Cool. She was fantastic in Room and really funny in Scott Pilgrim. Lets hope the sceenplay is any good cause TLJ was a mess and wasted a lot of talent.
Cool. She was fantastic in Room and really funny in Scott Pilgrim. Lets hope the sceenplay is any good cause TLJ was a mess and wasted a lot of talent.
Easy skip then, i skipped CM and will do the same here.
Jaicee said:
I find that unlikely. Or else the people behind #StarWarsFans wouldn't also have been behind the campaigns against everything from Mad Max: Fury Road to Wonder Woman to the new Star Trek to Captain Marvel and every other geeky action movie and series that happens to have a prominent or leading female action character, and they might not create D-grade alternate versions with titles like "The Last Jedi: The De-Feminized Edition" with most of the female characters cut out of the movie. I'm not saying all this material consists of masterpieces necessarily, but I am saying that there's a shared mentality to the most aggressive detractors. |
I won't deny there are dumbs dumbs who hate on movies for such dumb reasons, but think the most aggressive detractors are the minority, perhaps loud, but I haven't heard from them. Granted I'm not an avid movie goer, but most reviews I've seen on youtube criticize based on the movie's own merits. At most they'll mention that the focus on pushing themes rather than story is likely what led to the movie turning out the way it did.
I'm sure some people have legitimate issues with Brie Larson. But it's also a safe bet that the kind of people who get intimidated by, or upset over, females/marginalized groups getting prominent and empowering roles in pop culture media, would also get upset that Brie called them out. Though let's be clear about something. They don't dislike every female character. To label it that way would give an excuse to bigots who have other (usually already established, so they can't complain about them anyway) female characters. |
Oh I agree. Definitely. Like every so often you'll run across one who says Wonder Woman was great and you'll ask what they liked about it and the first thing mentioned is Diana's skirt length, followed immediately by a comparison to Captain Marvel's "bulky", fully-clothed look. They're not actually interested in the characters themselves. Stuff like that.
Women aren't exempt from this either. There are plenty of woman-hating women who participate in these movements too.
I think though when you highlight the particular hostility toward same-sex relationships in films and other media, that highlights an area where these people get pandered too all the time by filmmakers without even realizing it. For example, let's take our two comic book superheroes who have gotten their own movies in recent years: Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel:
Diana (a.k.a. Wonder Woman) is bisexual in the comic books, and indeed inspired by two bisexual women. She's lived on an all-female island for hundreds of years; a situation that would probably cause most heterosexual women to at least experiment once or twice with same-sex relationships at some point along the way. And yet the filmmakers felt it important to include a scene (I refer to the boat scene) wherein it is made clear that she is still a virgin. And she falls in love with literally the first man she lays eyes on. That seems unlikely to me! It's like they had to reinvent her as specifically heterosexual for the larger moviegoing audience.
Similarly, Captain Marvel is stuck at lesbian-coding (I don't know about you, but I raise children with my just-friends all the time!) because heaven forbid that they should say "I love you" or kiss.
Filmmakers go out of their way to miss opportunities to represent lesbian relationships on the big screen. Same in other media.
Last edited by Jaicee - on 29 September 2019Hiku said:
I'm sure some people have legitimate issues with Brie Larson. But it's also a safe bet that the kind of people who get intimidated by, or upset over, females/marginalized groups getting prominent and empowering roles in pop culture media, would also get upset that Brie called them out. Though let's be clear about something. They don't dislike every female character. Framing it that way would give an excuse to bigots who like other (usually already established, so they can't complain about them anyway) female characters. |
I don't know man, the way I see it, nowadays everything has to be put in an extreme. "Oh! You don't like this, then you must be in this group" "oh, you don't like that, then you must be in that group."
And the people who use that rhetoric usually do so to not have to acknowledge the issues with the things they like. Like, it is easier to say: "Oh! so you think Rey is an overpowered character with no training that goes against anything that has been established before, then you're a bigot"
Jaicee said:
Oh I agree. Definitely. Like every so often you'll run across one who says Wonder Woman was great and you'll ask what they liked about it and the first thing mentioned is Diana's skirt length, followed immediately by a comparison to Captain Marvel's "bulky", fully-clothed look. They're not actually interested in the characters themselves. Stuff like that. Women aren't exempt from this either. There are plenty of woman-hating women who participate in these movements too. I think though when you highlight the particular hostility toward same-sex relationships in films and other media, that highlights an area where these people get pandered too all the time by filmmakers without even realizing it. For example, let's take our two comic book superheroes who have gotten their own movies in recent years: Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel: Diana (a.k.a. Wonder Woman) is bisexual in the comic books, and indeed inspired by two bisexual women. She's lived on an all-female island for hundreds of years; a situation that would probably cause most heterosexual women to at least experiment once or twice with same-sex relationships at some point along the way. And yet the filmmakers felt it important to include a scene (I refer to the boat scene) wherein it is made clear that she is still a virgin. And she falls in love with literally the first man she lays eyes on. That seems unlikely to me! It's like they had to reinvent her as specifically heterosexual for the larger moviegoing audience. Similarly, Captain Marvel is stuck at lesbian-coding (I don't know about you, but I raise children with my just-friends all the time!) because heaven forbid that they should say "I love you" or kiss. Filmmakers go out of their way to miss opportunities to represent lesbian relationships on the big screen. Same in other media. |
But.. why would it be unlikely for a bisexual woman to fall for a man at first sight? You just said it: she is BISEXUAL.
And yes, growing up surrounded by people of your own sex might cause you to experiment same-sex relationships once or twice, but that doesn't mean that EVERYBODY is going to do it. There are always some people who don't.
So I think that scene was totally within the realms of possibility.
chakkra said:
But.. why would it be unlikely for a bisexual woman to fall for a man at first sight? You just said it: she is BISEXUAL. And yes, growing up surrounded by people of your own sex might cause you to experiment same-sex relationships once or twice, but that doesn't mean that EVERYBODY is going to do it. There are always some people who don't. So I think that scene was totally within the realms of possibility. |
Also... if she was around nothing but Women her whole life then a guy would be something interesting to try as something new if she was Bi, if you're an omnivore and you been eating nothing but cabbage, if you found a shitty piece of meat you might still try it, same going on here.
Also as to why it needs to be shown on screen at all... there are tons of super heroes who's orientation isn't show or represented in any way
whatsoever, why isn't it shown that X character likes Y genders... because what does it matter to a super hero film? zippo? alright move on.
Why not check me out on youtube and help me on the way to 2k subs over at www.youtube.com/stormcloudlive
I approve of this. But I can only relate if she plays a blue haired, overweight, lesbian lightsaber swinger, charged with the power of a 1000 jedi's to slay those evil white beasts of men!
Last edited by goopy20 - on 29 September 2019| Ganoncrotch said: Also... if she was around nothing but Women her whole life then a guy would be something interesting to try as something new if she was Bi, if you're an omnivore and you been eating nothing but cabbage, if you found a shitty piece of meat you might still try it, same going on here. Also as to why it needs to be shown on screen at all... there are tons of super heroes who's orientation isn't show or represented in any way whatsoever, why isn't it shown that X character likes Y genders... because what does it matter to a super hero film? zippo? alright move on. |
But I needz muh representation! If the lead ain't a black guy I can't feel worthy of existence, world building, character development, and logical progression be damned!
chakkra said:
I don't know man, the way I see it, nowadays everything has to be put in an extreme. "Oh! You don't like this, then you must be in this group" "oh, you don't like that, then you must be in that group." And the people who use that rhetoric usually do so to not have to acknowledge the issues with the things they like. Like, it is easier to say: "Oh! so you think Rey is an overpowered character with no training that goes against anything that has been established before, then you're a bigot" |
That's been a thing here on VGC the last few days, and I'm a bit surprised it's continuing. F***, it just happened to you. Being labeled an "SQW", and having parallels drawn between yourself and racists. Jesus tapdancing Christ....Good on you for being so chill.
- "If you have the heart of a true winner, you can always get more pissed off than some other asshole."