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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Nintendo Fans Vs. Third-Party Developers & Entitlement

oniyide said:
Captain_Yuri said:

You do realize that this is about why Nintendo fans are bitching about third parties right? The thread is about Nintendo fans vs third parties afterall and my posts have explained why Nintendo fans may not like third parties and they have every right to... So I don't get what you are trying to say here

And the issue is that they shouldn't have done it in the first place. The fact that they released games with missing content and etc is nonsense. Now they aren't releasing anything which is fine since its a waste of money for almost everyone but the fact that they did and thought that they could get away with it is what the issue is and it left a pretty bad impression on many people.


because the games that werent missing content sold so well, right.

Well I never said that it will guarantee great sales but it has a higher chance of selling well compared to a game that is gimped and it wouldn't have been seen so badly by the Nintendo fans. Heck, the only game that I recall getting all the stuff as the other consoles is Rayman Legends but that thing had a black mark on it cause it was delayed for the wiiU just so they can release it at the sametime as the ps3/360 and not before even though it was ready for its prime time according to the developer so even that has some issues with it.



                  

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See, most Nintendo fans basically created themselves a paradox. They say they'll refuse to buy third party titles until developers start to put out titles that make the most of the hardware, while developers won't put the time and money into making the most of the hardware until they see that their games can sell on the system. I say it's the fans that created the paradox for the simple fact that there's no reason why they can't buy games and deal with a few performance issues to support the devs while they work out the kinks for future titles. Look at the PS3 user base. I don't think any user base has ever been shafted by third party developers than the PS3 user base was, initially, but PS3 still bought the games, and eventually third party devs started taking the console and it's users seriously. Until these Nintendo fans, that complain, can start putting their wallet where their mouth is, the console is still going to be mostly ignored.

On the topic of the Wii-U version of project cars, I'm not entirely sure why Slightly Mad Studios ever put so much emphasis there to begin with, as it's highly unlikely the title would've received much support there.



0331 Happiness is a belt-fed weapon

zippy said:
If Nintendo expanded and got more in house studios to pump out their great games at a faster rate, we wouldnt even have a 3rd party situation, They would be rendered obsolete. I honestly dont know why Nintendo dont just do away with 3rd parties and create a bunch of garage teams. Let Retro handle western style games, and aquire somebody like Shinen who have a great track record with Ninty hardware, to make racers and action games.


Well if Nintendo does indeed go for a unified approach where all or most games are playable on either the handheld or console than such a situation will likely occur without having to greatly expand.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

zippy said:
If Nintendo expanded and got more in house studios to pump out their great games at a faster rate, we wouldnt even have a 3rd party situation, They would be rendered obsolete. I honestly dont know why Nintendo dont just do away with 3rd parties and create a bunch of garage teams. Let Retro handle western style games, and aquire somebody like Shinen who have a great track record with Ninty hardware, to make racers and action games.


I think this notion is more fantasy than reality. 

In the last 30 years of home console sales, the only console to sell more than 35 million units (generally the threshold to consider something a strong success) have been home platforms that have all/most of the major third party software. 

The only exception to this is the first Wii, which didn't really do anything to the PS2 marketbase (that just got split between the PS3 and 360), it just attracted a different crowd of non-gamers like fitness focused women and the gamers it did sell to used it a secondary "family fun/party with friends" machine for a couple of years before disgarding it. 

The truth is even the NES and SNES probably would also have sold only about 20 million units each if you stripped both of them of their third party support. Ditto for the Playstation, PS2, PS3, and XBox 360. 



160rmf said:
oniyide said:


its a good stance but if they trule believed it why even comment on the issue? why be upset?


Why upset? Maybe because we are on a videogame sales site? It upsets me that a console with so many great games are failling behind the others bc the lack of COD and Yearly sport games

ok and? If that is really killing your enjoyment of the system then i feel bad for you. :( When PS3 was getting smacked around i liked it just as much as when it made a comeback which is alot. 

And your definition of "great games" means nothing and is not a standard barometer. The sooner people here accept that the happier they will be. Its and a childish and frankly ignorant attitude. The system is falling behind for many reasons games is just one of them.



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zippy said:
oniyide said:
are some people pretending DLCs matter all that much? OK

If it is of the value and quality of Mario Kart 8 DLC then yes :)


are those Mario Kart DLCs free? I only played the regular game and 200ccs at a friends house. DLC is DLC and last i checked less than half of the people buy it for any given game.



twintail said:
zippy said:
If Nintendo expanded and got more in house studios to pump out their great games at a faster rate, we wouldnt even have a 3rd party situation, They would be rendered obsolete. I honestly dont know why Nintendo dont just do away with 3rd parties and create a bunch of garage teams. Let Retro handle western style games, and aquire somebody like Shinen who have a great track record with Ninty hardware, to make racers and action games.


Sorry buddy... Nintendo investing more in 1st party and ditching 3rd party is not going to change their fortunes.


Only if u assume that those 1st party titles will just be more of the same and wont include a bunch of new ip. Look at Wii/DS when Nintendo was invested heavily in new casual focused ip like the Wii Sports, Nintendogs, Brain Training, Wii Fit, Art Acadamy, Style Savvy, Electroplankton, Endless Ocean, etc.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

zorg1000 said:
twintail said:


Sorry buddy... Nintendo investing more in 1st party and ditching 3rd party is not going to change their fortunes.


Only if u assume that those 1st party titles will just be more of the same and wont include a bunch of new ip. Look at Wii/DS when Nintendo was invested heavily in new ip with mass market appeal like the Wii Series, Nintendogs, Brain Training.


Of course though that approach really won't work again (not in the same way) because of smart devices offering like a thousand of that same type of software for free. 

The question is whether or not Nintendo has another trick like that up their sleeve that can work in a different way. I'm not sure. Those types of ideas are pretty hard to just pull out on demand. 



Captain_Yuri said:
oniyide said:
Captain_Yuri said:

You do realize that this is about why Nintendo fans are bitching about third parties right? The thread is about Nintendo fans vs third parties afterall and my posts have explained why Nintendo fans may not like third parties and they have every right to... So I don't get what you are trying to say here

And the issue is that they shouldn't have done it in the first place. The fact that they released games with missing content and etc is nonsense. Now they aren't releasing anything which is fine since its a waste of money for almost everyone but the fact that they did and thought that they could get away with it is what the issue is and it left a pretty bad impression on many people.


because the games that werent missing content sold so well, right.

Well I never said that it will guarantee great sales but it has a higher chance of selling well compared to a game that is gimped and it wouldn't have been seen so badly by the Nintendo fans. Heck, the only game that I recall getting all the stuff as the other consoles is Rayman Legends but that thing had a black mark on it cause it was delayed for the wiiU just so they can release it at the sametime as the ps3/360 and not before even though it was ready for its prime time according to the developer so even that has some issues with it.

Tekken Tag Tournamet 2, Ninja Gaiden 3, Darksiders 2, Mass Effect 3, Batman Arkham City, Injustice, Need for Speed and thats just off the top of my head. Those games were not gimped and they still sold like sick.

Rayman is not a good example. First should not have even been Wii U exclusive in the first place since it has been proven by now that game is better released multiplat and most of its fans are on Sony systems (we'll get to that later) 2nd its not like that game lit the charts on fire on any system really. 3rd (and this goes to my first point) it sold worse than PS3 and 4 version, "but the PS3 has a much bigger install base" true didnt stop PS4 version from beating it despite coming out much later. Bonus this is usually where people say but those are late ports, excuses late ports sell. So many examples im not even gonna list them, we all know.



Soundwave said:
zorg1000 said:


Only if u assume that those 1st party titles will just be more of the same and wont include a bunch of new ip. Look at Wii/DS when Nintendo was invested heavily in new ip with mass market appeal like the Wii Series, Nintendogs, Brain Training.


Of course though that approach really won't work again (not in the same way) because of smart devices offering like a thousand of that same type of software for free. 

The question is whether or not Nintendo has another trick like that up their sleeve that can work in a different way. I'm not sure. Those types of ideas are pretty hard to just pull out on demand. 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that Wii/DS level sales are going to happen again but there is a huge middle ground between Wii/DS & Wii U/3DS sales and with the right strategy they can improve their current situation.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.