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Forums - Politics Discussion - Catalonia declares independence. Puigdemont free to roam Belgium.

 

Who do you support?

Spain 139 59.40%
 
Catalonia 95 40.60%
 
Total:234
CrazyGamer2017 on 28 October 2017
VGPolyglot said:
CrazyGamer2017 said:

The only good reason to become independent is when the country you're part of is a dictatorship that suppresses your rights and you wish to be free and treated as a human being. Other than that, if you wish to destroy or break up a country, everyone in the country should have a say.

This is not the case in Spain, in Catalonia or anywhere in the EU. Catalonians enjoy the same rights as any other EU citizens and their bid for independence is out of ignorance. Only the Catalonian government stands to win from independence as statehood would dramatically increase their powers but the people would lose as independence means no rights to travel across Spain freely, or the EU if they are kicked out of Europe. In the 21st century at a time where union and globalisation is the new paradigm shift, independence is dumb and independence inside a modern system as the EU is irresponsible and misguided.

So, in other words no country becomes independent then, because the dictators would brutally repress independence movements.

What dictators? This is a EU country not some third world war riddled country. No one is repressing freedom in Catalonia. To the best of my knowledge a Catalan citizen comes and goes as he/she pleases, works or does not, stays home to play games or travels across Spain or the EU as he/she pleases. Or are they prisoners inside Catalonia? Cause I'm not aware of that.



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VGPolyglot on 28 October 2017
CrazyGamer2017 said:
VGPolyglot said:

So, in other words no country becomes independent then, because the dictators would brutally repress independence movements.

What dictators? This is a EU country not some third world war riddled country. No one is repressing freedom in Catalonia. To the best of my knowledge a Catalan citizen comes and goes as he/she pleases, works or does not, stays home to play games or travels across Spain or the EU as he/she pleases. Or are they prisoners inside Catalonia? Cause I'm not aware of that.

You were saying that those are the only places that should be allowed independence, so I was not considering the other countries into the equation.



Goodnightmoon on 28 October 2017

Spain is composed by autonomous comunities but Catalonia is more self-governed than the rest, I think that's what CrazyGamer was trying to say.



CrazyGamer2017 on 28 October 2017
Ka-pi96 said:

As far as I can tell, every region of Spain is an autonomous community. So how exactly is that unfair?

Really? Ok maybe, I'm no specialist of the political and administrative state of Spain.

But it's kind of weird cause then how is Spain a country if the entirety of the territory is made of autonomous regions? What part of Spain is purely Spanish then?

But let's say all regions are autonomous. That's equality and Catalonia is pushing to unbalance that equality as independent and autonomous is not the same.



Player2 on 28 October 2017
fatslob-:O said:
Player2 said:

Replace autonomous regions with States. That's why I said "pretty much".

Yeah, their absolutely not equivalents in this case ... 

"in matters that affect them directly, the states defend their interests at the federal level through the Bundesrat ("Federal Council", the upper house of the German Federal Parliament)" 

By comparison the Generalitat of Catalonia has powers that is almost like a US state ... 

What are you trying to say?



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fatslob-:O on 28 October 2017
Player2 said:

What are you trying to say?

That the power of autonomous region of Catalonia =/= power of german states ... 



Player2 on 28 October 2017
fatslob-:O said:
Player2 said:

What are you trying to say?

That the power of autonomous region of Catalonia =/= power of german states ... 

I didn't say that they have the same power.



fatslob-:O on 28 October 2017
Player2 said:

I didn't say that they have the same power.

Strawman ... 

Article 37 from the german consitution isn't the equivalent of Article 155 from the Spanish constitution ... 



Player2 on 28 October 2017
fatslob-:O said:
Player2 said:

I didn't say that they have the same power.

Strawman ... 

Article 37 from the german consitution isn't the equivalent of Article 155 from the Spanish constitution ... 

Why?

Last edited by Player2 - on 28 October 2017

Goodnightmoon on 28 October 2017
fatslob-:O said:
Player2 said:

I didn't say that they have the same power.

Strawman ... 

Article 37 from the german consitution isn't the equivalent of Article 155 from the Spanish constitution ... 

It has the same utility and is made for similar situations