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KratosLives said:

i just wonder the reason why bush went there and stayed. Does afghan have oil?

No oil. The basic resources are mostly on the illegal side:

a) Drugs, obviously Afghanistan is by far the main producer of heroin.

b) The mountain regions supposedly contain rare earths that could be mined. Never happened though, as no western company would take the high risks.

c) Afgahnistan is also a playground for illegal fossiles (you pay the resident warlord a few guns and ammo and get away with anything you digged up).



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KratosLives said:

i just wonder the reason why bush went there and stayed. Does afghan have oil?

Ah that conspiracy theory. No, we went there to fight the terrorists that orchestrated 9/11 and when you do that you either:

a) blow stuff up and leave. Then the children of the people you blew up grow up to avenge those we killed so they attack us again, causing the cycle to repeat over and over.

or

b) invade and try to build a better nation.

We chose option b, but when polling data indicates the people there have no desire to become westernized, there is really little you can do. If they want to have a society where women are abused/neglected, where people can be stoned to death, and where young boys are brainwashed into adulthood to kill others/themselves so they can have rewards in Heaven, there isn't really anything our military can do other than secure our own borders so they can't come here to kill us. The only thing that can change things is 1:1 talks, heart to heart, to persuade them.

Regardless, I don't think the Afghans are going to get what they want. As soon as we 100% out of there, China is going to become the new police dog over there and they don't have nearly the restraint the west has. China doesn't care about conventions on how to handle enemies. Ask the Uyghurs. Ask Taiwan. Ask Hong Kong. Ask the Philippines. Ask South Korea. China wants Asia, whether through direct control or proxy control, just like the Soviet Union used to have so many proxy nations under its belt. We are heading towards Cold War 2. Hopefully, it stops at a cold war and doesn't become a world war. Right now, for Asia, it is:

The West + Australia + Asian nations of Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, and India vs. China, Russia, North Korea. If China can get Afghanistan on board, and eventually Pakistan, and perhaps the whole Southwestern Asian branch (Middle East), that will tip the scales in their favor.



Dulfite said:
KratosLives said:

i just wonder the reason why bush went there and stayed. Does afghan have oil?

Ah that conspiracy theory. No, we went there to fight the terrorists that orchestrated 9/11 and when you do that you either:

a) blow stuff up and leave. Then the children of the people you blew up grow up to avenge those we killed so they attack us again, causing the cycle to repeat over and over.

or

b) invade and try to build a better nation.

We chose option b, but when polling data indicates the people there have no desire to become westernized, there is really little you can do. If they want to have a society where women are abused/neglected, where people can be stoned to death, and where young boys are brainwashed into adulthood to kill others/themselves so they can have rewards in Heaven, there isn't really anything our military can do other than secure our own borders so they can't come here to kill us. The only thing that can change things is 1:1 talks, heart to heart, to persuade them.

Regardless, I don't think the Afghans are going to get what they want. As soon as we 100% out of there, China is going to become the new police dog over there and they don't have nearly the restraint the west has. China doesn't care about conventions on how to handle enemies. Ask the Uyghurs. Ask Taiwan. Ask Hong Kong. Ask the Philippines. Ask South Korea. China wants Asia, whether through direct control or proxy control, just like the Soviet Union used to have so many proxy nations under its belt. We are heading towards Cold War 2. Hopefully, it stops at a cold war and doesn't become a world war. Right now, for Asia, it is:

The West + Australia + Asian nations of Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, and India vs. China, Russia, North Korea. If China can get Afghanistan on board, and eventually Pakistan, and perhaps the whole Southwestern Asian branch (Middle East), that will tip the scales in their favor.

China is probably already there and I wouldnt be surprised if they were already supporting the Taliban takeover.

The mineral deposits there are worth 3 trillion dollars. Its just too risky for any serious company to try to mine it but I guess there are real chances the chinese will try to do it an include Afghanistan in their belt and road initiative.



EnricoPallazzo said:
Dulfite said:

Ah that conspiracy theory. No, we went there to fight the terrorists that orchestrated 9/11 and when you do that you either:

a) blow stuff up and leave. Then the children of the people you blew up grow up to avenge those we killed so they attack us again, causing the cycle to repeat over and over.

or

b) invade and try to build a better nation.

We chose option b, but when polling data indicates the people there have no desire to become westernized, there is really little you can do. If they want to have a society where women are abused/neglected, where people can be stoned to death, and where young boys are brainwashed into adulthood to kill others/themselves so they can have rewards in Heaven, there isn't really anything our military can do other than secure our own borders so they can't come here to kill us. The only thing that can change things is 1:1 talks, heart to heart, to persuade them.

Regardless, I don't think the Afghans are going to get what they want. As soon as we 100% out of there, China is going to become the new police dog over there and they don't have nearly the restraint the west has. China doesn't care about conventions on how to handle enemies. Ask the Uyghurs. Ask Taiwan. Ask Hong Kong. Ask the Philippines. Ask South Korea. China wants Asia, whether through direct control or proxy control, just like the Soviet Union used to have so many proxy nations under its belt. We are heading towards Cold War 2. Hopefully, it stops at a cold war and doesn't become a world war. Right now, for Asia, it is:

The West + Australia + Asian nations of Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, and India vs. China, Russia, North Korea. If China can get Afghanistan on board, and eventually Pakistan, and perhaps the whole Southwestern Asian branch (Middle East), that will tip the scales in their favor.

China is probably already there and I wouldnt be surprised if they were already supporting the Taliban takeover.

The mineral deposits there are worth 3 trillion dollars. Its just too risky for any serious company to try to mine it but I guess there are real chances the chinese will try to do it an include Afghanistan in their belt and road initiative.

Absolutely. If the Taliban don't know it yet, they soon will realize that unlike the west, China will not have any reservations at all about blowing up every man, woman, and child to get what they want. Then they will direct their state-controlled media to make it sound like this never happened or it is what the Afghan people want. Then they will direct North Korea to do the same, and Russia will fall in line too.



Dulfite said:
EnricoPallazzo said:

China is probably already there and I wouldnt be surprised if they were already supporting the Taliban takeover.

The mineral deposits there are worth 3 trillion dollars. Its just too risky for any serious company to try to mine it but I guess there are real chances the chinese will try to do it an include Afghanistan in their belt and road initiative.

Absolutely. If the Taliban don't know it yet, they soon will realize that unlike the west, China will not have any reservations at all about blowing up every man, woman, and child to get what they want. Then they will direct their state-controlled media to make it sound like this never happened or it is what the Afghan people want. Then they will direct North Korea to do the same, and Russia will fall in line too.

You got it almost right, you forgot the very end. When western media try to show it to the world they will forbid it and use their power and influence to censor western media companies and big tech. Then say it never happened and the west are the real racists and against minorities as the west has made it very clear they agree they indeed are racists and against minorities.

Rinse and repeat.

This new "cold war" will be very interesting to watch because unlike USSR during the 60's-80's, China is highly integrated with the rest of the world and has the power to influence the west. USSAR could not do it.

Interesting times, let's see the next chapters.



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EnricoPallazzo said:
Dulfite said:

Absolutely. If the Taliban don't know it yet, they soon will realize that unlike the west, China will not have any reservations at all about blowing up every man, woman, and child to get what they want. Then they will direct their state-controlled media to make it sound like this never happened or it is what the Afghan people want. Then they will direct North Korea to do the same, and Russia will fall in line too.

You got it almost right, you forgot the very end. When western media try to show it to the world they will forbid it and use their power and influence to censor western media companies and big tech. Then say it never happened and the west are the real racists and against minorities as the west has made it very clear they agree they indeed are racists and against minorities.

Rinse and repeat.

This new "cold war" will be very interesting to watch because unlike USSR during the 60's-80's, China is highly integrated with the rest of the world and has the power to influence the west. USSAR could not do it.

Interesting times, let's see the next chapters.

That's what is so bizarre to me. The people that control most western media are leftists, who are very pro LGTBQ and feminism (which are increasingly not aligned already, as feminists are against males identifying as women to steal their opportunities/invade their privacy), and these media companies are trying to bury atrocities being committed by certain nations that have a history of non-tolerance towards LGTBQ and feminists.

This left coalition of LGBTQ+, feminists, Muslims, and communists makes absolutely no sense and, in the end, they will all realize it. If the left wasn't so concerned with conservatives who they believe are persecuting them, they would realize they are aligning themselves with groups that are far more likely to make their lives miserable (Sharia muslims and Chinese communists) than conservatives ever could. They are trying to elimate a group who verbally criticizes them and doing so by aligning with groups that physically kill those that oppose their mindsets, oftentimes in the cruelest ways imaginable. 

Also, regarding Chinas position versus USSR's, while I agree they are in a more influential and globally powerful position, that does come with a catch. All that international trading has lead to a lot of debt being owed to China from western nations. But nations aren't inclined to pay up on their debts when being attacked or fighting proxy wars. So, if China wants to sustain its cashflow coming into it, they can't really start anything major. Combine that with the fact that in the next couple decades they are going to have a massive population decline due to decisions that have been made in recent decades and their economic situation is even more fragile. USSR was used to being on its own with the resources it had, China is very used to money coming in from all over the world.



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Dulfite said:
EnricoPallazzo said:

You got it almost right, you forgot the very end. When western media try to show it to the world they will forbid it and use their power and influence to censor western media companies and big tech. Then say it never happened and the west are the real racists and against minorities as the west has made it very clear they agree they indeed are racists and against minorities.

Rinse and repeat.

This new "cold war" will be very interesting to watch because unlike USSR during the 60's-80's, China is highly integrated with the rest of the world and has the power to influence the west. USSAR could not do it.

Interesting times, let's see the next chapters.

That's what is so bizarre to me. The people that control most western media are leftists, who are very pro LGTBQ and feminism (which are increasingly not aligned already, as feminists are against males identifying as women to steal their opportunities/invade their privacy), and these media companies are trying to bury atrocities being committed by certain nations that have a history of non-tolerance towards LGTBQ and feminists.

This left coalition of LGBTQ+, feminists, Muslims, and communists makes absolutely no sense and, in the end, they will all realize it. If the left wasn't so concerned with conservatives who they believe are persecuting them, they would realize they are aligning themselves with groups that are far more likely to make their lives miserable (Sharia muslims and Chinese communists) than conservatives ever could. They are trying to elimate a group who verbally criticizes them and doing so by aligning with groups that physically kill those that oppose their mindsets, oftentimes in the cruelest ways imaginable. 

Also, regarding Chinas position versus USSR's, while I agree they are in a more influential and globally powerful position, that does come with a catch. All that international trading has lead to a lot of debt being owed to China from western nations. But nations aren't inclined to pay up on their debts when being attacked or fighting proxy wars. So, if China wants to sustain its cashflow coming into it, they can't really start anything major. Combine that with the fact that in the next couple decades they are going to have a massive population decline due to decisions that have been made in recent decades and their economic situation is even more fragile. USSR was used to being on its own with the resources it had, China is very used to money coming in from all over the world.

Your view of the left is pretty hilarious. It feels like an alien trying to describe human culture. 



The Republican view on the people in Afghanistan trying to leave 

 



sundin13 said:
Dulfite said:

That's what is so bizarre to me. The people that control most western media are leftists, who are very pro LGTBQ and feminism (which are increasingly not aligned already, as feminists are against males identifying as women to steal their opportunities/invade their privacy), and these media companies are trying to bury atrocities being committed by certain nations that have a history of non-tolerance towards LGTBQ and feminists.

This left coalition of LGBTQ+, feminists, Muslims, and communists makes absolutely no sense and, in the end, they will all realize it. If the left wasn't so concerned with conservatives who they believe are persecuting them, they would realize they are aligning themselves with groups that are far more likely to make their lives miserable (Sharia muslims and Chinese communists) than conservatives ever could. They are trying to elimate a group who verbally criticizes them and doing so by aligning with groups that physically kill those that oppose their mindsets, oftentimes in the cruelest ways imaginable. 

Also, regarding Chinas position versus USSR's, while I agree they are in a more influential and globally powerful position, that does come with a catch. All that international trading has lead to a lot of debt being owed to China from western nations. But nations aren't inclined to pay up on their debts when being attacked or fighting proxy wars. So, if China wants to sustain its cashflow coming into it, they can't really start anything major. Combine that with the fact that in the next couple decades they are going to have a massive population decline due to decisions that have been made in recent decades and their economic situation is even more fragile. USSR was used to being on its own with the resources it had, China is very used to money coming in from all over the world.

Your view of the left is pretty hilarious. It feels like an alien trying to describe human culture. 

How so? Are you suggesting muslim Americans, feminists, and LGBTQ+ aren't mostly on the left? Or are you suggesting each of those subgroups goals aren't, long-term, contradictory, like I suggest?