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KLXVER said:
Torillian said:

Alright, then the question becomes, why? Why do black people commit a disproportionate amount of crime? I would say that this is because black people are also disproportionately poor and that is in large part due to long standing racial injustice within this country. This is part of what BLM is trying to fight for. To bring to forefront these issues that are largely ignored, and the idea that you can't kneecap a people for centuries and then say "it's all even now" for a few decades and expect everything to be equal. This is why I would fight for things like access to education and public programs which can help people break out of generational poverty. 

What would your policy proposal be?

The thing is that no one that participated in the long standing racial injustices are in power now. Im all for helping people and equality, but BLM is not a good example of fighters for racial justice. When the leaders say white people should give up their homes. When they call looting "reparations". When they collect hundreds of millions of dollars from people who want to help and not a dime of it goes to help any black people in the country who could actually use it.

School choice is a great way to start. Which is something the democrats seem to be against for some reason.

A mainstream media that doesnt skewer the news to fit their agenda would be appreciated. Actually show people what is going on and keeping them informed instead of pitting them against each other. 

Im sure there are many different public programs already available, but they usually dont get much attention. Helping people find jobs. Helping people on how to manage their finances. Helping people who has just started a family. Helping people who have just been released from jail and get their life on track etc. Lots of different programs that can be very helpful. Im not sure how widespread they are, but thats something I would like to see more of.

*Citation needed



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Runa216 said:
KLXVER said:

The thing is that no one that participated in the long standing racial injustices are in power now. Im all for helping people and equality, but BLM is not a good example of fighters for racial justice. When the leaders say white people should give up their homes. When they call looting "reparations". When they collect hundreds of millions of dollars from people who want to help and not a dime of it goes to help any black people in the country who could actually use it.

School choice is a great way to start. Which is something the democrats seem to be against for some reason.

A mainstream media that doesnt skewer the news to fit their agenda would be appreciated. Actually show people what is going on and keeping them informed instead of pitting them against each other. 

Im sure there are many different public programs already available, but they usually dont get much attention. Helping people find jobs. Helping people on how to manage their finances. Helping people who has just started a family. Helping people who have just been released from jail and get their life on track etc. Lots of different programs that can be very helpful. Im not sure how widespread they are, but thats something I would like to see more of.

*Citation needed

Are you sure? I might link you to a KKK website by accident or something...



KLXVER said:
sundin13 said:

Atatiana Jefferson was murdered through her window for leaving her own door open.

Botham Jean was murdered in his own home for sitting on his couch. 

Philando Castile was murdered in his car for driving with his girlfriend and her daughter...

Fair enough. Ill agree with you then.

I also thought of the drunk guy who was shot in a hotel hall even when he was crying and crawling on the floor. But he was white, so Im not sure that one counts unfortunately.

Also, don't forget that even if you don't resist and the cops are committing crimes against you and you survive, there is only a very low chance that they will be held accountable for it.

Here are two more fun examples:

https://www.abc15.com/news/local-news/investigations/witness-video-shows-phoenix-police-holding-man-on-hot-street-before-his-death

He struggled on the ground because he was pressed on scorching hot pavement, which prompted the officers to use even more force. It's really a tough sell to tell people not to struggle against police when they - rightfully - fear for their lives.

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/ig2n1c/man_bloodied_while_being_detained_by_beaumont/

Here a defenseless man who is not moving, unarmed and surrounded by many cops gets his head bashed in for no reason.

If you want to see more cops committing crimes against harmless individuals check out r/badcopnodonut. It's not a few bad apples, it's the whole fucking apple tree.



If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

KLXVER said:
Runa216 said:

*Citation needed

Are you sure? I might link you to a KKK website by accident or something...

Instead of being petulant about it, try doing better when researching sources? I mean, the solution is pretty damn obvious, don't get bitchy with me because I did more research on your source than you did; that's entirely on you. 



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PS5, Switch, XSX

PS4, PS3, PS2, PS1, WiiU, Wii, GCN, N64 SNES, XBO, 360

3DS, DS, GBA, Vita, PSP, Android

KLXVER said:
Torillian said:

Alright, then the question becomes, why? Why do black people commit a disproportionate amount of crime? I would say that this is because black people are also disproportionately poor and that is in large part due to long standing racial injustice within this country. This is part of what BLM is trying to fight for. To bring to forefront these issues that are largely ignored, and the idea that you can't kneecap a people for centuries and then say "it's all even now" for a few decades and expect everything to be equal. This is why I would fight for things like access to education and public programs which can help people break out of generational poverty. 

What would your policy proposal be?

The thing is that no one that participated in the long standing racial injustices are in power now. Im all for helping people and equality, but BLM is not a good example of fighters for racial justice. When the leaders say white people should give up their homes. When they call looting "reparations". When they collect hundreds of millions of dollars from people who want to help and not a dime of it goes to help any black people in the country who could actually use it.

School choice is a great way to start. Which is something the democrats seem to be against for some reason.

A mainstream media that doesnt skewer the news to fit their agenda would be appreciated. Actually show people what is going on and keeping them informed instead of pitting them against each other. 

Im sure there are many different public programs already available, but they usually dont get much attention. Helping people find jobs. Helping people on how to manage their finances. Helping people who has just started a family. Helping people who have just been released from jail and get their life on track etc. Lots of different programs that can be very helpful. Im not sure how widespread they are, but thats something I would like to see more of.

So from this we can at least start on the same footing, that black people commit more crime due to environmental factors, and then it becomes how do we affect those factors to improve the situation. 

That those who enacted the policies are no loner in power does not absolve us as a country from dealing with the issues we caused. You can either try to fix it or sit on your hands and decide "that's just the way our country is". I prefer the former. 

If you want we can find tons of different quotes from individuals who are part of BLM. I'm more interested in the cause of the movement than shitty things individuals said as part of it. That said, I'd be interested to see where you the idea that BLM is getting 100's of millions of dollars and using none of it to help black people. 

On school choice, the reason democrats disagree with this idea because it's a solution for the individual but not a systemic solution. You can't just double the number of students at every good school in an area and leave the bad schools to die (or I would argue you shouldn't). Often kids won't be able to get to a better school if it's too far away. Lastly, this just seems like a lazy solution akin to abandoning a dirty room in your house rather than cleaning it. So many other countries have figured out education and none of them have gone for this libertarian ideal of "the market will fix it". I would prefer we look to how other countries have fixed this problem than try to push towards an unproven solution that doesn't even attempt to solve the problem. 



...

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Runa216 said:
KLXVER said:

Are you sure? I might link you to a KKK website by accident or something...

Instead of being petulant about it, try doing better when researching sources? I mean, the solution is pretty damn obvious, don't get bitchy with me because I did more research on your source than you did; that's entirely on you. 

It was just a joke. You need to calm the hell down. You seem like a fairly intelligent person, but your constant insults are getting old and it makes you seem like a very intolerant person. If you want me to provide you with something, then ask me like a normal person and stop lashing out like a child.



Torillian said:
KLXVER said:

The thing is that no one that participated in the long standing racial injustices are in power now. Im all for helping people and equality, but BLM is not a good example of fighters for racial justice. When the leaders say white people should give up their homes. When they call looting "reparations". When they collect hundreds of millions of dollars from people who want to help and not a dime of it goes to help any black people in the country who could actually use it.

School choice is a great way to start. Which is something the democrats seem to be against for some reason.

A mainstream media that doesnt skewer the news to fit their agenda would be appreciated. Actually show people what is going on and keeping them informed instead of pitting them against each other. 

Im sure there are many different public programs already available, but they usually dont get much attention. Helping people find jobs. Helping people on how to manage their finances. Helping people who has just started a family. Helping people who have just been released from jail and get their life on track etc. Lots of different programs that can be very helpful. Im not sure how widespread they are, but thats something I would like to see more of.

So from this we can at least start on the same footing, that black people commit more crime due to environmental factors, and then it becomes how do we affect those factors to improve the situation. 

That those who enacted the policies are no loner in power does not absolve us as a country from dealing with the issues we caused. You can either try to fix it or sit on your hands and decide "that's just the way our country is". I prefer the former. 

If you want we can find tons of different quotes from individuals who are part of BLM. I'm more interested in the cause of the movement than shitty things individuals said as part of it. That said, I'd be interested to see where you the idea that BLM is getting 100's of millions of dollars and using none of it to help black people. 

On school choice, the reason democrats disagree with this idea because it's a solution for the individual but not a systemic solution. You can't just double the number of students at every good school in an area and leave the bad schools to die (or I would argue you shouldn't). Often kids won't be able to get to a better school if it's too far away. Lastly, this just seems like a lazy solution akin to abandoning a dirty room in your house rather than cleaning it. So many other countries have figured out education and none of them have gone for this libertarian ideal of "the market will fix it". I would prefer we look to how other countries have fixed this problem than try to push towards an unproven solution that doesn't even attempt to solve the problem. 

Well where is it? Where are the stories about how BLM helped schools in poor neighborhoods? Or donated to victims of police brutality and their families?

I mean have you any information I might have missed? Ive seen several sources saying the money is going to campaigns for democrats running for president, but nothing about them actually helping regular people. 



KLXVER said:
Torillian said:

So from this we can at least start on the same footing, that black people commit more crime due to environmental factors, and then it becomes how do we affect those factors to improve the situation. 

That those who enacted the policies are no loner in power does not absolve us as a country from dealing with the issues we caused. You can either try to fix it or sit on your hands and decide "that's just the way our country is". I prefer the former. 

If you want we can find tons of different quotes from individuals who are part of BLM. I'm more interested in the cause of the movement than shitty things individuals said as part of it. That said, I'd be interested to see where you the idea that BLM is getting 100's of millions of dollars and using none of it to help black people. 

On school choice, the reason democrats disagree with this idea because it's a solution for the individual but not a systemic solution. You can't just double the number of students at every good school in an area and leave the bad schools to die (or I would argue you shouldn't). Often kids won't be able to get to a better school if it's too far away. Lastly, this just seems like a lazy solution akin to abandoning a dirty room in your house rather than cleaning it. So many other countries have figured out education and none of them have gone for this libertarian ideal of "the market will fix it". I would prefer we look to how other countries have fixed this problem than try to push towards an unproven solution that doesn't even attempt to solve the problem. 

Well where is it? Where are the stories about how BLM helped schools in poor neighborhoods? Or donated to victims of police brutality and their families?

I mean have you any information I might have missed? Ive seen several sources saying the money is going to campaigns for democrats running for president, but nothing about them actually helping regular people. 

From what I've fact checked BLM:

1. does not get 100's of millions of dollars

2. there is no evidence that most of the money BLM receives goes to democratic candidates.

https://www.factcheck.org/2020/06/donations-to-black-lives-matter-group-dont-go-to-dnc/



...

For a solid article explaining many of the facets of school choice including both pro's and con's of the different proposals, this is a good start (its a WaPo article, but the link below should hopefully get you past the paywall):

https://outline.com/wCSeM7

Overall conclusion that I read from that is that evidence that it actually helps is scant, and it is throwing public money into a largely unregulated and unproven industry with a questionable history. While I can certainly see some short term benefit in helping kids get out of terrible schools (and into other below average schools), I think that begs the question: Why don't we just adequately fund our schooling system? This seems to be ignoring the obvious solution to this problem...



Torillian said:
KLXVER said:

Well where is it? Where are the stories about how BLM helped schools in poor neighborhoods? Or donated to victims of police brutality and their families?

I mean have you any information I might have missed? Ive seen several sources saying the money is going to campaigns for democrats running for president, but nothing about them actually helping regular people. 

From what I've fact checked BLM:

1. does not get 100's of millions of dollars

2. there is no evidence that most of the money BLM receives goes to democratic candidates.

https://www.factcheck.org/2020/06/donations-to-black-lives-matter-group-dont-go-to-dnc/

That is absolutely fair enough. Im still interested to see where the money is going though. No matter how much it is. Im not expecting you to provide me with it btw. Im just saying they could be a bit more transparent with their finances. Im sure many of the people in BLM means well, but they have a problem with mixed messaging.