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Forums - Sony Discussion - Sony World Wide Studio Boss Hermen Hulst Q&A - Confirms Horizon Zero Dawn Coming To PC This Summer

Azzanation said:
Hopefully Sony see the protential of sales and profit rom Horizon on PC and realize holding games hostage isnt the best strategy anymore which will lead to more money for Sony and an even bigger audience for fhere games.

Completely wrong. Having exclusives is the reason PS1/2 was dominating, is the reason the PS3 was able to gain traction and why the PS4 remains dominant. 

Exclusives -> larger userbase -> larger platform software sales -> larger sub counts -> more money to invest into exclusives and such



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While PC fans will continue to port beg, realistically this seems more like a combination of Decima already being on the platform and Horizon 2 coming presumably soon.
I think Sony will realise that the small software sales they will get on PC are not worth the brand hit of losing exclusives.



Cerebralbore101 said:

It's true that consoles cost money to make and research. My estimate was an extreme lowball though. There's easily enough wiggle room in those numbers to make R&D costs and production costs disappear. 

Competition increasing? From what? Streaming? Stadia and the like are the 3D0 and Jaguar of the 2020's. 

Yes, less console sales hurts shareholders. 

As far as mainline home consoles go Nintendo has a pretty good track record for messing up. N64, Gamecube, and Wii U were all failures. NES, SNES, and Wii were successes. It's no surprise that a company that had two console sales failures (N64 and GC), followed by a huge hit (Wii), would drop back to low sales a gen later. So I wouldn't attribute that to luck. 

Xbox did indeed slip up, but Sony definitely handled this gen well. They made all the right decisions. Sony's excellent studios, good gameplay focused hardware, and consumer friendly stance took the market just as much as Xbox gave it away. 

I don't think Xbox will have a resurgence at all. They face a Sony that is coming off a PS4 high note, and horrible sales of the XB1 this late in the gen. If it does though, that would be a result of Sony throwing all their exclusives onto other platforms, and basically giving up on the strength of their brand. Even then though, I don't see Xbox ever passing 65 million lifetime sales ever again. 

Sony is basically Nintendo, but with full blown 3rd party support. They've raised their 1st party content up to Nintendo's level, while still getting pretty much every 3rd party AAA game. And remember there's way more money to be lost by abandoning their brand, than there is from a few extra PC sales. 

What Sony really needs to do is focus on improving the PS brand, while making PSNow a serious competitor to gamepass. That way when streaming eventually takes over, in ten years, they can dominate the streaming market as much as they dominated the console market. Instead, they seem hellbent on pulling a MS, and becoming a 3rd party developer that just happens to have a console on the side. 

The PS2 is considered the best selling console in history yet the 360 came out and halved Sonys Userbase.

The Wii was Nintendos best selling home console followed by there weakest selling in the WiiU.

Just because the PS4 sold so well doesnt mean its an autosuccess for the PS5. Those two points above prove my point.

Xbox is on the surge upwards, your lack of respect for the PS5s competitor is exactly what happen when the PS3 launched against the 360.

The console market is only so big, gamers will have more choices not less. The PS4 did not kill off its competition, it only created it.

src said:

Completely wrong. Having exclusives is the reason PS1/2 was dominating, is the reason the PS3 was able to gain traction and why the PS4 remains dominant. 

Exclusives -> larger userbase -> larger platform software sales -> larger sub counts -> more money to invest into exclusives and such

Larger Userbase increases by increasing your audience not reducing it.

WiiU, Gamecube, N64, Dreamcast all had exclusives, what happened there?



src said:
While PC fans will continue to port beg, realistically this seems more like a combination of Decima already being on the platform and Horizon 2 coming presumably soon.
I think Sony will realise that the small software sales they will get on PC are not worth the brand hit of losing exclusives.

Even if Horizon 2 is coming to ps5, all ps4 games will be backwards compatible on ps5, so every single ps4 exclusive will be a reason to buy a ps5. Sony shouldn't put either ps4 or ps5 exclusives on PC.

Ps3 would be another story because they will not be on ps4 or ps5.

The very reason why sony is ahead of xbox in sales is because of the exclusives, take that away and the market will change.

If it wasn't for ps4 exclusives, everyone would have gone to xbox X on sales. It has more power, smaller design, backwards compatibility and quiet fan and better services.

In fact I had left ps4 behind when I bought my X on launch day, the thing that made me come back was

1 - exclusive games (but xbox has great exclusives too, such as Recore, Gears 5, Forza horizon 4, Forza 7, Halo collection

2 - VR which was more impressive than I ever imagined, why is Microsoft not focusing on VR? Blows my mind that Sony has that huge advantage and Microsoft doesn't seem to care. It really is important, its the future, and sony is already miles ahead.

In fact the best gaming experience I've had for the past decade was playing table tennis on VR, nothing comes close to that fun. Its a huge step up, the same as when I went from SNES to N64 (2D to 3D)

So much so that if Xbox series X had more power, more exclusives and cheaper price, I'd still choose PS5 just for the next VR.

Last edited by victor83fernandes - on 11 March 2020

Azzanation said:
Cerebralbore101 said:

It's true that consoles cost money to make and research. My estimate was an extreme lowball though. There's easily enough wiggle room in those numbers to make R&D costs and production costs disappear. 

Competition increasing? From what? Streaming? Stadia and the like are the 3D0 and Jaguar of the 2020's. 

Yes, less console sales hurts shareholders. 

As far as mainline home consoles go Nintendo has a pretty good track record for messing up. N64, Gamecube, and Wii U were all failures. NES, SNES, and Wii were successes. It's no surprise that a company that had two console sales failures (N64 and GC), followed by a huge hit (Wii), would drop back to low sales a gen later. So I wouldn't attribute that to luck. 

Xbox did indeed slip up, but Sony definitely handled this gen well. They made all the right decisions. Sony's excellent studios, good gameplay focused hardware, and consumer friendly stance took the market just as much as Xbox gave it away. 

I don't think Xbox will have a resurgence at all. They face a Sony that is coming off a PS4 high note, and horrible sales of the XB1 this late in the gen. If it does though, that would be a result of Sony throwing all their exclusives onto other platforms, and basically giving up on the strength of their brand. Even then though, I don't see Xbox ever passing 65 million lifetime sales ever again. 

Sony is basically Nintendo, but with full blown 3rd party support. They've raised their 1st party content up to Nintendo's level, while still getting pretty much every 3rd party AAA game. And remember there's way more money to be lost by abandoning their brand, than there is from a few extra PC sales. 

What Sony really needs to do is focus on improving the PS brand, while making PSNow a serious competitor to gamepass. That way when streaming eventually takes over, in ten years, they can dominate the streaming market as much as they dominated the console market. Instead, they seem hellbent on pulling a MS, and becoming a 3rd party developer that just happens to have a console on the side. 

The PS2 is considered the best selling console in history yet the 360 came out and halved Sonys Userbase.

The Wii was Nintendos best selling home console followed by there weakest selling in the WiiU.

Just because the PS4 sold so well doesnt mean its an autosuccess for the PS5. Those two points above prove my point.

Xbox is on the surge upwards, your lack of respect for the PS5s competitor is exactly what happen when the PS3 launched against the 360.

The console market is only so big, gamers will have more choices not less. The PS4 did not kill off its competition, it only created it.

src said:

Completely wrong. Having exclusives is the reason PS1/2 was dominating, is the reason the PS3 was able to gain traction and why the PS4 remains dominant. 

Exclusives -> larger userbase -> larger platform software sales -> larger sub counts -> more money to invest into exclusives and such

Larger Userbase increases by increasing your audience not reducing it.

WiiU, Gamecube, N64, Dreamcast all had exclusives, what happened there?

Wrong, playstation is destined to succeed no matter what, PS1, ps2, ps3 and ps4 were huge successes. The brand name alone guarantees it, even more next gen because its backwards compatible.

It doesn't matter the specs, or price or design, or quality or games, it will succeed, no questions about it. 

Xbox OG was a failure (25million vs 150million), xbox one too(50million vs 108million)), only the 360 was successful, and only because they had the cheap DVD with no wi-fi and no hard drive, and launched 1 year ahead of ps3. That won't happen this time around

But that 360 success is misleading, they had only 3 months warranty, and a lot of consoles were breaking due to RROD, so many of those sales were replacements, how do I know this? Because it happened to me, twice, I had the original replaced, and then the arcade version replaced, only my slim model survived. I'd go as far as to say at least 25 million consoles were replacements. So those 360 numbers were inflated, and even then ps3 outsold it anyway.

Here in Europe the 360 was 360euros, the ps3 was 600euros, and sony still outsold it with one year less of sales.

PS - Things could change if USA would conquer Japan, then xbox could have a shot at outselling the playstation. Maybe hundreds of years from now.



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Pemalite said:
victor83fernandes said:

That wont happen, ps3 games are too difficult to port to PC architecture. Its way easier to port ps4 games. Developers will not take the time and huge effort to port ps3 games that probably wouldn't sell anyway.

The vast majority of PS3 games are multi-platforms and are already on PC.

The rest can be emulated.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:PlayStation_3-only_games
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_PlayStation_3_games


https://rpcs3.net/

Conversely, the bulk of the Playstation 3 exclusives have already been remastered and re-released on the Playstation 4 anyway, which means porting to PC would be a synch.

The PC ports are usually ps4 versions of those games, not ps3 versions, I hope you know Uncharted is on ps4. 

PS3 games are possible with a lot of work, I didn't say it wasn't possible, learn to read.

Just far too much work to make it worth it when those games are already very old.

Lets take a look at a game from ps3 which is not on ps4, metal gear 4, how many sales do you think it would have on pc? 500 000? Possible, but it would be at a much cheaper price, probably 30dollars, and it would take a lot of developer work to make it work.

The cell processor was very difficult to port.

Sure some emulators run ps3 games, but always with bugs, and you need a very powerful PC, and those hackers they work hard on it. How many years did it take for the Uncharted to run perfectly on PC? Does it even run perfectly? I doubt it, I will check that video and read the comments, I am almost sure people will be saying is not perfectly stable.

PS - Just saw the video, wow it looks worse than on my ps4, and gameplay looks dodgy, much smoother on my ps4, so why would anyone buy this if developers made it for pc? Looks outdated full of jaggies, it actually looks nicer on my ps4.

I cant explain it but that game seems to be dragging a lot, have you ever played on ps4? Much faster and smoother.

And that's running on core i9 lol How many people actually have those kinds of PCs, like I said, this thing wouldn't sell well on PC as specs would be high and it would take too much development effort.

After seeing this I don't believe it would ever sell 500 000 on PC, like at all.

Last edited by victor83fernandes - on 11 March 2020

Azzanation said:
Cerebralbore101 said:

It's true that consoles cost money to make and research. My estimate was an extreme lowball though. There's easily enough wiggle room in those numbers to make R&D costs and production costs disappear. 

Competition increasing? From what? Streaming? Stadia and the like are the 3D0 and Jaguar of the 2020's. 

Yes, less console sales hurts shareholders. 

As far as mainline home consoles go Nintendo has a pretty good track record for messing up. N64, Gamecube, and Wii U were all failures. NES, SNES, and Wii were successes. It's no surprise that a company that had two console sales failures (N64 and GC), followed by a huge hit (Wii), would drop back to low sales a gen later. So I wouldn't attribute that to luck. 

Xbox did indeed slip up, but Sony definitely handled this gen well. They made all the right decisions. Sony's excellent studios, good gameplay focused hardware, and consumer friendly stance took the market just as much as Xbox gave it away. 

I don't think Xbox will have a resurgence at all. They face a Sony that is coming off a PS4 high note, and horrible sales of the XB1 this late in the gen. If it does though, that would be a result of Sony throwing all their exclusives onto other platforms, and basically giving up on the strength of their brand. Even then though, I don't see Xbox ever passing 65 million lifetime sales ever again. 

Sony is basically Nintendo, but with full blown 3rd party support. They've raised their 1st party content up to Nintendo's level, while still getting pretty much every 3rd party AAA game. And remember there's way more money to be lost by abandoning their brand, than there is from a few extra PC sales. 

What Sony really needs to do is focus on improving the PS brand, while making PSNow a serious competitor to gamepass. That way when streaming eventually takes over, in ten years, they can dominate the streaming market as much as they dominated the console market. Instead, they seem hellbent on pulling a MS, and becoming a 3rd party developer that just happens to have a console on the side. 

The PS2 is considered the best selling console in history yet the 360 came out and halved Sonys Userbase.

The Wii was Nintendos best selling home console followed by there weakest selling in the WiiU.

Just because the PS4 sold so well doesnt mean its an autosuccess for the PS5. Those two points above prove my point.

Xbox is on the surge upwards, your lack of respect for the PS5s competitor is exactly what happen when the PS3 launched against the 360.

The console market is only so big, gamers will have more choices not less. The PS4 did not kill off its competition, it only created it.

src said:

Completely wrong. Having exclusives is the reason PS1/2 was dominating, is the reason the PS3 was able to gain traction and why the PS4 remains dominant. 

Exclusives -> larger userbase -> larger platform software sales -> larger sub counts -> more money to invest into exclusives and such

Larger Userbase increases by increasing your audience not reducing it.

WiiU, Gamecube, N64, Dreamcast all had exclusives, what happened there?

Larger userbase as in more PS hardware sales.PS has no game selling platform on PC. Removing exclusives will do nothing but reduce hardware sales. It is nonsensical to say removing exclusives somehow leads to more people buying PS5 lol

All those consoles you mention were either unattractive hardware or had little third party support. Neither of these things has ever applied to Playstation so its a silly analogy. 



victor83fernandes said:

The PC ports are usually ps4 versions of those games, not ps3 versions, I hope you know Uncharted is on ps4. 

Obviously you didn't read my post. Like... At all.

victor83fernandes said:

Wrong, playstation is destined to succeed no matter what, PS1, ps2, ps3 and ps4 were huge successes. The brand name alone guarantees it, even more next gen because its backwards compatible.

Just because it has "Playstation" in the name, doesn't mean it will be a success. Playstation Vita anyone?

victor83fernandes said:

Xbox OG was a failure (25million vs 150million), xbox one too(50million vs 108million)), only the 360 was successful, and only because they had the cheap DVD with no wi-fi and no hard drive, and launched 1 year ahead of ps3.

Doesn't matter if a console only sells 10 million or 100 million. Success is defined by how profitable it was.

Otherwise... To me as a consumer I couldn't give two shits about how many units a device sells, as long as I enjoy it.

victor83fernandes said:

PS3 games are possible with a lot of work, I didn't say it wasn't possible, learn to read.

I never said anything to the contrary. Perhaps you lack that fundamental skill that you criticize me for?

victor83fernandes said:

Just far too much work to make it worth it when those games are already very old.

Majority are already on PC.

victor83fernandes said:

Lets take a look at a game from ps3 which is not on ps4, metal gear 4, how many sales do you think it would have on pc? 500 000? Possible, but it would be at a much cheaper price, probably 30dollars, and it would take a lot of developer work to make it work.

PC games have longer legs than console... Fable: The Lost Chapters will often hit the top of the Steam sales charts even after more than a decade, everytime it goes on sale.

On console that generally doesn't happen.

victor83fernandes said:

The cell processor was very difficult to port.

Not as much as you think it is.

victor83fernandes said:

Sure some emulators run ps3 games, but always with bugs, and you need a very powerful PC, and those hackers they work hard on it. How many years did it take for the Uncharted to run perfectly on PC? Does it even run perfectly? I doubt it, I will check that video and read the comments, I am almost sure people will be saying is not perfectly stable.

The irony is... I have provided evidence, you have ignored the evidence and continue to try and push this assertion.

It's not as bad as you make it out to be.

victor83fernandes said:

PS - Just saw the video, wow it looks worse than on my ps4, and gameplay looks dodgy, much smoother on my ps4, so why would anyone buy this if developers made it for pc? Looks outdated full of jaggies, it actually looks nicer on my ps4.

The Playstation 4 cannot run the Playstation 3 version of the game, it's not an Apples to Apples comparison.

Wait until Playstation 4 emulation kicks off, it will look better on PC.

victor83fernandes said:

I cant explain it but that game seems to be dragging a lot, have you ever played on ps4? Much faster and smoother.

You do know I own consoles, right? Like allot of them?

victor83fernandes said:

And that's running on core i9 lol How many people actually have those kinds of PCs, like I said, this thing wouldn't sell well on PC as specs would be high and it would take too much development effort.

An i9 isn't the fastest CPU.

victor83fernandes said:

After seeing this I don't believe it would ever sell 500 000 on PC, like at all.

An emulated game has nothing to do with a ported game, don't conflate the two.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

victor83fernandes said:
Random_Matt said:
Finally, best game of the gen at 144Hz.

It sounds as if you don't have a ps4 and you just saying that because its coming to PC.

I loved the game, but game of the generation? Not really, God of war was better, Zelda was better, red dead redemption 2 was better, Xenoblades X was better, and Spiderman is on par with Horizon. Personally I even preferred Assassins creed 4 over Horizon.

Shit son, opinions. Outside of Odyssey, your list is garbage. Yay, an opinion.



Random_Matt said:
victor83fernandes said:

It sounds as if you don't have a ps4 and you just saying that because its coming to PC.

I loved the game, but game of the generation? Not really, God of war was better, Zelda was better, red dead redemption 2 was better, Xenoblades X was better, and Spiderman is on par with Horizon. Personally I even preferred Assassins creed 4 over Horizon.

Shit son, opinions. Outside of Odyssey, your list is garbage. Yay, an opinion.

Yeah how convenient, list is shit because those games are not on PC lol I bet you also said horizon was shit until they announced it for PC right? I bet if they port God of war and spiderman to PC then magically the games will be best of generation too lol PC gamers are silly.