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Forums - Politics Discussion - World gone mad: Music conductor fired for making racist joke even though "victim" says no.

Aeolus451 said:
Dark_Lord_2008 said:

Hitler lost the war. White people are slowly losing their privileges in life as minority groups gain privileges. If Hitler won the war the nonsense of political correctness would not exist today. Hitler lost so we now live with the fall out. Political correctness is here to stay because Hitler lost the war.

Hitler was German and he didn't speak for all white people. Only Germans had to deal with the ramifications of his actions in that sense. Politicial correctness is the result of progressives taking control of the democratic party.

WTF Hitler was Austrian damnit.



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DonFerrari said:
o_O.Q said:

well that's inevitable which is amusingly what most people who pander socialist and communist ideology don't get:

 

for there to be any system that reduces inequality there has to be people who design and implement that system, which ultimately leads to two classes: the rulers and the ruled

its why any attempt to put communism into place always fails to help the average person because the only practical way it can be done is with a large oppressive government suppressing everyone down to the same level

 

what any person with sense realises is that the best system would be one where everyone gets a fair shot at advancing as far as their potential allows while also helping those who have problems within reason

 

if you ask me communist ideology was developed by the elite as a way to trick stupid people into enriching the elite at the expense of everyone else

I fully agree with you. So far free market capitalism is our best shoot.

And inequality isn't the problem, poverty is. I don't care if Bill Gates have Billions or Trump rules USA as long as I earn enough to have confort and pleasures. So not fearing to die of famine, disease, violence and also achieve some luxury is a lot better than everybody equally bad. USA have this, but left wing try to screw that.

yeah and that's why i'm saying we need to provide equality of opportunity and understand that equality of outcomes is an undesirable standad to have for what should be obvious reasons



No one wants to live in a world where only racist comments are protected as free speech. Most institutions like this understand that students are who the serve so protecting their interests should surpass turning racists jokes into divine words of wisdom. I swear sometimes I feel like you guys think I should want to be called N***er or just have such a low opinion of myself that I am in love with racists or things with a racist context.



o_O.Q said:
Chris Hu said:

The goal of socialism isn't for everyone to be equal.  Most developed countries actually are practicing some forms of socialism.  Even in the US there is lots of socialism just not the right kind since most of it is corporate socialsm where huge corporations get huge tax breaks or get a subsidy for producing certain goods.  Also if you look at the yearly happines index the top 10 contries are usually the ones that have lots of socialism. 

the goal of socialism is to reduce inequality... which is the same thing as making people more equal...

So what exactly is wrong with making people more equal.  Also a lot people that are strongly opposed to socialism consider themselves Christians without realizing that Jesus was a big time socialist.



Chris Hu said:
o_O.Q said:

the goal of socialism is to reduce inequality... which is the same thing as making people more equal...

So what exactly is wrong with making people more equal.  Also a lot people that are strongly opposed to socialism consider themselves Christians without realizing that Jesus was a big time socialist.

Nope Jesus didn't want to overthrow Rome, nor did he wanted to FORCE others to get their things picked and distributed, he incentived solidarity and that happens a lot in capitalism.

CosmicSex said:
No one wants to live in a world where only racist comments are protected as free speech. Most institutions like this understand that students are who the serve so protecting their interests should surpass turning racists jokes into divine words of wisdom. I swear sometimes I feel like you guys think I should want to be called N***er or just have such a low opinion of myself that I am in love with racists or things with a racist context.

Except there was no joke and no racism. There were two friends teasing each other. One mocked his british accent all the time while the other said in southern accent "you want some gritty?". Where is the racist joke in this?

 

@o_O.Q  sorry lost the multiquote for you: yes macking opportunities more spread is the way.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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DonFerrari said:
Chris Hu said:

So what exactly is wrong with making people more equal.  Also a lot people that are strongly opposed to socialism consider themselves Christians without realizing that Jesus was a big time socialist.

Nope Jesus didn't want to overthrow Rome, nor did he wanted to FORCE others to get their things picked and distributed, he incentived solidarity and that happens a lot in capitalism.

CosmicSex said:
No one wants to live in a world where only racist comments are protected as free speech. Most institutions like this understand that students are who the serve so protecting their interests should surpass turning racists jokes into divine words of wisdom. I swear sometimes I feel like you guys think I should want to be called N***er or just have such a low opinion of myself that I am in love with racists or things with a racist context.

Except there was no joke and no racism. There were two friends teasing each other. One mocked his british accent all the time while the other said in southern accent "you want some gritty?". Where is the racist joke in this?

 

@o_O.Q  sorry lost the multiquote for you: yes macking opportunities more spread is the way.

That is where the problem is.  When is it just a joke and when is it a demeaning statement.  Case in point would be if two people were talking loud enough to be heard by someone else.  One person makes a demeaning joke concerning a race and then someone of that race over hears it.  This is the same case.  It does not matter if two people are friends when it comes to this type of issue. You leave those jokes at home, with your friends in a bar but not when you are at work.  The ambiguity is what gets people in trouble because in those situations it cannot be determined the context of such comments.  This is why most hand books and videos on the subject just say do not do it.  It’s the world we live in and your place of work isn’t the total free speech place to make such jokes.  I know this on a very personal level because I been there. I taught classes and makes jokes all the time.  Even the most innocent joke can rub someone the wrong way and you find yourself trying to explain you way out of it and it’s just not worth it.  



Machiavellian said:
DonFerrari said:

Nope Jesus didn't want to overthrow Rome, nor did he wanted to FORCE others to get their things picked and distributed, he incentived solidarity and that happens a lot in capitalism.

Except there was no joke and no racism. There were two friends teasing each other. One mocked his british accent all the time while the other said in southern accent "you want some gritty?". Where is the racist joke in this?

 

@o_O.Q  sorry lost the multiquote for you: yes macking opportunities more spread is the way.

That is where the problem is.  When is it just a joke and when is it a demeaning statement.  Case in point would be if two people were talking loud enough to be heard by someone else.  One person makes a demeaning joke concerning a race and then someone of that race over hears it.  This is the same case.  It does not matter if two people are friends when it comes to this type of issue. You leave those jokes at home, with your friends in a bar but not when you are at work.  The ambiguity is what gets people in trouble because in those situations it cannot be determined the context of such comments.  This is why most hand books and videos on the subject just say do not do it.  It’s the world we live in and your place of work isn’t the total free speech place to make such jokes.  I know this on a very personal level because I been there. I taught classes and makes jokes all the time.  Even the most innocent joke can rub someone the wrong way and you find yourself trying to explain you way out of it and it’s just not worth it.  

Even when there is no joke? Even when the other part didn't said "it didn't bothered me" but "it wasn't racism", and someone that wasn't even of that race decided by herself that it was racist and needed the person to lose his job?

The issue as I have told before is show on the college over-reacting, doing a kneejerk reaction to fire the person and then having to make a deal with the person to not escalate the problem. Even when you can fire without reason, if you give reason and it's prosecution you will face problems.

And again you go there and ignore what you can't take back. You compared someone being fired for someone else "interpretation" of a remark as racist (white against black) to a reprimend of a real case of prejudice (someone vs redneck) and put on same level.

PC isn't about making the environment better to everyone, it's about prosecuting against those the movement disagree. We have had several cases of people making remarks on one side being demonized, but when the other side makes similar remarks they will get apologetical and say about there is no reverse racism, there is no prejudice against the ones in power, and even if let's say a feminist bad mouth a black men the movement will just pretend nothing happened because they are friends.

In Brazil we had a politician being prosecuted because he said his adversary DIDN'T deserve to be rapped (this adversary was defending two rappist saying they were victms of society and as such didn't deserve to be in jail, and also accused the other politician of being a rapist himself), the same people that defended his prosecution just shut down when a teacher begged that someone rapped a journalist. In case you need clarification the prosecuted politician was related to right wing the adversary was a left wing politician, the teacher was left wing oriented and the journalist right wing oriented.

So the madworld the OP talks about is basically this. For one side it will make every single innocent remark into a criminal offense while making the criminal behaviour on the other side a minor mischeave.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

jason1637 said:
Mystro-Sama said:

I think context is very important. If you can't joke about things like these with friends then its no wonder race relations in the US is so shit right now.

Racism shouldnt be joked about. The guy is racist and you're probably racist for defending him.

Is this a joke or sarcasm. Just making sure because you don't what racism is if you really think that. 



Ka-pi96 said:
o_O.Q said:

if you ask me communist ideology was developed by the elite as a way to trick stupid people into enriching the elite at the expense of everyone else

Possibly. The old adage "power corrupts" definitely has it's place in there too though. There was a lot of overthrowing of the "elite" with communist revolutions. Until those leading the revolutions realised that they were the new "elite". Much easier to demand "equality" when you're the one that would benefit from it than when it would be detrimental to you

Not really since all so called communist coutries ended up having very few rich people.  In the Soviet Union even the elite only made about three to four times as much money as the rest of the population. 



CosmicSex said:
No one wants to live in a world where only racist comments are protected as free speech. Most institutions like this understand that students are who the serve so protecting their interests should surpass turning racists jokes into divine words of wisdom. I swear sometimes I feel like you guys think I should want to be called N***er or just have such a low opinion of myself that I am in love with racists or things with a racist context.

Have you even read what the joke was about?! There simply was no racism involved at all. Crybabies everywhere.