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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Is 900p okay? Is Xbox One a worthy 8th gen console now?

Knitemare said:

I consider myself a graphic whore.

Having said that, more important than the 720p, 900p or 1080p is if the game graphics look real. And by this I mean, i can cope with a game that has 720p over a game with 1080p as long as the animation, shadows, movement of the characters look real. Of course, in games like cell shaded for example, you cannot expect real, so there is where pixels really get important to me, but in the end, for anime-like video game, you dont need that much resolution.

So in response to your question, 900p its ok with me as long as the game plays nice and looks the closest possible to reality.

Would you be fine with 480p if that makes real time ray tracing possible?
It's a trade off between level of detail and the resolution to be able to show it. You can have long draw distance with high detail objects, yet if that gets lost in upscaling fuzziness than what's the point. Too high res can also diminish the 'realness' factor. Last gen's remasters certainly run well, but you can also easily spot all the low detail model and building meshes. Also this gen, Infamous SS was a bit of a mixed bag to me. The foreground looks very nicely detailed yet the background is always out of focus, I guess to hide the lod transitions. The feeling that the fore and background don't quite fit never went away.
I do prefer not having any upscaling fuzziness though. Better have some things sharp than none at all.



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If it is 900 60fps then yes. People caring  too much about the 1080p instead of 60fps.

PS4/XB1/WiiU/(OUYA) are affordable gaming console, they're not hi-tech cutting-edge systems. 60fps should be the standard instead of 1080p, lot of Wii U games are 720p only but people love it, why ? Because it's on 60fps. In 60fps, the games looks smoother, play better and it just make the games looks GOOD! even if the game fps dropped, you wouldnt noticed at all.

60FPS! Nation!



Pemalite said:
H3ADShOt3 said:

So then if making these consoles more powerfull than a pc when it first releases it will automaticly make it cost 700$/600$? How did mircosoft manage to make the 360 pretty much more powerful than a pc at the time for 400$ in 2005? My knowlage ain't huge on this but I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be impossible to get it under sub 500$ at launch if they were more powerful..


You can't have a console more powerful than a PC. It's never happened and never will.

The proof is in the games, PC games always look better. Always.

Most consoles use PC derived parts anyway, the Xbox 360 for instance used a Radeon x19xx/2900 series semi-custom hybrid GPU, it wasn't more powerful than what PC gamers had at the time.
PC Gamers also have the option of multiple cards.


The fact of the matter is... AMD's Graphics Core Next GPU/architecture is old.
That particular GPU architecture was already a few years old when the current consoles launched, it was already past it's use-by-date.

AMD has done some re-organizing and refocusing recently to try and become competitive again, hopefully that means a new GPU architecture more often, having the same cards on the market for 5~ years has been unprecedented.

The consoles *could* have been faster if AMD spent more money in R&D, but AMD is doing it tough I am afraid.
Ironically even PC gamers are turning away from them which has impacted AMD's bottom line and ability to compete.


A very long time ago consoles where pretty different and relied on custom chips>not as versatile as PC hardware back then but could achieve things a PC couldn't or only a ten times more expensive PC could.

With PC-HW getting more and more features like 2D acceleration, 3D acceleration, more and more capabilities like HW-T&L, shaders... that slowly vanished, though fast hardware stayed expensive.

 

About consoles price and power:

360 and PS3 where massively subsidized, one reason of the long time losses MS and Sony made. Ad the RoD to that, cost tons of money again.

More power also means more heat and energy consumption, likely a bigger console and/or louder fan.

 

Let's look at the PS4, it's smaller, more powerful at least GPU-wise so:

2x GPU power would roughly mean 2x the power consumption if you're going for shaderunits. If you're going for clock speed it's even worse. Then you need a more powerful CPU to actually feed that GPU and because putting more and more cores into a CPU doesn't make that much sense it possibly would be about clock speed at least to some degree.

So our console gets way more energy hungry>cooling gets bigger/more expensive and possibly louder, console gets bigger.

More die space for the APU needed>higher price per APU

Lower yield because of more failures per APU> higher price again

You need more memory bandwidth> wider bus and more expensive mainboard.

 

In the end  two times the power might make manufacturing more than two times expensive.



daredevil.shark said:
I want solid frame rate. 30 fps or 60 fps doesn't matter. And I want complete game at launch. Not broken game to be patched later. Resolution was never a concern for me.


But games nowadays are already broken and it's more a rule than an exception that games have (sometimes) huge day 1 patches. And I think this trend will be there to stay and even to get worse.



captain carot said:


A very long time ago consoles where pretty different and relied on custom chips>not as versatile as PC hardware back then but could achieve things a PC couldn't or only a ten times more expensive PC could.

With PC-HW getting more and more features like 2D acceleration, 3D acceleration, more and more capabilities like HW-T&L, shaders... that slowly vanished, though fast hardware stayed expensive.


The PC was always ahead of consoles, I was part of the "3D revolution".

As soon as 3dfx burst onto the scene with the 3dfx Voodoo... The PC was ahead starting in the mid 90's, especially with games that utilised the GLIDE API.
When the Voodoo 2 launched in the late 90's, we were able to have multiple graphics cards in a system. Aka. SLI which allowed PC gamers to run games at higher resolutions, even console ports like Final Fantasy 7 and 8 or Turok, with better texturing and filtering.

Before that... Whilst people were playing with 2D consoles... Aka. Before the Nintendo 64, Playstation or Saturn... PC was already enjoying full 3D textured graphics with games like Descent.

We also had Sound Blaster. We had *full* Audio, which was absolutely huge back then.

The PC was then the first platform to jump to TnL. Then Pixel Shaders. Then Unified Shaders.
Heck... We had Graphics cards capable of Tessellation back in the Direct X 8.1 days. - Aka. the Original Xbox/Playstation 2/Gamecube era.

The PC even had 1080P monitors in the mid 90's. 20 years before it's "almost" a standard on consoles. ;)

Turok PC vs Nintendo 64. (PC Has better graphics.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nQEOv3t4tm0&fmt=18


Final Fantasy 8 PC vs Playstation 1. (PC Has better graphics.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWhTWBsQaVk

Quake PC vs Playstation 1. (PC has better graphics.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDqLaGkiDcQ

Doom. PC vs SNES. (PC Has better graphics.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-jLUsWl9mY

I even remember seeing comparisons of Mechwarrior 2 running on a PC under GLIDE beating out the Sega Saturn version too.

Overall. PC has always had a technical edge.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

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Roronaa_chan said:
Goatseye said:

 however, for the last couple of months, games that focused on satisfying gamers' 1080p lust, have fallen from grace especially, due to their lack of content or gameplay depth.

 

Like?


like the witcher, bloodborne, metal gear solid, infamous second son, rocket league, driveclub, dragon age, farcry, dying light and a lot more. they all suck, have bad gameplay and little to no content. 



Pemalite said:

 


The PC was always ahead of consoles, I was part of the "3D revolution".

 The PC was ahead starting in the mid 90's, especially with games that utilised the GLIDE API.

Now what? Always or since the 90's?

 

I've played on PC since the early 90's. Even older games.

PC benefited from 'cheap' storage to some degree, as did home computers back then. But 2D capabilities where well behind consoles for a long time.

3D wise, PC's could count on strong CPU's if those had an FPU back then. Until consoles like 3DO, Jaguar and Playstation released with 3D capabilities on par or better than PC's back then for a way lower price.

That changed to some degree when 3DFX released Voodoo cards and Glide and even more so with DirectX 6 and cards like the first TNT. Still, consoles like Dreamcast where cheap but strong while a decent gaming PC was expensive and lasted for two to three years.

 

All that has changed.

 

About those 1080p monitors, i remember CRT's like an incredibly expensive CAD monitor. At the same time 2D PC games usually had 640x480 - 800x600 and even with a fast rig you could be happy to get decent framerates with 1025x768 in 3D games.

 

Nope, PC didn't always have the cutting edge. As a gaming platform it was pretty shitty for almost a decade, with VGA and Soundblaster being the first game changers, one soundcard alone almost as expensive as a console though.



captain carot said:
Pemalite said:
 

 


The PC was always ahead of consoles, I was part of the "3D revolution".

 The PC was ahead starting in the mid 90's, especially with games that utilised the GLIDE API.

Now what? Always or since the 90's?

 

I've played on PC since the early 90's. Even older games.

PC benefited from 'cheap' storage to some degree, as did home computers back then. But 2D capabilities where well behind consoles for a long time.

3D wise, PC's could count on strong CPU's if those had an FPU back then. Until consoles like 3DO, Jaguar and Playstation released with 3D capabilities on par or better than PC's back then for a way lower price.

That changed to some degree when 3DFX released Voodoo cards and Glide and even more so with DirectX 6 and cards like the first TNT. Still, consoles like Dreamcast where cheap but strong while a decent gaming PC was expensive and lasted for two to three years.

 

All that has changed.

 

About those 1080p monitors, i remember CRT's like an incredibly expensive CAD monitor. At the same time 2D PC games usually had 640x480 - 800x600 and even with a fast rig you could be happy to get decent framerates with 1025x768 in 3D games.

 

Nope, PC didn't always have the cutting edge. As a gaming platform it was pretty shitty for almost a decade, with VGA and Soundblaster being the first game changers, one soundcard alone almost as expensive as a console though.


You can still get £700 sound cards. things are always relative in their time, the only thing with PC that has changed a lot is the building process. It's much easier now it's basically lego.



There's only 2 races: White and 'Political Agenda'
2 Genders: Male and 'Political Agenda'
2 Hairstyles for female characters: Long and 'Political Agenda'
2 Sexualities: Straight and 'Political Agenda'

All gen 8 consoles are shit (except Vita) when it comes to performance. That happens when you use produce as computing components. So no, it doesn't matter that X1 or Wii U are 20 or 100% more shit than PS4. They're all still shit. And even PS4 can fuck right off with its 1080p if it's not able to give me some god damn stable framerates.

Gen 9 can't come soon enough.



If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

To me the jump to next gen is valid when graphics during regular gameplay look the way they looked during in-engine cut sceens during the previous gen. Having said that, both Xbone and PS4 are valid next gen consoles.

Still, I've decided to move to PC gaming now (I've already selected the parts for my PC and right now I'm searching for best prices), but not because of better graphics, but a much wider array of gaming experience that a PC has to offer. I can't play RTS games on a console and it really bothers me. Almost all console games are shooters and I was raised on Red Alert and Starcraft, so I miss these kinds of games. I miss Starcraft 2, I miss Company of Heroes, I can't wait for Total War: Warhammer. I won't get these games on a console, while I'll get almost all shooters on PC, with better graphics and mods on top. I'll wait with the purchase of PS4/Xbone till I get a decent raise In the mean time, my backlog on PS3 and Vita is enough to satisfy the console experience itch

That's why I've decided to go PC now, while keeping an eye on what Nintendo is doing, cause they are doing stuff that PC doesn't offer.



Wii U is a GCN 2 - I called it months before the release!

My Vita to-buy list: The Walking Dead, Persona 4 Golden, Need for Speed: Most Wanted, TearAway, Ys: Memories of Celceta, Muramasa: The Demon Blade, History: Legends of War, FIFA 13, Final Fantasy HD X, X-2, Worms Revolution Extreme, The Amazing Spiderman, Batman: Arkham Origins Blackgate - too many no-gaemz :/

My consoles: PS2 Slim, PS3 Slim 320 GB, PSV 32 GB, Wii, DSi.