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Forums - Sony Discussion - The Naughty Dog Agenda

KLXVER said:
Tulipanzo said:

So, finished the video.
From the first ten minutes it seemed like the guy was just trained (probably by listening to idiots) to feel like any and all signs of inclusions are "unjustified", "not called for" and generally bad.

But to make a 20 minutes video just grasping at straws it seems ridiculous.
So, if you skipped the video:
- Naughty Dog retweets too much gay fanart
- Neil Druckmann likes the "bad woman who don't like gamers >:("
- I didn't like the PSX moderator
- This actor is trans aaaaaaaaaaaaaa; (is he not good enough to play a secondary character in TLoU? Dunno)
- Where was the context for the kiss? I need the full backstory of the character here, what's this A TRAILER!?!
- They're not showing Joel!!!!! This means he's dead; and the SJWs KILLED HIM
- Where's Cutter? (in the multiplayer, bless him)

It's all very much nonsense, masquerading as "legitimate concerns" for the game.
A real takeaway is how he never touches on the actual quality of the games he mentions, despite Neil being quite open as to how he approaches writing.
Hell, you can see references to Anita in his presentation about writing women in TLoU!!! The one where he's about to reveal his, quote, "SECRET AGENDA", but then we cut away from him. Jeez, I wonder why....

In all seriousness, can we stop reposting amateurs arguing in bad faith? "Social Justice is infecting ND" barely warrants an eye-roll, far less a thread

Well he still has the right to question it. Its not like he is the only one that feels this way. ND could just say that they aren't working on some kind of agenda instead of telling the people who have the concern to fuck off because the games are not made for them.

I never questioned his right to voice his opinions, yet here you are implying I did.
He has every right to express his opinion. His opinion is baseless, nonsensical, little more than him disliking ND twitter feed. It isn't so much an opinion as a feeling of discomfort.

Furthermore, ND's employee wasn't responding to people's "legitimate concern" about the s, but quite clearly addressing the wave of complaints there were "too many feeeemales" in E3 trailers (with Battlefield 5 leading the charge). Misrepresenting the tweet to imply this is ND's general policy is a bad faith argument from the video itself, so I don't blame you...



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Acevil said:
specialk said:

Watched about half of it. What I saw seemed like a list of extremely silly things to be concerned about. Tulipanzo's recap confirms that the rest of it is much like what I watched.

I will save you the trouble of watching the horrible video:

When did this become acceptable? Developers telling gamers to fuck off and calling them toxic gamerbros? Sony has built their whole gaming division on many of these gamerbros. Just watch some of their commercials. Especially the Kevin Butler ones. 

Why not just explain why they made the trailer the way it is? I don't mind it, but some people found it confusing. Don't call them names and tell them to fuck off. Just explain it and Im sure many would get it.



KLXVER said:
Acevil said:

I will save you the trouble of watching the horrible video:

When did this become acceptable? Developers telling gamers to fuck off and calling them toxic gamerbros? Sony has built their whole gaming division on many of these gamerbros. Just watch some of their commercials. Especially the Kevin Butler ones. 

Why not just explain why they made the trailer the way it is? I don't mind it, but some people found it confusing. Don't call them names and tell them to fuck off. Just explain it and Im sure many would get it.

Around the same time, developers started getting harassed online and some even finding personal information to harass further. 



 

Acevil said:
KLXVER said:

When did this become acceptable? Developers telling gamers to fuck off and calling them toxic gamerbros? Sony has built their whole gaming division on many of these gamerbros. Just watch some of their commercials. Especially the Kevin Butler ones. 

Why not just explain why they made the trailer the way it is? I don't mind it, but some people found it confusing. Don't call them names and tell them to fuck off. Just explain it and Im sure many would get it.

Around the same time, developers started getting harassed online and some even finding personal information to harass further. 

So developers can just insult gamers now and its ok because a few people were being assholes to them? 




For everyone joining late, the context for the tweet is: people felt there were too many women in trailers for E3 games (which is statistically incorrect btw)
In the video this is presented as ND being too angry at "reasonable concerns" over TLoU2 trailer (the give away is that the tweet doesn't mention TLoU at all...)

The reasonable concern over the trailer? We don't know Ellie's gf relevance to the story from the trailer...
Also guy doesn't understand the concept of juxtaposing a calm cutscene with violent gameplay. Movies must be really confusing for him



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No more ND games for me. They better watch it or they'll find themselves in the same shape Disney is in with Star Wars.

It seems we're seeing the same story play out. A popular company/franchise gets infested with SJWs who slowly use said company/franchise to push their agenda, instead of focusing on good products, which turns off about half or more of their fans. Instead of easing off, they push harder, hurling insults and making the agenda more obvious, until they slowly ride it into the ground.



More diverse main characters are a good thing, because it means more perspectives can be explored in videogames. If we want games to be treated like art, maybe we should allow them to tackle subjects like homosexuality or motherhood (we had our fair share of fatherhood lately) and other stuff that straight white males don’t experience. Not saying straight white men should never be protagonists again, just that we don’t need to play the same dude with a different face in every AAA game.



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GameOverture said:
More diverse main characters are a good thing, because it means more perspectives can be explored in videogames. If we want games to be treated like art, maybe we should allow them to tackle subjects like homosexuality or motherhood (we had our fair share of fatherhood lately) and other stuff that straight white males don’t experience. Not saying straight white men should never be protagonists again, just that we don’t need to play the same dude with a different face in every AAA game.

Of course. All that is amazing stuff, but there will always be people who prefer to play as guys. Not because they are sexist, but maybe because they have an easier time to relate. So instead of telling them to fuck off and that they are toxic, just say something like "Well we are sorry you feel that way, but this is a story we are passionate about and want to tell. If you choose to not play it, we believe you are missing out on a great experience."

I don't really see anything SJW with the TLOU2 trailer personally. Seems like a natural progression of Ellies character. But these insults from the developer really rubs me the wrong way. I will still buy and enjoy the game day 1, but Im not ok with that kind of speaking.



So, a character we have known to be a lesbian for several years now, is expressing her sexuality in a completely understandable and relatable way with another woman in a trailer for a game is now a part of some SJW agenda? Maybe it's something I just don't get, but what exactly is the issue here? The kiss itself? The relationship between two women? Ellie being the main playable character rather than Joel? Something else? Because all of those things are complete non-issues as far as I'm concerned, so I'm kinda lost here.



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I've been seeing a lot of threads like this recently.