Forums - Gaming Discussion - Will the BF5 Failure Slow The Tide of SJW Agendas in Gaming?

Will BF5 Fiasco scare other companies from pushing agendas in games?

yes 29 42.03%
 
no 40 57.97%
 
Total:69
AngryLittleAlchemist said:
flashfire926 said: 

"Again, people are misunderstanding what the issue is."

Let's examine this:

"No one has a problem with a woman being on the front cover.Or being playable in the game."

Contrasted with

"The woman in the first trailer was slightly questionable, but was given a pass by many (including me)."

Contrasted with

"Yes, we all know Battlefield was never THAT realistic, so whatever."

Contrasted with

"If those comments never occurred I (along with many others) would've probably given it a pass."

You keep switching from selective wording to all-inclusive wording. So is it everyone, or no one, or some people, or no people? If you admit that a certain amount of people do view the problem as the inclusion of women, then how could you possibly state definitively that people "just don't get it, man!" From what I've seen, the notion that women shouldn't be in the game at all is as popular as the "it just needs to be more historically accurate, mannn!" notion (which is probably just made up mostly of people who didn't want to see women in the game anyways).

Seriously, when you have to start making excuses because you know that admitting a large portion of the backlash is coming from people who are unreasonable, you should really think about what you're fighting against in the first place. It reminds me of something someone (can't remember who) said about Charlottesville.  (Paraphrasing) "I don't care if you were protesting taxes, if you are willing to march with white supremacists just to get a 'reasonable' goal done you should rethink your strategy."  I would never say that in regards to something as silly as a video game protest, but at least have some introspection. 

"Calling people "uneducated" and "sexist" for not believing that women were in the front lines of british forces having prosthetic arms and blue face paint and wielding cricket bats. "

By the way this is either A ) A straight up lie B ) A misinterpretation or C )  A cocky clever way to show the huge contrast between claims of lack of education while simultaneously showing off unrealistic things. But even C, which would be quite clever, isn't effective ... because it's addressed in the very statement you are talking about. 

""These are people who are uneducated—they don't understand that this is a plausible scenario, and listen: this is a game," he added."

You could make a case that the comment is pretty stupid because it isn't very substantive, but I think when he said people are "uneducated" he is clearly not talking about prosthetic arms. He even caps it off by punctuating that it's just a game, so even calling out the contrast doesn't work well. 

Sad thing is, the comments given by the developers and EA are just as dumb as what the fanbase have stated. Really, there is no defending a company as shitty as EA or a developer as lolbad as DICE. But if gamers won't be standing for the stupidity of these companies, they should at least call out the stupidity in their own echo chamber. 

So you are defending EA comment about "being uneducated and sexist" as a mere misinterpretation, and yet you went on to break down his comment and misinterpret it to make a point, hmmm irony or contradiction. 

Hmmm lets contradict some more. So anybody with a knowledge of history will easily point toward women in WW2 with Prosthetic arm went home there weren't many on the front line to begin with, besides Russian snipers and medic duty, Secondly there is difference between having an authentic WW2 experience and expecting a realistic potrayle of WW2, for example everybody knows car handling in GT is not 1:1 of their real life counter part, but if it starts to handle like NFS thats a problem.  Third point many people who are labeling this as something against women are conveniently omitting the fact people also complained about a dude weilding Katana, but we have to ignore it coz its a dude, and doesn't suit the agenda of calling people sexist.



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If nothing else, it'll definitely have EA questioning whether or not it should attack its fans.



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taus90 said:
AngryLittleAlchemist said:

"Again, people are misunderstanding what the issue is."

Let's examine this:

"No one has a problem with a woman being on the front cover.Or being playable in the game."

Contrasted with

"The woman in the first trailer was slightly questionable, but was given a pass by many (including me)."

Contrasted with

"Yes, we all know Battlefield was never THAT realistic, so whatever."

Contrasted with

"If those comments never occurred I (along with many others) would've probably given it a pass."

You keep switching from selective wording to all-inclusive wording. So is it everyone, or no one, or some people, or no people? If you admit that a certain amount of people do view the problem as the inclusion of women, then how could you possibly state definitively that people "just don't get it, man!" From what I've seen, the notion that women shouldn't be in the game at all is as popular as the "it just needs to be more historically accurate, mannn!" notion (which is probably just made up mostly of people who didn't want to see women in the game anyways).

Seriously, when you have to start making excuses because you know that admitting a large portion of the backlash is coming from people who are unreasonable, you should really think about what you're fighting against in the first place. It reminds me of something someone (can't remember who) said about Charlottesville.  (Paraphrasing) "I don't care if you were protesting taxes, if you are willing to march with white supremacists just to get a 'reasonable' goal done you should rethink your strategy."  I would never say that in regards to something as silly as a video game protest, but at least have some introspection. 

"Calling people "uneducated" and "sexist" for not believing that women were in the front lines of british forces having prosthetic arms and blue face paint and wielding cricket bats. "

By the way this is either A ) A straight up lie B ) A misinterpretation or C )  A cocky clever way to show the huge contrast between claims of lack of education while simultaneously showing off unrealistic things. But even C, which would be quite clever, isn't effective ... because it's addressed in the very statement you are talking about. 

""These are people who are uneducated—they don't understand that this is a plausible scenario, and listen: this is a game," he added."

You could make a case that the comment is pretty stupid because it isn't very substantive, but I think when he said people are "uneducated" he is clearly not talking about prosthetic arms. He even caps it off by punctuating that it's just a game, so even calling out the contrast doesn't work well. 

Sad thing is, the comments given by the developers and EA are just as dumb as what the fanbase have stated. Really, there is no defending a company as shitty as EA or a developer as lolbad as DICE. But if gamers won't be standing for the stupidity of these companies, they should at least call out the stupidity in their own echo chamber. 

So you are defending EA comment about "being uneducated and sexist" as a mere misinterpretation, and yet you went on to break down his comment and misinterpret it to make a point, hmmm irony or contradiction. 

Hmmm lets contradict some more. So anybody with a knowledge of history will easily point toward women in WW2 with Prosthetic arm went home there weren't many on the front line to begin with, besides Russian snipers and medic duty, Secondly there is difference between having an authentic WW2 experience and expecting a realistic potrayle of WW2, for example everybody knows car handling in GT is not 1:1 of their real life counter part, but if it starts to handle like NFS thats a problem.  Third point many people who are labeling this as something against women are conveniently omitting the fact people also complained about a dude weilding Katana, but we have to ignore it coz its a dude, and doesn't suit the agenda of calling people sexist.


"Sad thing is, the comments given by the developers and EA are just as dumb as what the fanbase have stated. Really, there is no defending a company as shitty as EA or a developer as lolbad as DICE."

Literally the next line my guy! 

And what flashfire is criticizing IS a misrepresentation because the developer was not talking about prosthetic limbs and cricket bats. However, the comment the developer made was dumb (just from the simple fact that it is technically wrong in regard to what they've shown), as I said "You could make a case that the comment is pretty stupid because it isn't very substantive". 

Nothing in your comment is substantive because it either doesn't apply or is literally addressed in my comment. I am fully aware there are completely different sides that just happen to fall under the anti-EA flag. In fact, I say it in the comment! Wow! 



Zelda fans are the worst 

Ka-pi96 said:
FentonCrackshell said:

These folks who care so much for historical accuracy sure pitched a fit when Mafia III showed an uber-racist USA in that era. At that point historical accuracy wasn’t so important. Hmm...?

I know nothing about Mafia III so don't even know what you're referring to. But regardless of whether people complained about it's accuracy or not that doesn't change the fact that some people do care about historical accuracy and it is a legitimate complaint.

I dont understand what he is trying to say.. USA wasn't racist back then?? Also there is a difference between expecting historical accurate WW2 and authentic WW2 experience, which BF1 managed to deliver, an authentic WW1 experience, but it wasn't historically accurate. So nobody expected Accurate portrayal of WW2 but an authentic WW2 experience.



Those who constantly complain about SJW's are just as bad as SJW's.
Honestly, there are more important things in life that are more deserving of your attention.



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FentonCrackshell said:
Ka-pi96 said:

That's a really poor argument. You may not care about historical accuracy in games, but not everybody is you! There are plenty of people that do enjoy historically accurate settings in their games. So maybe stop with the ignorance and accept that different people value different things in games and just because it's not something you care about doesn't make their complaints illegitimate.

These folks who care so much for historical accuracy sure pitched a fit when Mafia III showed an uber-racist USA in that era. At that point historical accuracy wasn’t so important. Hmm...?

I played Mafia 3 and the racism is exaggerated to the point of absurdy. You would have to exclusively go to KKK ridden areas to find that level of it which he was doing. I thought the game was entertaining. He was fighting democrats most of the time. 😂 The story and music were the best part of the game.



The entire thread is fairly risible, because it is predicated on two ridiculous assumptions:
1) Pre-orders being "below expectations" is now a "failure"... It's still doing pretty much better than almost anything else on the market, which really tells you more about companies' expectations 
2) Somehow this is due to a "controversy" most people aren't even be aware of. Hell, due to an answer to said controversy in an interview, which would still require massive numbers of people being at all bothered by women being in the game. 
    
The poll is also biased as hell, but that's par for the course, I guess.
A "What are you even on about?" option would be appreciated

Last edited by Tulipanzo - on 25 August 2018

AngryLittleAlchemist said:
taus90 said:

So you are defending EA comment about "being uneducated and sexist" as a mere misinterpretation, and yet you went on to break down his comment and misinterpret it to make a point, hmmm irony or contradiction. 

Hmmm lets contradict some more. So anybody with a knowledge of history will easily point toward women in WW2 with Prosthetic arm went home there weren't many on the front line to begin with, besides Russian snipers and medic duty, Secondly there is difference between having an authentic WW2 experience and expecting a realistic potrayle of WW2, for example everybody knows car handling in GT is not 1:1 of their real life counter part, but if it starts to handle like NFS thats a problem.  Third point many people who are labeling this as something against women are conveniently omitting the fact people also complained about a dude weilding Katana, but we have to ignore it coz its a dude, and doesn't suit the agenda of calling people sexist.


"Sad thing is, the comments given by the developers and EA are just as dumb as what the fanbase have stated. Really, there is no defending a company as shitty as EA or a developer as lolbad as DICE."

Literally the next line my guy! 

And what flashfire is criticizing IS a misrepresentation because the developer was not talking about prosthetic limbs and cricket bats. However, the comment the developer made was dumb (just from the simple fact that it is technically wrong in regard to what they've shown), as I said "You could make a case that the comment is pretty stupid because it isn't very substantive". 

Nothing in your comment is substantive because it either doesn't apply or is literally addressed in my comment. I am fully aware there are completely different sides that just happen to fall under the anti-EA flag. In fact, I say it in the comment! Wow! 

that's my point! you pointed out his contradicting statements as base of your argument, yet you went on and gave three scenario for EA's statement and how it could have been perceived and then went on to contradict yourself by saying "Sad thing is, the comments given by the developers and EA are just as dumb as what the fanbase have stated. Really, there is no defending a company as shitty as EA or a developer as lolbad as DICE."

So what makes Flashfire argument and contradiction invalid and yours valid?




Pemalite said:
Those who constantly complain about SJW's are just as bad as SJW's.
Honestly, there are more important things in life that are more deserving of your attention.

So true! The people who see racism and sexism in everything are just as nauseating as the folks who don’t think it exists or see it and chose to remain ignorant. 



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taus90 said:

that's my point! you pointed out his contradicting statements as base of your argument, yet you went on and gave three scenario for EA's statement and how it could have been perceived and then went on to contradict yourself by saying "Sad thing is, the comments given by the developers and EA are just as dumb as what the fanbase have stated. Really, there is no defending a company as shitty as EA or a developer as lolbad as DICE."

So what makes Flashfire argument and contradiction invalid and yours valid?


Pardon me, but unless you simply need to rephrase your point, that's not a contradiction? It could be that I am just failing to understand, and if so I truly apologize, however what I am getting from your comment is that you believe I am contradicting myself by saying that EA and DICE's statements are dumb after criticizing Flashfire for making a comment that was a wrongful "interpretation" or exaggeration for the sake of criticism of said statement? 

Uhm ... if that is what you believe, that isn't a contradiction. You can believe a statement is dumb but then still say how people misconstrue it is also dumb. In this example if Flashfire said that the statement was wrong regarding women serving in certain territories, and it was factually correct, then nothing would be wrong with the statement. But he added onto it (and I believe purposefully to be disingenuous and exaggerate an already very large point) as if the statement was talking about prosthetic or cricket bats, which it wasn't. And even if he was talking about the full quote, by the end of the quote the developer exclaims it's a "game" which is obviously a way of saying that leniency is needed. So yeah, what is the contradiction? 



Zelda fans are the worst