Dulfite said:
KratosLives said:
i just wonder the reason why bush went there and stayed. Does afghan have oil? |
Ah that conspiracy theory. No, we went there to fight the terrorists that orchestrated 9/11 and when you do that you either: a) blow stuff up and leave. Then the children of the people you blew up grow up to avenge those we killed so they attack us again, causing the cycle to repeat over and over. or b) invade and try to build a better nation. We chose option b, but when polling data indicates the people there have no desire to become westernized, there is really little you can do. If they want to have a society where women are abused/neglected, where people can be stoned to death, and where young boys are brainwashed into adulthood to kill others/themselves so they can have rewards in Heaven, there isn't really anything our military can do other than secure our own borders so they can't come here to kill us. The only thing that can change things is 1:1 talks, heart to heart, to persuade them. Regardless, I don't think the Afghans are going to get what they want. As soon as we 100% out of there, China is going to become the new police dog over there and they don't have nearly the restraint the west has. China doesn't care about conventions on how to handle enemies. Ask the Uyghurs. Ask Taiwan. Ask Hong Kong. Ask the Philippines. Ask South Korea. China wants Asia, whether through direct control or proxy control, just like the Soviet Union used to have so many proxy nations under its belt. We are heading towards Cold War 2. Hopefully, it stops at a cold war and doesn't become a world war. Right now, for Asia, it is: The West + Australia + Asian nations of Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, and India vs. China, Russia, North Korea. If China can get Afghanistan on board, and eventually Pakistan, and perhaps the whole Southwestern Asian branch (Middle East), that will tip the scales in their favor. |
Yeah, you chose option B, which was the good option... but had no clue and no plan whatsoever as to how to do so.
A friend of mine is Afghan and came to the country 14 years ago. His parents had a poppies farm (so basically an opium farm) and when the Americans came, they told them that this was wrong and burned the fields. The problem is that right after taking the seeds and burning the fields, they left without any compensation or giving the family any other means to survive, like seeds to grow some foodstuffs. You can't just go around destroying existences and expect people to be happy about it.
The country didn't get industrialized or otherwise developed, so there was little perspective for Afghans. The US reinstated the regents who had been ousted by the Talibans 40 years ago due to deep-running corruption and general ineptitude, and they proved they didn't learn much in all these years since.
Troop training was also done in a disastrous way. There were many volunteers who wanted to get trained to protect family and fatherland - and those got generally sent to the other corner of the country, far away from their loved ones, with corrupt armchair generals "leading" them by placing them somewhere and be done with. The collapse in the last weeks was mostly due to those soldiers choosing to rather go defend their families than to defend the country who did seemingly everything to push them away. A bit more oversight on what happens to the recruits past basic training would have done wonders in preventing the collapse.
Long story short, this was entirely preventable. But Bush had no plans past beating the Taliban, Obama didn't care enough to up the ante here, Trump just wanted to pull out and Biden finally did. If any of them had cared more and handled it just slightly better, we wouldn't be at the situation we are now.