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Forums - Sales Discussion - 500 million console Sony !

zorg1000 said:
Soundwave said:

Yes, ok, lol, but if you look at context for one the statements of Nintendo creating some huge gap are false, and secondly I do think it's fair to point out Nintendo has had 8 hardware platforms since 1995 to get just a bit over 500 million in that time.  

Like for instance lets just say for whatever reason the DS didn't exist and you compared Wii to PS3 + PSP, I'm sure you would quickly point out that's unfair because it's two hardware lines versus one. 

Sony has hit 500 million with 2 fewer hardware systems in that time, really the difference boils down to Sony not having a portable from 1995-2004, not because Sony isn't as good or arguably a better hardware seller than Nintendo is. 

Sony is by far the most consistent hardware seller in the business, they've only had one hardware ever sell under 80 million, that's an unheard of level of consistency in this industry.

If you want to actually compare Sony Vs. Nintendo in relevant head to head systems we get

PS1 (102m) vs. N64 (33m)

PS2 (157m) vs. GCN (22m)

PS3 (86m) vs. Wii (101m)

PSP (80m) vs DS (154m)

Vita (15m) vs 3DS (60m)

PS4 (55m) vs Wii U (14m)

Sony is a bit over 100 million ahead and the PS4 has likely another 50+ million to sell even with the phenomonal success of the Wii/DS era. The GB/GBA having no Sony equivalent for about 9 years are what keep Nintendo in the picture. 

just saw your edit, so if we pretend GBC& GBA didnt exist than Sony wins!!! can you even have a discussion without changing goalposts/cherry picking? i honestly dont think you can.

You asked for context I'm providing it. 

Fact is when pitted head to head when Sony actually has a comparable system, they have outsold Nintendo in total ... and quite easily at that. Do you disagree with that? 

Yes of course having GB + GBA with no Sony equivalent is a huge advantage for Nintendo, it's not "moving goal posts" to point that out. I'm sure this would be pointed out by many Nintendo fans if the situation was reversed. 

Also beyond all that even if you want to include the GB + GBA, the gap is still not *that* big. You are talking like 500m versus 540-550 mill from 1995 onwards. Not the huge gap some people have been making it out to be. 



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Soundwave said:
zorg1000 said:

just saw your edit, so if we pretend GBC& GBA didnt exist than Sony wins!!! can you even have a discussion without changing goalposts/cherry picking? i honestly dont think you can.

You asked for context I'm providing it. 

Fact is head to head when Sony actually has a comparable system, they have outsold Nintendo ... and quite easily at that. Do you disagree with that? 

Yes of course having GB + GBA with no Sony equivalent is a huge advantage for Nintendo, it's not "moving goal posts" to point that out. I'm sure this would be pointed out by many Nintendo fans if the situation was reversed. 

Also beyond all that even if you want to include the GB + GBA, the gap is still not *that* big. You are talking like 500m versus 540-550 mill from 1995 onwards. Not the huge gap some people have been making it out to be. 

nobody asked you for context.

The discussion from the start has been about overall hardware numbers so yes excluding certain hardware from the equation is cherry picking which you are doing in your 2nd & 3rd paragraphs.

nobody has been making it out to be a huge gap, the whole argument started when someone made the false statement that the gap has been closing since Sony entered the hardware market.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

zorg1000 said:
Soundwave said:

You asked for context I'm providing it. 

Fact is head to head when Sony actually has a comparable system, they have outsold Nintendo ... and quite easily at that. Do you disagree with that? 

Yes of course having GB + GBA with no Sony equivalent is a huge advantage for Nintendo, it's not "moving goal posts" to point that out. I'm sure this would be pointed out by many Nintendo fans if the situation was reversed. 

Also beyond all that even if you want to include the GB + GBA, the gap is still not *that* big. You are talking like 500m versus 540-550 mill from 1995 onwards. Not the huge gap some people have been making it out to be. 

nobody asked you for context.

Well I'll ask you for context then, when head to head in actual competetion, system to system do you disagree that Sony has beaten Nintendo fairly convincingly overall?

Put them in head to head situations and Nintendo gets exposed a fair bit I would say. Nintendo needs those uncontested GB/GBA wins to pad their total, but when they actually have to compete directly against Sony, they get beaten quite regularily. 



Go PS4, gotta make to 100



My grammar errors are justified by the fact that I am a brazilian living in Brazil. I am also very stupid.

Soundwave said:
zorg1000 said:

nobody asked you for context.

Well I'll ask you for context then, when head to head in actual competetion, system to system do you disagree that Sony has beaten Nintendo fairly convincingly overall?

Put them in head to head situations and Nintendo gets exposed a fair bit I would say. Nintendo needs those uncontested GB/GBA wins to pad their total, but when they actually have to compete directly against Sony, they get beaten quite regularily. 

i hit post too soon, i edited my previous post.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

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RolStoppable said:
Soundwave said:

Well I'll ask you for context then, when head to head in actual competetion, system to system do you disagree that Sony has beaten Nintendo fairly convincingly overall?

Put them in head to head situations and Nintendo gets exposed a fair bit I would say. Nintendo needs those uncontested GB/GBA wins to pad their total, but when they actually have to compete directly against Sony, they get beaten quite regularily. 

I want to answer this question!

Yes, I disagree with your assertion. The most convincing win in the console market is when the competition calls it quits and makes an exit. Sony has not done this to Nintendo, but Nintendo has done it to Sony. So the biggest juggernaut in the console market isn't Sony, it's Nintendo. Nintendo has beaten even the highly regarded Sony into submission.

If you're referring to the Vita, which technically isn't a console, but whatever, I'd say the smartphone killed that. Nintendo took huge losses too (154 m DS owners down to 67-70m 3DS owners is an even bigger loss in raw consumer base than Wii to Wii U). 

Smartphone/tablets are like an explosion, Sony was the poor chap who was standing right next to the explosion and got oblierated almost instantly, Nintendo was a bit further away but still suffered severe burns and injuries from it but lived, but it will be a very different life after the explosion than before. 

Head to head though the numbers are the numbers even with the Vita factored in, overall Sony has more than held it's own as a whole when pitted against Nintendo, outselling them by over 100 million units in toe to toe competetion, even if we don't count a lot of PS4 sales that are to come and just assume PS4 never sells a unit past 55 million. 



RolStoppable said:
Soundwave said:

If you're referring to the Vita, which technically isn't a console, but whatever, I'd say the smartphone killed that. Nintendo took huge losses too (154 m DS owners down to 67-70m 3DS owners is an even bigger loss in raw consumer base than Wii to Wii U). 

Smartphone/tablets are like an explosion, Sony was the poor chap who was standing right next to the explosion and got oblierated almost instantly, Nintendo was a bit further away but still suffered severe burns and injuries from it but lived. 

Head to head though the numbers are the numbers even with the Vita factored in, overall Sony has more than held it's own as a whole when pitted against Nintendo, outselling them by over 100 million units in head to head competetion, even if we don't count a lot of PS4 sales that are to come. 

When Nintendo achieves the ultimate defeat, you turn around and attribute this event to someone other than Nintendo. Riiiight... Nintendo got lucky that they didn't get obliterated too.

Ignoring smartphones/tablets as a factor simply inane by this point. Anyone denying that didn't have an absolute monumental impact on the portable market is out to lunch, it's like saying Netflix didn't have any impact on Blockbuster Video. I mean they even made Nintendo bend over backwards and support a non-Nintendo plaform with actual in-house games for the first time in like 30 years. It's also killed off other industries too, like the point & click camera ... virtually extinct now. I'm old enough to remember just 10 years ago when people used to actually bring those cameras to the nightclub to take photos, smartphones killed all that and basically created the selfie craze.

Sony's portable audience was generally that teenager crowd and they pushed the PSP/Vita as kinda the do everything multimedia device ... which was neat in 2004. However it's pretty easy to see why an average 13-21 year old would look at a Vita by 2014 and say "fuck that, I got an iPhone". 



RolStoppable said:
Soundwave said:

Ignoring smartphones/tablets as a factor simply inane by this point. Anyone denying that didn't have an absolute monumental impact on the portable market is out to lunch, it's like saying Netflix didn't have any impact on Blockbuster Video. I mean they even made Nintendo bend over backwards and support a non-Nintendo plaform with actual in-house games for the first time in like 30 years. It's also killed off other industries too, like the point & click camera ... virtually extinct now. I'm old enough to remember a time when people used to actually bring those cameras to the nightclub to take photos, smartphones killed all that and basically created the selfie craze.

Sony's portable audience was generally that teenager crowd and they pushed the PSP/Vita as kinda the do everything multimedia device ... which was neat in 2004. However it's pretty easy to see why an average 13-21 year old would look at a Vita by 2014 and say "fuck that, I got my iPhone". 

Because Sony isn't as good as Nintendo at games?

Yeah but those people aren't buying a 3DS either, and the same Sony games sold 80 million PSPs just a few years prior. It's obvious what changed. 

It's a fair point too, I mean people out in public don't even look at each other anymore, just heads down at their smartphone, lol, where the fuck does a game system even fit in when regular conversation has taken a big hit. 

If you want to talk Sony Vs. Nintendo, Sony more than holds its own head to head against Nintendo culminatively. There's no way around that. 



RolStoppable said:
Soundwave said:

Yeah but those people aren't buying a 3DS either, and the same Sony games sold 80 million PSPs just a few years prior. It's obvious what changed. 

It's a fair point too, I mean people out in public don't even look at each other anymore, just heads down at their smartphone, lol, where the fuck does a game system even fit in when regular conversation has taken a big hit. 

So Sony's consumer base isn't really interested in video games to begin with, but rather lifestyle products?

Sony's audience is basically the NES audience, just if the average NES owner was 19-year-old+ instead of a 10-year-old+. They took the NES concept and tailored it towards their strengths (of being a movie/music/electronics company) and making it more sophisticated in a marketing/sales sense by aiming a little older than what Nintendo or even Sega were doing. 

But it works. 

But that was actually the main assumption in the 80s/90s, I remember being told this over and over again by adults too when I was a kid ... "sure you like this Nintendo stuff now, but surely by the time you're 18/19 you'll grow out it, games are not the same as movies or music" ... well Sony basically bet the farm that those 18/19/20 year olds who grew up on the NES would still be interested in playing games ... and they were basically correct. 

12-28 year old males tend to like video games. There's never going to be IMO a demographic that has more of an interest in gaming or a desire to spend hours upon hours a day playing games. As long as Sony dominates this demographic they're pretty much going to sell 100 million Playstations like clockwork, for Nintendo or MS this requires incredible effort and likely some lucky bounces too. For Sony 100m for a Playstation by now is just a yawn. 

They are going to sell 100 million+ Playstation 4s and they will do it easily at that. Playstation 5 will be the same thing unless they do something monumentally stupid in designing it. 



Damn this is still going