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Forums - Politics Discussion - Kanye West Gives and Amazing Speech at the White House.

John2290 said:
Now it's clear to be where and why racism is being kept alive and it's not the right

So question to the bolded. You don't think the political side with literal nazis running for office, "race realists", and voter ID rulings that have been ruled by a court of law to be racist is the side that's keeping racism alive? What political leanings do you think the guys who marched and shouted about "jews will not replace us" have? Maybe I missed the part where they yelled "jews will not replace us..... also I really think we need to consider sensible gun control and the benefits of universal health care?"

Is your argument that if the left stopped being so mean to Kanye that all the things above would go away naturally?



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Torillian said:
John2290 said:
Now it's clear to be where and why racism is being kept alive and it's not the right

So question to the bolded. You don't think the political side with literal nazis running for office, "race realists", and voter ID rulings that have been ruled by a court of law to be racist is the side that's keeping racism alive? What political leanings do you think the guys who marched and shouted about "jews will not replace us" have? Maybe I missed the part where they yelled "jews will not replace us..... also I really think we need to consider sensible gun control and the benefits of universal health care?"

Is your argument that if the left stopped being so mean to Kanye that all the things above would go away naturally?

Excuse my ignorance as a non-American but what exactly is racist about voter ID laws? Like i said in another thread the other day where i am from if you can't show ID then no voting for you. You should be obligated to prove that you are who you say you are when doing something as important as voting



Nothing to see here, move along

It's only amazing if we go by hip-hop/rappers standards.



LurkerJ said:
It's only amazing if we go by hip-hop/rappers standards.

Um..what is that supposed to mean?



melbye said:
Torillian said:

So question to the bolded. You don't think the political side with literal nazis running for office, "race realists", and voter ID rulings that have been ruled by a court of law to be racist is the side that's keeping racism alive? What political leanings do you think the guys who marched and shouted about "jews will not replace us" have? Maybe I missed the part where they yelled "jews will not replace us..... also I really think we need to consider sensible gun control and the benefits of universal health care?"

Is your argument that if the left stopped being so mean to Kanye that all the things above would go away naturally?

Excuse my ignorance as a non-American but what exactly is racist about voter ID laws? Like i said in another thread the other day where i am from if you can't show ID then no voting for you. You should be obligated to prove that you are who you say you are when doing something as important as voting

It sounds so basic and easy don't it? I've tried talking to a friend once while out drinking about voter ID laws. He said it was discriminatory, racists, unfair to poor, ect.

The argument goes something like this:  Requiring a valid form of photographic identification for the purposes of voting will disenfranchise minority voters because minority voters tend to be the poorest and thus many minority voters do not have photo identification because they cannot afford them or are unable to travel to the various agencies that issue photo IDs.  Therefore requiring a valid photo identification is a scheme devised by Republicans to disenfranchise minority voters who tend to vote in favor of Democrats.

Here are things that require a photo ID in America:

Going on plane, driving a car, buying a gun, opening a bank account.  - So far, I would say poor people would not need an ID. They could survive.

Alcohal, Tobacco, a PO Box, unemployment, many states require it for food stamps and welfare (that includes California), public housing. - Ok, so are these super poor people not suing food stamps, welfare and public housing? Are they opting out of things that could help them because it is too hard to go and get a free ID? Those government assistance programs require ID, because they want to stop fraud. You know me, a middle class person making a fake name to get welfare on top of my paycheck. Are you proponents suggesting that poor people don't buy cigarettes or alcohol?

Now lets say somehow the person doesn't need or use ANY of the above things. Ok. Then tell me how they can't afford to hop on a bus and waste half a day getting a free ID from somewhere. If they can't for monetary reason, then I say the ID will let them also get some financial assistance and help them even more. They've argued that "oh, they have a job that they can't leave or they will get fired, so no time to get one. It's closed whenever they are not working" My response? Didn't you job require a photo ID to start? All mine I my life have. They also required Social Security number and filling out a W4. The only job one can have that doesn't require that is one that is illegal. You are being paid off the books with cash. To that I say, why not get a photo ID and also collect welfare? You job is paying you off the books, so the government thinks you are completely broke and jobless. Go on welfare and cheat the system basically.

There is zero reason NOT to have a photo ID, let alone the BS excuse that they can't afford to get one.



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PortisheadBiscuit said:
LurkerJ said:
It's only amazing if we go by hip-hop/rappers standards.

Um..what is that supposed to mean?

Didn't you hear?

Kanye is just a token black guy for the Trump admin to tote around and show off.



melbye said:
Torillian said:

So question to the bolded. You don't think the political side with literal nazis running for office, "race realists", and voter ID rulings that have been ruled by a court of law to be racist is the side that's keeping racism alive? What political leanings do you think the guys who marched and shouted about "jews will not replace us" have? Maybe I missed the part where they yelled "jews will not replace us..... also I really think we need to consider sensible gun control and the benefits of universal health care?"

Is your argument that if the left stopped being so mean to Kanye that all the things above would go away naturally?

Excuse my ignorance as a non-American but what exactly is racist about voter ID laws? Like i said in another thread the other day where i am from if you can't show ID then no voting for you. You should be obligated to prove that you are who you say you are when doing something as important as voting

In the case I am referencing republican lawmakers asked for voter information by race and then made laws that disallowed the kind of ID that black people use and closed polling centers in places that were mostly black. So yeah, that voter ID law was racist. It's quite possible that it was done solely from a rational of "they don't vote for us" but the end result is still racist and the courts agree. 



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Torillian said:
melbye said:

Excuse my ignorance as a non-American but what exactly is racist about voter ID laws? Like i said in another thread the other day where i am from if you can't show ID then no voting for you. You should be obligated to prove that you are who you say you are when doing something as important as voting

In the case I am referencing republican lawmakers asked for voter information by race and then made laws that disallowed the kind of ID that black people use and closed polling centers in places that were mostly black. So yeah, that voter ID law was racist. It's quite possible that it was done solely from a rational of "they don't vote for us" but the end result is still racist and the courts agree. 

Can I get a link to that? I've never heard that before.

Besides, what would he need extra voter info by race for? You want race info, just look at the census done every so many years. On those, you have to list race, ect. They could tell then what district race make-up is and just look at the prior voting results and extrapolate from there how races are voting.

Most voter ID situations I hear involve wanting voter ID. People screaming its discriminatory, and yet the state saying they will provide free ID's. So even "IF" the id's black people had (why would their ID's be any different than anyone else's?) were not allowed, they could just go and get a new one for free.



I only managed to watch a little bit, because it was extremely cringe, and I'm not in the mood for that.
Kanye said "Because in an alternate universe, I'm you. (Trump)" and that's about what I expected.

Someone earlier described it as " his speech itself. It's like, he'll say 2 nutty or incoherent things followed by one nugget of brilliance."
And I assumed the rest would go something like that. I might check out the rest when I'm mentally prepared, but it's nice that he brought Yeezee manufacturing to the US.

Last edited by Hiku - on 12 October 2018

irstupid said:
Torillian said:

In the case I am referencing republican lawmakers asked for voter information by race and then made laws that disallowed the kind of ID that black people use and closed polling centers in places that were mostly black. So yeah, that voter ID law was racist. It's quite possible that it was done solely from a rational of "they don't vote for us" but the end result is still racist and the courts agree. 

Can I get a link to that? I've never heard that before.

Besides, what would he need extra voter info by race for? You want race info, just look at the census done every so many years. On those, you have to list race, ect. They could tell then what district race make-up is and just look at the prior voting results and extrapolate from there how races are voting.

Most voter ID situations I hear involve wanting voter ID. People screaming its discriminatory, and yet the state saying they will provide free ID's. So even "IF" the id's black people had (why would their ID's be any different than anyone else's?) were not allowed, they could just go and get a new one for free.

They didn't want just where black people voted, but when and what kind of ID they were using. 

"“[P]rior to enactment” of the law, the Fourth Circuit explained, “the legislature requested and received racial data as to usage of the practices changed by the proposed law.” Released from the obligation to clear their law with the Justice department and “with race data in hand, the legislature amended the bill to exclude many of the alternative photo IDs used by African Americans.” Photo IDs used more often by black voters, including public assistance IDs, were removed from the list of acceptable identification, while IDs issued by the Department of Motor Vehicles—which blacks are less likely to have—were retained. Cutting the first week of early voting came in reaction to data showing that the first seven days were used by large numbers of black voters, nixing one Sunday on which churches would bus “souls-to-the-polls”. Banning same-day registration, too, had an outsize effect on blacks, as did the prohibition on out-of-precinct voting: both changes made voting harder for people who had recently moved, and blacks are more itinerant than whites."

http://electionlawblog.org/wp-content/uploads/nc-4th.pdf

https://www.economist.com/democracy-in-america/2016/08/01/north-carolina-voter-id-law-is-struck-down-as-racially-discriminatory



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