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Forums - General Discussion - Instagram 'removes' post by activist Amber Amour 'live blogging' her rape

bunchanumbers said:
Guys are going to have to start walking around with paper contracts that show that the sex is consented. Not to mention having witnesses and notaries and lawyers to verify the paper. Its pretty much the only way to prevent someone from claiming that they were raped. Even then I'm betting that there are people who will still claim as such. At this point we'll need to see signed contracts, lawyer and judge approval, and trauma therapists on standby in case things go wrong.

 

No. 99.9% of guys are not accused of rape and even when reported to police, only 18% actually of cases actually result in an actual prosecution.



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only777 said:
CosmicSex said:
Yes it sounds dodgy, but if she says she was raped than what really needs to happen is that the police need to investigate. I know too many girls who were actually rapped so lets not act like this isn't a serious issue. Faking rape is also serious as well... because well, its a real issue. Worse yet, most of the rape cases I know of involved girls who were under-aged... which is even more depressing.

Oh of course rape is a very real and awful thing.  But I think people like this ruin it for the many people who are real victims.  No sane person could argue that getting naked and taking a shower with someone isn't giving someone an open invitation for sex.

Doing that then claiming rape is bollocks, and just only makes it harder for the real people who are abused to be taken seriously.

Also to irresponsibility of travelling to South Africa to promote an anti rape campaign, and then not report her own incident to the police.  I mean come on.

At any point, any individual has the freedom to remove consent (if they've even given it). Being naked is not consent to sex. You can be flirtatious as fuck and give out whatever signals you want, and people may understandably respond  with sexual advances, but you have the freedom to say no. And by law and basic morals they must comply by that. No one has authority over your body and its never the victims fault, even if they could have avoided the interaction all together. The premise is as simple as going to a restaurant, ordering a meal and deciding not to eat it. No one can or should force you to eat it, not even the chef who painstakingly put it together. 

If people want to bemoan her for being reckless , at the very least seperate that discussion from whether she was raped or not. 2 very different topics.



Wyrdness said:
DonFerrari said:

Well poisining the jury is illegal, but since it was even before the case was made or open by police how would a judge look at it?

A lawyer can argue to a judge that a fair trial is now unlikely because of the action and media coverage because any potential jury may have already heard her side of the story already, as Insidb explained these are common tactics and the result is the trial either gets moved to a location deemed to not have any or much exposure to the coverage or a specific jury from such a location may have to be brought in or a mistrial will have to be called, it would be extremely difficult for her side to argue against that as well. This one major reason why investigations try to keep coverage to a minimum.

In the case where a trial gets moved or a specific jury is brought in it becomes harder for the plaintiff in this case because as mentioned a smart lawyer would use her unusual actions here against her, even a lawyer just turning to a jury and saying if you were being assaulted would you go to the police first or instagram would be a powerful blow in sowing reasonable doubt.

Yep, what the lawyer would do I can imagine... but my question is how far back can the judge accept it. But yes I see all this as mostly tampering her chances on the court, but I also think it would be hard to make a case against her for false accusatiom. So if her intentios are policital she will still use the case on twitter to promote herself.

teigaga said:
only777 said:
CosmicSex said:
Yes it sounds dodgy, but if she says she was raped than what really needs to happen is that the police need to investigate. I know too many girls who were actually rapped so lets not act like this isn't a serious issue. Faking rape is also serious as well... because well, its a real issue. Worse yet, most of the rape cases I know of involved girls who were under-aged... which is even more depressing.

Oh of course rape is a very real and awful thing.  But I think people like this ruin it for the many people who are real victims.  No sane person could argue that getting naked and taking a shower with someone isn't giving someone an open invitation for sex.

Doing that then claiming rape is bollocks, and just only makes it harder for the real people who are abused to be taken seriously.

Also to irresponsibility of travelling to South Africa to promote an anti rape campaign, and then not report her own incident to the police.  I mean come on.

At any point, any individual has the freedom to remove consent (if they've even given it). Being naked is not consent to sex. You can be flirtatious as fuck and give out whatever signals you want, and people may understandably respond  with sexual advances, but you have the freedom to say no. And by law and basic morals they must comply by that. No one has authority over your body and its never the victims fault, even if they could have avoided the interaction all together. The premise is as simple as going to a restaurant, ordering a meal and deciding not to eat it. No one can or should force you to eat it, not even the chef who painstakingly put it together. 

If people want to bemoan her for being reckless , at the very least seperate that discussion from whether she was raped or not. 2 very different topics.

So in your analogy If you are in the middle of sex (after penetration) and the person say he/she doesn't want anymore and the other part continue is that also rape? And if after having your food delivered and ate 70% of it can you say it isn't very good and you want to return it and not to pay?



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

What a total fucking joke. Making real activists look bad.



DonFerrari said:

Yep, what the lawyer would do I can imagine... but my question is how far back can the judge accept it. But yes I see all this as mostly tampering her chances on the court, but I also think it would be hard to make a case against her for false accusatiom. So if her intentios are policital she will still use the case on twitter to promote herself.

 

 


It comes down to who the judge is as the's no real rule set in stone, if it's a genuine case any use of it to promote herself could go against her, rape cases are already hard to prove for both sides but if no trial happens and she continues to use it to promote herself she could find herself being sued by the accused as it can be seen as something similar to severe slander.



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spemanig said:
The reason she posted the rape on instagram first is because she runs an instagram that focuses on empowering women to be brave enough to speak out when they are sexually harassed and/or abused; an instagram she started because she was raped as a child and wanted to use her tragedy as a platform for change and strength. She was capturing a moment and making a statement. The longer she waited, the weaker the statement and less real the moment.

She felt it would be hypocritical of her to be such an activist about this topic with a social platform specifically created for this type of message, and then not do something so drastic now that she was put into such a situation.

And are you fucking kidding?! Dodgy? Do you even understand what rape is? Do you understand how consent works? Do you even understand what happened? Did you even read the post?

She said stop and he continued. Worse - he got violent. End of story. Nothing dodgy. It's rape. It doesn't matter if they were in the shower, on the floor, or in the middle of fucking doggy style. As soon as one person stops consenting and the other person continues anyway, it's rape. She consented to getting into the shower with him. She did not consent to being forced to her knees. If she said stop and he actually stopped, it wouldn't have been rape, but a misunderstanding that was immediately clarified. But that's not what happened. She said stop and he got violent. She said stop again and he started having sex with her. She started to cry and he kept going. She passed out, woke up again, saw him trying to sneak out, got caught, and then was "finished off" by him.

That's not dodgy. That is rape.

The only people not looking at the information she posted are people like you. I literally can't believe this is even being debated.

Without knowing the background any better, what's shady is, that this isn't just some naive little girl, but someone who actually should know better the situations where you're at a risk of getting raped. Some drunk guy puts a pressure on you to shower with him, and that doesn't ring a bell? 





Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

teigaga said:
only777 said:
CosmicSex said:
Yes it sounds dodgy, but if she says she was raped than what really needs to happen is that the police need to investigate. I know too many girls who were actually rapped so lets not act like this isn't a serious issue. Faking rape is also serious as well... because well, its a real issue. Worse yet, most of the rape cases I know of involved girls who were under-aged... which is even more depressing.

Oh of course rape is a very real and awful thing.  But I think people like this ruin it for the many people who are real victims.  No sane person could argue that getting naked and taking a shower with someone isn't giving someone an open invitation for sex.

Doing that then claiming rape is bollocks, and just only makes it harder for the real people who are abused to be taken seriously.

Also to irresponsibility of travelling to South Africa to promote an anti rape campaign, and then not report her own incident to the police.  I mean come on.

At any point, any individual has the freedom to remove consent (if they've even given it). Being naked is not consent to sex. You can be flirtatious as fuck and give out whatever signals you want, and people may understandably respond  with sexual advances, but you have the freedom to say no. And by law and basic morals they must comply by that. No one has authority over your body and its never the victims fault, even if they could have avoided the interaction all together. The premise is as simple as going to a restaurant, ordering a meal and deciding not to eat it. No one can or should force you to eat it, not even the chef who painstakingly put it together. 

If people want to bemoan her for being reckless , at the very least seperate that discussion from whether she was raped or not. 2 very different topics.

Well, your restaurant example was maybe the worst there is. That's right that nobody can force you to eat it, but once you make an order and the food is done for you, you still have to pay it. Well technically not, but once in a court the court needs to decide whether you'd need pay it or not. Making the case as of not having sex with someone, the court would need to decide if you had to have sex with the guy you gave consent to, but eventually decided not to.





Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

Nem said:

This is a distasteful generalization. This is flat out a biased lie.

Gets herself drunk with friends... things get handsy... oh poor girl... how did she get herself in this situation? Can't she drink herself into a stupor, probably behave sexually and teasing and then get touched by other drunk people?Is she the only one allowed to misbehave/make a mistake? WTF is this? Are you serious?

Beeing called a "slut" "bitch" and so on? Probably more likely to happen by her female friends than men. Men will only do that if they actually behave that way.

And honestly this is so unrealistic and complete opposite. My experience has been that women are way bossier, abusive and more opressive than men. And then play this victim game to get their way.

Rape? If its true its deplorable indeed, but this woman that portrays herself as a drunken stupor keeps acting like a drunken stupor... perhaps she should behave in a matter that doesnt demean herself so no one would get funny ideas? Maybe watch who she hangs out with?
Marital disagreements are normal aswell. Hitting isn't though. If he hits you, you should make clear you will leave him. But its not like this doesn't happen the other way around though. More common is the case of abusive wives who won't let their husbands hang out with their friends or have their own activities.

Distasteful, disgusting. I will never give them the preferencial treatment they want. They are not victims. I will treat them as normal human beeings. This goes for all minorities, wich isnt even the case of women, though they love to behave like they are.
Thankfully, not all behave in this way.

The person portrayed in this video is far from a victim, except for the rape claim, that is inexcusable, even if she could just watch her company better. The husband and marital problem things, they are more complex than that, and those things don't happen without a reason. There are no innocent sides. If it is indeed the case, dump him. Easy. Just cause on guy is abusive doesnt mean they all are. Oh... and learn to choose better. Seems to be the classic case of not knowing who to hang out with. Daddy gave you a brain. Use it.

I agree with you 100%... she certainly is well aware of the risks, statistics and whatnot to make this "honest mistake"

And Although feminists preach women are the victm and at the same time stronger and better than men (can't make sense out of it) they forget to look at all the cases women have acted very bad and caused the man to go crazy... it's always man fault.

Wyrdness said:
DonFerrari said:

Yep, what the lawyer would do I can imagine... but my question is how far back can the judge accept it. But yes I see all this as mostly tampering her chances on the court, but I also think it would be hard to make a case against her for false accusatiom. So if her intentios are policital she will still use the case on twitter to promote herself.

It comes down to who the judge is as the's no real rule set in stone, if it's a genuine case any use of it to promote herself could go against her, rape cases are already hard to prove for both sides but if no trial happens and she continues to use it to promote herself she could find herself being sued by the accused as it can be seen as something similar to severe slander.

I see, even if she suppress his name and face?

bdbdbd said:
teigaga said:
only777 said:

Oh of course rape is a very real and awful thing.  But I think people like this ruin it for the many people who are real victims.  No sane person could argue that getting naked and taking a shower with someone isn't giving someone an open invitation for sex.

Doing that then claiming rape is bollocks, and just only makes it harder for the real people who are abused to be taken seriously.

Also to irresponsibility of travelling to South Africa to promote an anti rape campaign, and then not report her own incident to the police.  I mean come on.

At any point, any individual has the freedom to remove consent (if they've even given it). Being naked is not consent to sex. You can be flirtatious as fuck and give out whatever signals you want, and people may understandably respond  with sexual advances, but you have the freedom to say no. And by law and basic morals they must comply by that. No one has authority over your body and its never the victims fault, even if they could have avoided the interaction all together. The premise is as simple as going to a restaurant, ordering a meal and deciding not to eat it. No one can or should force you to eat it, not even the chef who painstakingly put it together. 

If people want to bemoan her for being reckless , at the very least seperate that discussion from whether she was raped or not. 2 very different topics.

Well, your restaurant example was maybe the worst there is. That's right that nobody can force you to eat it, but once you make an order and the food is done for you, you still have to pay it. Well technically not, but once in a court the court needs to decide whether you'd need pay it or not. Making the case as of not having sex with someone, the court would need to decide if you had to have sex with the guy you gave consent to, but eventually decided not to.

Well Going to the restaurant is the equivalent of flirting... ordering the food is already a lot further.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

SpokenTruth said:
DonFerrari said:

So in your analogy If you are in the middle of sex (after penetration) and the person say he/she doesn't want anymore and the other part continue is that also rape?

The mere fact you have to ask this question is why we still need awareness campaigns.

No means no.  

I'm asking him because of his analogy... because if you are about to finish your food and say you don't want anymore you can't return and not pay it.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:

II see, even if she suppress his name and face?

 

Yeah because it can still lead back to him, it's a highly sensitive issue that can't be taken lightly for either party.