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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - To those who say Octopath is not worth 60 dollars...

Mar1217 said:
Jumpin said:

Your argument is easily disproven by the fact that the same thing isn't being said about Mario Odyssey, Xenoblade, Breath of the Wild, and a large number of other games.

No one is complaining that Switch games are too much, they're complaining that this particular low-fidelity game is too much. Since low-fidelity titles are nearly always priced much lower, this is a valid criticism.

I heard many people complain over the short the campaign of Mario Odyssey which in turn made them question if it was worth the 80$ 

And seriously ?! A high-end stylised JRPG called low-fidelity game ? On the basis of what ?  Don't mask your opinion on the basis of critism.

I don't recall anyone complaining about Odyssey's price. But even if this is true, then you have also provided a valid reason as to why some people would complain, and therefore have a self-defeating argument.

Secondly, high fidelity does NOT refer to the level of stylization, it refers to games that are using cutting edge graphical technology that typically require a large expense to implement. So, Octopath Traveler would have been high-fidelity maybe in 1998, but not so much in 2018, it's nowhere near cutting edge.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

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Cerebralbore101 said:
I don't think it's worth $60, but then again, I bought it. The game really only is an upgraded 3DS title with all the flashy lighting, maps, and particle effects turned on. And I mean that. You literally go into the Unreal engine, and click a box to turn most of those things on. It doesn't take much work from the developer at all. I don't see why they couldn't have charged $50 for it like Labryinth of Refrain.

Let me beat Enter the Gungeon, and then I'll start playing it. If the gameplay is amazing I may just change my mind.

Well I beat Horizon Zero Dawn, as 60 dollar game at launch, with 89% trophy completion (would have the plat if I put in 5 more hours) in 45 hours.

 

Seeing how Octopath will give me many more hours and the gameplay mechanics and story are woven together better than many other games out there, I do not see how "looking like a upgraded 3DS game" has anything to do with it.  They are selling content, not graphics.

 

You are entitled to your opinion though.

Jumpin said:
Peh said:
Those are just poor trolls. Ignore them.

It's like the tale with "The Fox and the Grapes". Meaning: if they can't afford it, it's not worth it.

Your argument is easily disproven by the fact that the same thing isn't being said about Mario Odyssey, Xenoblade, Breath of the Wild, and a large number of other games.

No one is complaining that Switch games are too much, they're complaining that this particular low-fidelity game is too much. Since low-fidelity titles are nearly always priced much lower, this is a valid criticism.

The gameplay mechanics and writing is beyond many "high fidelity" titles however.  If having "high fidelity" visuals was all that mattered, The Order 1886 would not have recieved the criticism that it did.

Veknoid_Outcast said:
Maybe people don't like the genre, or the art style, or a dozen other things. Some folks are willing to fork over more dollars for glossy "AAA" experiences; some would rather invest in smaller-scale productions. Some would pay a premium for a visual novel, and others will refuse to spend more than $20 for a story-driven game. There are so many different constituencies and demographics in the gaming world. It's a great thing, as far as I'm concerned.

I think the trick is to do your best not to make people feel bad or guilty for enjoying what they enjoy.

This is not directed at people who do not like JRPGs.  If you do not like those games, you won't like this one either.  I am talking about people that try to say it is overpriced due to visuals alone.  The content makes it worth more than 60 dollars TBH.

Megiddo said:
Is there a difficulty setting? Pretty much every play-through I've seen has been stomping everything even in chapters 3-4. For me it wouldn't be worth $60 if it wasn't much of a challenge. That's just me though. I can easily see why others would have no issue paying $60 as it looks to be a very enjoyable game.

Not that I know of, but I what level were they?  Like many JRPGs, you can grind to insanely high levels for the task at hand and breeze through when you actually do them.  From my understanding, playing through normally without heavy grinding will offer you quite a challenge.



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Honestly never even knew this game existed until after launch, I'm interested. My Switch is a desert for games right now with nothing cool coming out the remainder of this year. My Xbox and PC have kept me sane for the short while, but my Switch has done nothing, not since the launch of Mario Odyssey really. For its 2D nature, I think $60 is asking a tad bit too much, no matter its game length in this case. It is still worth it, just not the best choice of pricing. Nintendo doesn't really have a history of putting their games on sale, so this is the price for the game for the next 10 years.



Megiddo said:
Is there a difficulty setting? Pretty much every play-through I've seen has been stomping everything even in chapters 3-4. For me it wouldn't be worth $60 if it wasn't much of a challenge. That's just me though. I can easily see why others would have no issue paying $60 as it looks to be a very enjoyable game.

It’s an RPG, if you approach stuff under leveled it will be challenging, if you approach stuff overleveled it will be easy...



Jumpin said:
Mar1217 said:

I heard many people complain over the short the campaign of Mario Odyssey which in turn made them question if it was worth the 80$ 

And seriously ?! A high-end stylised JRPG called low-fidelity game ? On the basis of what ?  Don't mask your opinion on the basis of critism.

I don't recall anyone complaining about Odyssey's price. But even if this is true, then you have also provided a valid reason as to why some people would complain, and therefore have a self-defeating argument.

Secondly, high fidelity does NOT refer to the level of stylization, it refers to games that are using cutting edge graphical technology that typically require a large expense to implement. So, Octopath Traveler would have been high-fidelity maybe in 1998, but not so much in 2018, it's nowhere near cutting edge.

(0:21) "Exclusive to Switch, it takes the traditional top down style of SNES greats like FFVI and blends it with the cutting edge rendering techniques of Unreal Engine 4."



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Shiken said:
Jumpin said:

Your argument is easily disproven by the fact that the same thing isn't being said about Mario Odyssey, Xenoblade, Breath of the Wild, and a large number of other games.

No one is complaining that Switch games are too much, they're complaining that this particular low-fidelity game is too much. Since low-fidelity titles are nearly always priced much lower, this is a valid criticism.

The gameplay mechanics and writing is beyond many "high fidelity" titles however.  If having "high fidelity" visuals was all that mattered, The Order 1886 would not have recieved the criticism that it did.

I'm not familiar with The Order 1886 (I have hardly played a non-Nintendo platform since PS2). But whether or not it's the only thing that matters is another argument. The point is that people are misrepresenting the arguments of others (game time length, people being too poor, etc...), and instead make up other things to argue against rather than tackling the actual criticism; it's effectively a straw man argument.

The people are arguing that the game is not worth the price because it lacks the high-fidelity they require to make it worth it. They have a good argument, it's been widely established in the industry that lower-fidelity games are priced lower. This game, as a result, comes off as over-priced.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

gergroy said:
Megiddo said:
Is there a difficulty setting? Pretty much every play-through I've seen has been stomping everything even in chapters 3-4. For me it wouldn't be worth $60 if it wasn't much of a challenge. That's just me though. I can easily see why others would have no issue paying $60 as it looks to be a very enjoyable game.

It’s an RPG, if you approach stuff under leveled it will be challenging, if you approach stuff overleveled it will be easy...

Persona 5 on Easy and Normal is a very different game than Persona 5 on Hard and Merciless.

From what I can see it's not really the levels that matter but the 'break' mechanic. Where any sort of attack that would be even somewhat dangerous to the party is telegraphed a round or 2 ahead giving you ample time to 'break' the boss before their strong attack happens. Having the ability to steal tons of loot, inquire to get tons of hidden items, having crazy strong passive/support abilities, all these things lend to a very easy game for anyone with a moderate experience with JRPGs.



Jumpin said:
Shiken said:

The gameplay mechanics and writing is beyond many "high fidelity" titles however.  If having "high fidelity" visuals was all that mattered, The Order 1886 would not have recieved the criticism that it did.

I'm not familiar with The Order 1886 (I have hardly played a non-Nintendo platform since PS2). But whether or not it's the only thing that matters is another argument. The point is that people are misrepresenting the arguments of others (game time length, people being too poor, etc...), and instead make up other things to argue against rather than tackling the actual criticism; it's effectively a straw man argument.

The people are arguing that the game is not worth the price because it lacks the high-fidelity they require to make it worth it. They have a good argument, it's been widely established in the industry that lower-fidelity games are priced lower. This game, as a result, comes off as over-priced.

The flaw in your argument is the high fidelity part as from what many people have played of the game the gameplay, story and content are of high quality better than a number of other full price games while the visuals are stylised to look retro while utilising UE4's advanced features this isn't a lower fidelity game it's just not one of those hyped up AAA.

No one has criticised anyone who says they don't have the money it's the other argument you're pressing on high and low fidelity people are tackling because when you ask people pushing this notion to explain what they mean all many of then come up with are the visuals.



Mar1217 said:
Conina said:

Supply and demand...the games market is totally oversaturated.

There were a lot less games to choose from in the past, much more competition for our precious time today.

It's just one factor amongst others though. Supply and demand isn't the end-of-all when you have to account consummer elasticity or also marginal utility into the mix.

You're making it way too simple of an equation.

It's a personal decision-making-process if a product is worth the price. Everybody has one, but this one is mine for full-priced games:

1. Do I want to play the new game X more than some of my unfinished games?

  • No.  ->  Play the unfinished games instead, especially if they are even better than the new game X.
  • Yes. ->  Go to 2
2. Do I want to play the new game X more than the cheaper game Y?
  • No.  ->  Buy and play the cheaper and more desired game Y.
  • Yes.  ->  Buy and play game X for full price.
Most new good games already fail at question one, most of the rest fail at question two.
There are many new games I want to play eventually, but they are very rarely better (or more desired) than the ones I already have.
Last edited by Conina - on 20 July 2018

Megiddo said:
gergroy said:

It’s an RPG, if you approach stuff under leveled it will be challenging, if you approach stuff overleveled it will be easy...

Persona 5 on Easy and Normal is a very different game than Persona 5 on Hard and Merciless.

From what I can see it's not really the levels that matter but the 'break' mechanic. Where any sort of attack that would be even somewhat dangerous to the party is telegraphed a round or 2 ahead giving you ample time to 'break' the boss before their strong attack happens. Having the ability to steal tons of loot, inquire to get tons of hidden items, having crazy strong passive/support abilities, all these things lend to a very easy game for anyone with a moderate experience with JRPGs.

It's moderate difficulty if you know what you're doing, break only works if you hit enemies with their weakness and how long it takes for a break to happen depends on how much damage your characters can deal out when they hit the weakness so levels do matter, you won't be able to break many bosses before their attacks as a result even when you're equal level.

Abilities take a while to unlock as each new ability you unlock increases the requirement for the next ability it's not as abusable as you think.