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Forums - Sony Discussion - First look at PS5 vs PS4 Pro performance test

Pemalite on 22 May 2019
jonsnow said:
thismeintiel said:

Of course PC types are going to be talking about this being old tech. The problem with that is that this will be the first time a system is built around a SSD as a standard feature. Even on PC, a SSD isn't going to give you anything close to a 90% decrease in load times.

PC tech is irrelevant, simple fact of the matter is devs design their games around the dominant console’s tech. As Cerny explained the increased rendering speed allowed by the custom SSD solution will allow for fundamental changes in game design.

If you think you are going to be flying around a map at the speed of light that this demo showcases... I have some bad news for you. - It's not good gameplay.

And PC tech is relevant. - Consoles are built from PC technology, they are PC's.
Towards the end of a generation many developers start targeting PC first... We saw it last generation with Frostbite, Unreal Engine 4, Cry Engine and more... To the point where the PC was looking next-gen.

The SSD is going to be an extremely valuable tool, but it's not going to be changing the way games are designed.

HollyGamer said:

It's not about cool or not it's about software and games application that used and maximize the utilization of SSD and build based on that tech. Non of games that been made are made on SSD in mind.

I have been use SSD as well on PC for  quiet long and until these days all games is just load on normal loading screen , what make difference is just using ssd is just more faster . 

What we have in the video is they get rid the loading screen and moment. All games from PS5 will be made with this in mind. Thanks to console that push this old tech to become mainstream. 

Provide me an example of how a game would be developed differently and thus take advantage of an SSD over a mechanical drive?

The basic principles of how a game engine will operate in regards to the host storage will remain the same. There is no "secret sauce". - There is no "Cell" or "Cloud" or "Blast Processing". It's just a faster storage drive... And we don't even know if we are allowed to use it to install games on, this could have been a best-case scenario with all the data dumped onto it... For all we know its just an SSD Cache drive and thus real world results may be substantially different.

In short... Let's not start hyping something we don't have all the details for.

And I have been using SSD's since they came out, I was an early adopted, I was running them in raid. - Many games I don't see a loading screen.








--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

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lansingone on 23 May 2019
Pemalite said:
jonsnow said:

PC tech is irrelevant, simple fact of the matter is devs design their games around the dominant console’s tech. As Cerny explained the increased rendering speed allowed by the custom SSD solution will allow for fundamental changes in game design.

If you think you are going to be flying around a map at the speed of light that this demo showcases... I have some bad news for you. - It's not good gameplay.

And PC tech is relevant. - Consoles are built from PC technology, they are PC's.
Towards the end of a generation many developers start targeting PC first... We saw it last generation with Frostbite, Unreal Engine 4, Cry Engine and more... To the point where the PC was looking next-gen.

The SSD is going to be an extremely valuable tool, but it's not going to be changing the way games are designed.

HollyGamer said:

It's not about cool or not it's about software and games application that used and maximize the utilization of SSD and build based on that tech. Non of games that been made are made on SSD in mind.

I have been use SSD as well on PC for  quiet long and until these days all games is just load on normal loading screen , what make difference is just using ssd is just more faster . 

What we have in the video is they get rid the loading screen and moment. All games from PS5 will be made with this in mind. Thanks to console that push this old tech to become mainstream. 

Provide me an example of how a game would be developed differently and thus take advantage of an SSD over a mechanical drive?

The basic principles of how a game engine will operate in regards to the host storage will remain the same. There is no "secret sauce". - There is no "Cell" or "Cloud" or "Blast Processing". It's just a faster storage drive... And we don't even know if we are allowed to use it to install games on, this could have been a best-case scenario with all the data dumped onto it... For all we know its just an SSD Cache drive and thus real world results may be substantially different.

In short... Let's not start hyping something we don't have all the details for.

And I have been using SSD's since they came out, I was an early adopted, I was running them in raid. - Many games I don't see a loading screen.

This certainly could be just marketing fluff in top of nothing more than a regular SSD being put into the machine, but I will wait and see before calling it just that. What has me really curious here is that even though they did cherry pick a game that already has really quick load times so that they could achieve a load time less than a second, they did so by a 9X increase in speed. Out of curiosity I looked through several video comparisons of games loading on SSD, and while there were a few bad ones that only got a 1.5X boost, the best range was around a 3.5x boost. To me this says one of 2 things. Either there is some special hardware solution, or (this is sort of answering your question), this game was modified to run differently so that it could load faster.



DonFerrari on 23 May 2019
Pemalite said:
Yeah. Not actually that big of a deal that they make it out to be... Just like the Power of the Cell.

There are plenty of ways to side-step the issue of storage speeds, we have been dealing with it for decades after all.
Compression, Mesh/Texture Streaming, Longer Load Times into larger DRAM buffers, Procedural Generation... List goes on.

NAND certainly has it's advantages when leveraged right, especially in asset streaming and load times, but usually game engines are engineered to deal with the lowest common denominator... And that is mechanical storage.
Next gen I would assume that developers will still need to keep in mind for mechanical storage on console (External) and PC.

And for 20 years loading time have been high and in some cases dreadfull - looking at you GTA.

So a faster SSD instead of a slow HDD is a great improvement.

For Sony 1st parties they won't have any need to look at mechanical storage or PC from how what Cerny is pitching so far.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari on 23 May 2019
lansingone said:
Pemalite said:

If you think you are going to be flying around a map at the speed of light that this demo showcases... I have some bad news for you. - It's not good gameplay.

And PC tech is relevant. - Consoles are built from PC technology, they are PC's.
Towards the end of a generation many developers start targeting PC first... We saw it last generation with Frostbite, Unreal Engine 4, Cry Engine and more... To the point where the PC was looking next-gen.

The SSD is going to be an extremely valuable tool, but it's not going to be changing the way games are designed.

Provide me an example of how a game would be developed differently and thus take advantage of an SSD over a mechanical drive?

The basic principles of how a game engine will operate in regards to the host storage will remain the same. There is no "secret sauce". - There is no "Cell" or "Cloud" or "Blast Processing". It's just a faster storage drive... And we don't even know if we are allowed to use it to install games on, this could have been a best-case scenario with all the data dumped onto it... For all we know its just an SSD Cache drive and thus real world results may be substantially different.

In short... Let's not start hyping something we don't have all the details for.

And I have been using SSD's since they came out, I was an early adopted, I was running them in raid. - Many games I don't see a loading screen.

This certainly could be just marketing fluff in top of nothing more than a regular SSD being put into the machine, but I will wait and see before calling it just that. What has me really curious here is that even though they did cherry pick a game that already has really quick load times so that they could achieve a load time less than a second, they did so by a 9X increase in speed. Out of curiosity I looked through several video comparisons of games loading on SSD, and while there were a few bad ones that only got a 1.5X boost, the best range was around a 3.5x boost. To me this says one of 2 things. Either there is some special hardware solution, or (this is sort of answering your question), this game was modified to run differently so that it could load faster.

And even if your SSD allow for a faster load it doesn't allow for a faster traverse time.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Alby_da_Wolf on 23 May 2019
Nate4Drake said:
Next Gen is finally coming, can't wait for PS5 and Anaconda.

I can't help it, since I read this news, "Anaconda" for me is Nicki Minaj and Trump!    

https://pitchfork.com/news/65094-nicki-minaj-dedicates-anaconda-performance-to-donald-trump-and-joe-biden/



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")
A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.
TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW!   


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HollyGamer on 23 May 2019
Pemalite said:
HollyGamer said:

It's not about cool or not it's about software and games application that used and maximize the utilization of SSD and build based on that tech. Non of games that been made are made on SSD in mind.

I have been use SSD as well on PC for  quiet long and until these days all games is just load on normal loading screen , what make difference is just using ssd is just more faster . 

What we have in the video is they get rid the loading screen and moment. All games from PS5 will be made with this in mind. Thanks to console that push this old tech to become mainstream. 

Provide me an example of how a game would be developed differently and thus take advantage of an SSD over a mechanical drive?

The basic principles of how a game engine will operate in regards to the host storage will remain the same. There is no "secret sauce". - There is no "Cell" or "Cloud" or "Blast Processing". It's just a faster storage drive... And we don't even know if we are allowed to use it to install games on, this could have been a best-case scenario with all the data dumped onto it... For all we know its just an SSD Cache drive and thus real world results may be substantially different.

In short... Let's not start hyping something we don't have all the details for.

And I have been using SSD's since they came out, I was an early adopted, I was running them in raid. - Many games I don't see a loading screen.

Many games built based on mechanical drive, games like Assassin's Creed , GTA, Red Dead Redemption are obviously still using loading phase but it was hidden in the gameplay. Even game like The witcher 3 still has loading screen . I am using a Nvme  SSD but it still has 3 to 4 second on loading time. SSD is faster on loading startup screen on windows and PC OS , also for cinema bench and video editing,  but on gaming it's still the same and you obviously lie if you say no loading screen it still have loading time it' s just slightly faster.  Just look at this article https://www.pcgamer.com/how-do-ssds-affect-gaming-performance/

also read this https://techguided.com/ssd-vs-hdd-gaming/. That is the SSD for PC, PC gamer has been using SSD but none of the benefit of the SSD can be implemented on PC because all developer is just thinking like you, just for boating and caching . It will be different if all games are meant to be build using SSD. watch this video  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3AMz-xZ2VM

Btw blast processing on Sega is real actually and the cell also real, for the cloud it's also real but it was translated differently and it was not meant for graphic enhancement but for procedural and persistent physic. 

Last edited by HollyGamer - on 23 May 2019

0D0 on 23 May 2019
Barozi said:
I could still see some buildings popping in.
Thing is, the comparison is a bit off. That's what the PS5 could do ... using the same graphical settings as the PS4 does.
That won't happen though since devs are going to push the PS5 which will then lead to longer loading times.

Looking back, how much have loading times improved throughout the generations? Answer: not much.

twintail said:
Barozi said:
I could still see some buildings popping in.
Thing is, the comparison is a bit off. That's what the PS5 could do ... using the same graphical settings as the PS4 does.
That won't happen though since devs are going to push the PS5 which will then lead to longer loading times.

Looking back, how much have loading times improved throughout the generations? Answer: not much.

you are not wrong but this is merely a demonstration of what they are looking to achieve, and honestly more an early look at the power difference between the Pro and PS5.

As long as we see a reduction in loading time from this gen (even if not on the scale shown in the video), that it an improvement I think we will all gladly welcome. 

As long as it's better than Witcher 3's, I'll be glad.

When I compare Witcher 3 with Horizon Zero Dawn, on PS4 Pro, it's quite nuts.

irstupid said:
Pointless comparison imo. Using a current gen game to show how fast it loads on a next gen console serves no purpose.

The games will be more demanding and thus have the same if not longer load times due to trying to get more and more things on screen or the dev's being lazy cause they have such power to use.

Although it's a current generation game, it's still a comparison. We can see, based on that current generation game, how much faster is the loading times. Even though next generation games will be heavier than that, it's still a technical comparison.



God bless You.

My Total Sales prediction for PS4 by the end of 2021: 110m+

When PS4 will hit 100m consoles sold: Before Christmas 2019

There were three ravens sat on a tree / They were as blacke as they might be / The one of them said to his mate, Where shall we our breakfast take?


sethnintendo on 23 May 2019

What are the rumored specs on PS5 again?



HollyGamer on 24 May 2019
sethnintendo said:
What are the rumored specs on PS5 again?

8 core zen 2 at 3.2 Ghz

AMD Navi at 12 to 14 teraflop (GPU clock undecided)  

24 GB GDDR6 (4 Gb reserved for OS and other purpose )

SSD

BD drive

backward compatibility with PS4 digital and physical and with PSVR  

VR support build inside

support 8k

Ray Tracing capable

3D audio 

this all from the pastebin newest leek 



DonFerrari on 24 May 2019
BraLoD said:
mjk45 said:

They did right at the very beginning ,but it was loaded so fast that you blinked and missed it.

LoD every single second sounds great.

PS5 is so great that they manage to run Spider-Man at 59fps with 1 frame of LoD every single second.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."