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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Fire Emblem's new anime direction (RANT)

ToraTiger said:
StarOcean said:
ToraTiger said:


Well said.  But I don't think Nintendo fans are caring about animeish games, as they seem to love Golden Sun and games like that.  But I think it becomes a problem when they start japanesifing their older existing games (due to their western market shrinking and marketing primiarly to japan) Games like Kid Icarus, Metroid, Fire Emblem are a few examples that they really didnt need to japanesify.  I loved the comic eques style of metroid, it was so fitting and original, now since Other M it turned into a poor japanese shooter alternative.

That's true, but similar instances happen with western developers. I'm more familiar with western culture, because I live in it and do tend to see a lot heavily crutching with western stereotypes. It isn't a problem with Japan, its widespread and is a discussion for another thread. 

I don't feel like KI or Metroid have been heavily easternized, KI took a more anime sort of style to it but then again back in the NES/GB days it lacked a specific style to begin with, the character art being based off of the sprites vs the other way around. Metroid, no clue because Ive never really played same for FE. But I'm sure they've been more story/character impacted with Japanese qualities vs. style and its the qualities that bother you.

 

I'm not saying western games don't have stereotypes, but you saying it isn't a problem in Japan (If i am reading that right?) that is completely untrue.  Look at every japanese RPG released in the pass 20 years, nearly all of them have the exact same fantasy setting of a teenager or young adult saving the world from some kind of evil god.  That is literally the plot of 70 percent of popular JRPGs.  

And I don't see how KI doesnt come off as anime to you?  Look at Palutena she looks like something from an 90s anime, and same for Hades and Medusa.   We're yet to see after other M, but as of that game I can confirm its riddled with lame anime cliches and story tropes, as well as the art style.  

Honestly I dont care for anime style as long as they arent completely changing an older franchise into some strange weeaboo concuction. 

I'm saying both sides of the globe suffer from the same problem, but are equally to blame. But yes, that template is used a lot nowadays in JRPGs, isn't it?

The style is more anime, yes. But I'd say it's a bit more light anime than other games -speaking purely in style. I dont know, I just feel like the style they used was relatively like compared to more common anime (look at my profile/sig). The plot, maybe. I've never played KI:U since it's so left hander unfriendly T.T Other M, from what I've seen in art style it doesn't seem that anime but they may have used a more cartoon-y aproach due to the limitations the Wii had. Story? Maybe, never played it. 



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ToraTiger said:
sundin13 said:


I'm not sure how any of those things harm the quality of the game in any way and the injection of personality into the series really only made it better.


The point is they're taking their old works and completely changing the feel and tone, and just adding anime into it.  If its a new franchise that has an anime-ish setting and plot like Xenoblade X, that's fine but changing them and completely changing the feel to their older works is atrocious tbh.


The point is fairly silly as like I said, they took something hollow and filled it. Kid Icarus was overall lacking personality and they filled it. Metroid's story was generally hollow and they filled it (although the writing and the boxes they were written into severely harmed the final product). In these two cases, it is simply a Japanese company injecting personality into works and you complaining because anime.

I don't really see your conclusion of this argument other than "anime is bad and it should stay out of my games".



This is one of the big things keeping me from this game, and just about every other JRPG. I absolutely detest the cutesy "waifu" anime style. More power to the people that dig it, but those generic at best and brain-implodingly-annoying at worst anime tropes found in basically every JRPG pretty much ensure I'll never touch any of them regardless of how great everyone says they are.



Currently playing:

Bloodbath Paddy Wagon Ultra 9

DerpSandwich said:
This is one of the big things keeping me from this game, and just about every other JRPG. I absolutely detest the cutesy "waifu" anime style. More power to the people that dig it, but those generic at best and brain-implodingly-annoying at worst anime tropes found in basically every JRPG pretty much ensure I'll never touch any of them regardless of how great everyone says they are.

Dragon Quest VIII doesn't do the waifu thing!



sundin13 said:
ToraTiger said:


The point is they're taking their old works and completely changing the feel and tone, and just adding anime into it.  If its a new franchise that has an anime-ish setting and plot like Xenoblade X, that's fine but changing them and completely changing the feel to their older works is atrocious tbh.


The point is fairly silly as like I said, they took something hollow and filled it. Kid Icarus was overall lacking personality and they filled it. Metroid's story was generally hollow and they filled it (although the writing and the boxes they were written into severely harmed the final product). In these two cases, it is simply a Japanese company injecting personality into works and you complaining because anime.

I don't really see your conclusion of this argument other than "anime is bad and it should stay out of my games".

You think the Metroid and Kid Icarus creators intended for their games to be turned into chiki centric anime inspired bland stories?  I dont know what you mean by the 2 games lacking in personalty, metroid had plenty of official backstory and plot and so did kid  icarus, and they existed without the need of filling their stories with hallow anime tropes.



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DerpSandwich said:
This is one of the big things keeping me from this game, and just about every other JRPG. I absolutely detest the cutesy "waifu" anime style. More power to the people that dig it, but those generic at best and brain-implodingly-annoying at worst anime tropes found in basically every JRPG pretty much ensure I'll never touch any of them regardless of how great everyone says they are.


I've never agreed so much with someone as this guy here.  Seriously I agree 100 percent with that post, and honestly Awakening is still a good game but the writing and waifus and overall generic anime tone keeps it from being truly great imo.  



3DS I.D : 3282-2755-4646

I make bad threads.  

SSB really went downhill after Melee....

Manlet Crew

ToraTiger said:
sundin13 said:


The point is fairly silly as like I said, they took something hollow and filled it. Kid Icarus was overall lacking personality and they filled it. Metroid's story was generally hollow and they filled it (although the writing and the boxes they were written into severely harmed the final product). In these two cases, it is simply a Japanese company injecting personality into works and you complaining because anime.

I don't really see your conclusion of this argument other than "anime is bad and it should stay out of my games".

You think the Metroid and Kid Icarus creators intended for their games to be turned into chiki centric anime inspired bland stories?  I dont know what you mean by the 2 games lacking in personalty, metroid had plenty of official backstory and plot and so did kid  icarus, and they existed without the need of filling their stories with hallow anime tropes.

First of all, what the hell does chiki mean? The only context I've ever seen that used in is meaning "chicken", but apparently it means "acquaintance", but I highly doubt that is what you mean.

Second, I think once again you are confusing your (seeming) xenophobia for anything of substance. There is nothing wrong with the story of Kid Icarus Uprising. It was entertaing and fun and quite different. It was certainly not adherent to "anime" tropes or pandering to otaku, and like I said, it was more similar in many ways to saturday morning cartoons than anime. Additionally, the story stayed consistently interesting, extremely well written, all of the characters were fun and it all lent itself to an amazing experience. Bland? Bullshit.

Third, have you played the first two Kid Icarus games? They were literally just gameplay with some goofy off the wall humor added on. Remember the Eggplant wizard? I don't think we are missing out on some deep sprawling narrative when the series moved to...well goofy off the wall humor.

As for Metroid, I would argue that none of that games flaws came from anything related to anime. The flaws were largely:
a) overwriting the characters: There was too much writing put into many areas where they should have went with silence or a more subdued tone. This was largely because they focused more on story than previous installments. The story however, was far from a typical anime story and I believe that the characters all stayed away from tropes. They weren't extremely deep and the writing was questionable, but neither of these things have anything to do with your point. Additionally, Samus was based off of the precedent set by previous games. The personality of Samus was already set long before Other M (see Metroid Fusion), and this personality once again has nothing to do with anime.
b) Trying to fill in nonsensical gaps: Many things in the gameplay of metroid just simply don't make sense. The most notable of these is the loss of powers at the begining of every game. The writers wanted to keep this gameplay pillar but write it into the game, which caused problems because no matter how you look at it, this doesn't make sense. The solution the writers came up with was far from elegant, but once again has absolutely nothing to do with anime.

Fourth, the fact that you are pulling Fire Emblem, Kid Icarus and Metroid all under the same umbrella elucidates one of the key problems with your point. These game are all hugely different in style, tone, writing, characterization, etc and yet you decide to refer to them all as "anime" as if that actually made sense. Anime is a medium, not a style or a tone. There is a huge variety of anime, and while your point made some semblance of sense at the beginning when you were just talking about Fire Emblem, the more your broaden it, the more it falls apart.

If you want to criticize moe culture, go ahead, but none of these three franchises demonstrate the qualities inherent to that.

If you want to criticize weak writing or characterization, go ahead, but don't attribute it to any sort of "japanification" or "animification", because you just don't have the strongest argument to make to correlate the two things or even really explain your point of view in any way that doesn't sound intensely xenophobic.



XanderXT said:
Airaku said:

I agree on the art style bit to some extent. Older Japanese art styles looked much more realistic, Zelda is a prime example of this. This is very much the same case for anime today. I had some favorite animes growing up but when I look at anything that came out in the last decade it seems so simplistic to me. Some of it makes me want to take ice cream scoopers and rip my eyes out -_- jk but no seriously! For me, I personally find Fire Emblem's art style very mature by todays standards of anime. A decade ago I may have given a different answer but I would actually argue that Fire Emblem's cut scenes is worlds away better than a lot of animes today. For example animes like Bleach and One Piece are far to simplistic and lack details (and I love the One Piece manga!!!!). This is of course personal tastes but I find that there are much more details and facial expressions than a lot of recent anime styles. although sometimes it can be over used in the games, but I think they do that because the characters are in still frames when they talk their dialogue. On the subject of dialogue, I found that Awakening was great at parts and extremely weak and childish at other parts.

As for the whole characters dying bit, I really can't argue much on that for two reasons. One, in Awakening I play it in classic mode so when someone dies they die! Two, I'm that jackass that literally powers off the system when someone dies regardless of the game I'm playing. Why don't I play casual then? Simply because it isn't as intense and it forces me to not take risks and play strategically as well as double check all my moves. My mistakes are not forgiven and I need to replay the level or at least to my last save point.

Oh you will NOT believe the kinky stuff Tharja does. It is absolutely unreal and you are missing out. Her magic literally amplifies everything and she is always in control, her voodoo bullsh!t is so OP you have no sense of freewill and are forced to complete submission. So technically speaking it's "50 shades of Tharja". Hell she even manifests this OP dark whip!

PS. The proper name for Robin is actually "The Avatar". I have no idea why they didn't use that name for Super Smash Bros. It seems like a silly mistake on their end....

Robin is the default name in Awakening, remember?

Yes that is true but "The Avatar" is the more appropriate name. Robin is just used as an unisex name for the default name in the North American version only. In the same sense you could argue the name is "officially" Reflet or even Daraen. The Avatar has a different unisex name in every region, but is referred to as the Avatar in all regions. It isn't incorrect to refer him/her as Robin, Daraen, or Reflet but The Avatar is more fitting. I kind of wished they went with that name in Super Smash Bros to avoid confusion. The name "The Avatar" might be a little weird and more confusing in some ways. When they revealed the name Robin in the Smash Bros trailer my first reaction was "WTF"?

http://fireemblem.wikia.com/wiki/Avatar_(Awakening)




ToraTiger said:
DerpSandwich said:
This is one of the big things keeping me from this game, and just about every other JRPG. I absolutely detest the cutesy "waifu" anime style. More power to the people that dig it, but those generic at best and brain-implodingly-annoying at worst anime tropes found in basically every JRPG pretty much ensure I'll never touch any of them regardless of how great everyone says they are.


I've never agreed so much with someone as this guy here.  Seriously I agree 100 percent with that post, and honestly Awakening is still a good game but the writing and waifus and overall generic anime tone keeps it from being truly great imo.  

I actually enjoyed the demo quite a lot, but all this we're talking about has kept me from taking the plunge.  If I'm going to invest so much time into a story I want to actually care about it.  Egh....maybe someday if I can get it cheap I'll give it a shot, though it hasn't gone down a cent since its release.



Currently playing:

Bloodbath Paddy Wagon Ultra 9

I don't find this that big of a deal. These things have little influence on whether or not I think the game will be good.