Either Druckman has gone completely bat shit crazy and actually forces people to play half the game as the most hated character in video game history. Or... all the leaks are completely taken out of context and it will be another master piece. If it's the first, I'll still want to see how bad the story is, but I have enough faith in ND to think its the later.

People are all going bunkers about Abby killing Ellie as the final boss and are convinced that's the whole plot. However, didn't we already see that Abby spares her and her pregnant gf after the boss fight? Doesn't look like the end of the game to me and I'm sure there's more to the story than just some angry she-hulk killing of all our beloved characters. My bet is that the game will raise a lot of questions as to who the good guys and the villains are but that it will end on a emotional, positive note. A bit like Westworld season 3.  

Last edited by goopy20 - on 06 May 2020

Interesting tweet from Troy Baker who voices Joel. 

"Posting this because I want to. 

Because I believe in this team.

Because I’ve waited six years to experience this story as it was intended. 

Because you might think you know.

But you don’t.

Because I’m proud of this game.

Because I chose to be a part of it.

Because I AM Joel."

Ive bolded 2 of the sentences. It's obvious the gameplay leaks are real as they're there for us to see but maybe some of the text leaks might be false?! 



PSN ID: Stokesy 

Add me if you want but let me know youre from this website

goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

You can’t tell fans to not side with characters they are attached to without some form of blowback. Until the game comes out the leaks and characters fans know are all there is to talk about. 

Complaining gets things to change. It happens because people care. Complainers are literally people telling the company how to earn their money. I firmly believe ND put their personal message above fans, and they will make themselves heard. 

I can't wait to play this. Either Druckman has gone completely bat shit crazy and actually forces people to play half the game as the most hated character in video game history. Or... all the leaks are completely taken out of context and it will be another master piece. If it's the first, I'll still want to see how bad the story is, but I have enough faith in ND to think its the later.

People are all going bunkers about Abby killing Ellie as the final boss and are convinced that's the whole plot. However, didn't we already see that Abby spares her and her pregnant gf after the boss fight? Doesn't look like the end of the game to me and I'm sure there's more to the story than just some angry she-hulk killing of all our beloved characters. My bet is that the game will raise a lot of questions as to who the good guys and the villains are but that it will end on a emotional, positive note. A bit like Westworld season 3.  

Pretty sure Ellie doesn’t die, and the core speculation is that the game ends on a note where “revenge never ending cycle”, “nobody is good or bad”, and “revenge doesn’t bring closure you wanted”. All profound themes, however it is dampened by playing as the “she hulk” beating Ellie within an inch of her life, coupled with Joel earlier. For your sake I hope that isn’t the ending and there is more after that. 

My bias aside I know the gameplay will be near flawless and story in between the major scenes will be very well done. Probably a feminist comment thrown in occasionally but I don’t see it being a common occurrence. It’ll end up being like Star Wars Last Jedi: Critical acclaim but vocal angry core fans. Will sell millions, though I doubt it will sell more then the first. 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

StokedUp said:

Interesting tweet from Troy Baker who voices Joel. 

"Posting this because I want to. 

Because I believe in this team.

Because I’ve waited six years to experience this story as it was intended. 

Because you might think you know.

But you don’t.

Because I’m proud of this game.

Because I chose to be a part of it.

Because I AM Joel."

Ive bolded 2 of the sentences. It's obvious the gameplay leaks are real as they're there for us to see but maybe some of the text leaks might be false?! 

I'm sure the cut scenes are real, but they're missing context and now everybody is taking it for fact that the story is some insane SJW revenge story. The text leaks got mostly debunked, though. Like Abby being a transsexual and that she end up slaughtering Ellie. Not sure about the part where you get to play half the game as Abby, but maybe there are just some sequences and you end up playing mostly as Ellie. Ahh well, hopefully the new trailer will shed some light on it. 



StokedUp said:

"Because I AM Joel."

Then you are also dead.

There better be more to story than this. Abby needs to have bigger goals and ambitions beyond just killing Joel. I'm not super confident this will be the case, there's still the fact that her link to the main characters is an extremely thin and lazy excuse for this game's existence. Using their logic:

Last of Us Part 3 - Turns out a random no name Abby killed on her revenge quest has a cousin named Tom. We never saw or heard of him, but now he's out to get revenge on Abby.

Last of Us Part 4 - Turns out a random no name Tom killed on his revenge quest has a grandma named Joan. We never saw or heard of her, but now she's out to get revenge on Tom.