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Forums - Gaming - Why Souls games shouldn't have an easy or normal mode

 

What do you think about the difficulty on the souls games

I like the challenge 61 69.32%
 
i hate it... 27 30.68%
 
Total:88
vivster on 20 February 2015
Anfebious said:
vivster said:
Anfebious said:
 

It doesn't fit the developers vision, what you get in the end is a completely different game. And that isn't fair to gamers.

Wouldn't it be in the developer's vision if they implemented it by themselves?

Do you know how many compromises developers have to make to their game that people don't know about? What if I told you that the game designers plan actually was to make the game literally so difficult that it wasn't technically possible to beat it. But then some stupid producer stepped in and said the game would have to have an ending, so they had to make it much easier. Haven't heard any outcry against making the game so easy that people can reach the end.

This is such a straw man argument. Hiding behind the proposed intentions of the creator when you know nothing about it. I think I perfectly described the real reason behind the outrage in my first post.

They didn't impelement it yet. Not on the King's Field games and not on the Souls game so I just assume it isn't part of their vision. They have been doing these games for years then how come a stupid producer never stopped them before?

I think they get it. These whole games are made with only one purpose on mind. It's to satisfiy our egos, it's to satisfy our short weenies. And I'm perfectly fine with that. I even think my weenie grew bigger after playing those games... just an inch though.

Which is all I wanted to hear. I respect honesty. What irks me is not that DS is a game for the epeen. What irks me is always people pretending it's not and try to protect their penis with ridiculous claims of developer integrity

DS is a great game and I would love it to be more welcoming to newcomers though. Very similar to fighting games and bullet hell(especially touhou). I feel said that I can't enjoy these games because I'm not up to the task even though I love the story and the visuals of these games. I would love these games to have easier modes and since I'm a selfish bastard I wouldn't mind breaking a few e-penises in the process. But at least I admit that.

I don't hate games, I don't hate developers, hell I don't even hate producers and publishers. I just hate the people who pretend things just to protect their penis.



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Spade on 20 February 2015
RCTjunkie said:
Why limit options? Saying a game shouldn't be for someone when it is very easy to program less frequent and lower health enemies in a different completely optional mode is elitist and selfish. Those modes can be just as challenging for newer less skilled players and give the same satisfaction.

This exactly... I will never understand people's thought process of taking away modes for other people when their own challenging mode has ZERO bearing on the other mode. One is not contingent on the other, so options should be in place to create more of an expanded audience. 



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rolltide101x on 20 February 2015
Mnementh said:
I can't even think how an easy mode would work. Some common deaths are falling into a bottomless pit (because in the lighting it was hard to see that the floor was missing or something like that). So how does easy mode work, does a fairy pull me back from falling? you could die in the flames of a dragon spitting fire, if you didn't time your running right. How does easy mode work, the flames are only lukewarm, not hot? And if a trap can't kill you instantly, the point of the game is lost, the point of keeping you always on your toes.

I give a different example. I didn't like the Tomb Raider reboot. Too less gameplay, too much scripted events. At one point I thought you can learn to sneak your away around enemies or kill them silently without alarm. That worked two or three times, then all following fights started scripted, so I couldn't avoid alarm.
So let's say, why can't add Crystal Dynamics a gameplay-mode in the future. Less cutscenes, less scripted events, more exploration, more sneaking, offering different options for decisions (kill the enemy or avoid it or persuade it to change sides for instance) and the option to save important characters like Roth. But as an optional mode, normal mode will still be the same. That will work brilliant, I don't think they have to change the game to accomodate for the existance of the two different modes.

Thank you, you put into better words what I could not explain. There is no way to put in an "easy mode" without changing level design



artur-fernand on 20 February 2015

Some of you are taking this thing of easy mode to extremes. Having difficulty options doesn't necessarily mean change the way the game works, because a game like this WOULD NEVER APPEAL TO CASUALS, even with easy mode. There are people on this very thread who get turned off by the game's difficulty - that's the public the series would gain. Make the player deal more damage and be more resistant to it in easy mode, and reduce the punishment of death (like implementing checkpoints or something). There you go, easy mode.

How is adding a difficulty option "altering the developer's vision" exactly? "Oh, then I'll just be able to go to the options and change the difficulty if I hit a wall". Then make the difficulty a one-time choice than you can never alter unless you start from scratch? "Then I'll just start a new game on easy".

That's on you, it's YOUR CHOICE. If you seriously think that just having the option will make you guys start a game from scratch and then later complain it "Killed the vision of the devs"... well, holy shit.



rolltide101x on 20 February 2015
vivster said:

Which is all I wanted to hear. I respect honesty. What irks me is not that DS is a game for the epeen. What irks me is always people pretending it's not and try to protect their penis with ridiculous claims of developer integrity

DS is a great game and I would love it to be more welcoming to newcomers though. Very similar to fighting games and bullet hell(especially touhou). I feel said that I can't enjoy these games because I'm not up to the task even though I love the story and the visuals of these games. I would love these games to have easier modes and since I'm a selfish bastard I wouldn't mind breaking a few e-penises in the process. But at least I admit that.

I don't hate games, I don't hate developers, hell I don't even hate producers and publishers. I just hate the people who pretend things just to protect their penis.

LOL, you are in some kind of serious denial. Also what story? There is information to be found but nothing I would call a "story"



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Spade on 20 February 2015
VanceIX said:
I hate this argument. Adding an extra difficulty level in no way effect you or anyone else who wants to player on harder difficulties. It just makes the game more accessible.

Case in point: the casual option in Fire Emblem Awakening. Made the series much more friendly for new players, while still offering hard modes for veterans.

Exactly... Hell look what Awakening did for the series overall. It sold very well, exceeded expectations while still having a SEPERATE difficulty for those hardcore. Limiting your audience is something I do not understand. 



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Mnementh on 20 February 2015
vivster said:

Do you know how many compromises developers have to make to their game that people don't know about? What if I told you that the game designers plan actually was to make the game literally so difficult that it wasn't technically possible to beat it. But then some stupid producer stepped in and said the game would have to have an ending, so they had to make it much easier. Haven't heard any outcry against making the game so easy that people can reach the end.

This is such a straw man argument. Hiding behind the proposed intentions of the creator when you know nothing about it. I think I perfectly described the real reason behind the outrage in my first post.

There isn't such a thing. Players always will find a way.

nethack is basically impossible to beat, but many players in reality were able to ascend and often with additional difficulties.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetHack

 



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vivster on 20 February 2015
estebxx said:
vivster said:

So an easy mode will not ruin the game it is implemented in but the next game?

That's such a bogus fear. Why would they even make an easy mode if they are planning to dumb down the hard mode? That doesn't make any sense. No easy mode ever will have any effect on the hard mode. I'm sure Diablo 3 players will confirm that for you.

You don't even have to change integral parts for the game to be easier. Just fiddle a bit with the parameters to make people die less frequently. This is almost no effort to implement and won't even take much time away from development.

So now that we agree that the easy mode will have no effect on any hard modes, what is there that would ruin the game?


Look i understand the point you are trying to make here vivster, and yeah you can make the AI dumber less effective in the easy mode and have it be really HARD on the hard mode and then "everyone" could enjoy it.

but the thing is that such a thing is not the vision that the developer has for this game, neither its the reason why the fans like it so much, we like it because we know that if we hit a wall (a really difficult level or boss fight) there is no way we can just go to options to change the difficulty or start the game again and in easy mode, we know that you just have to get good, and we like that feeling of not having options, just the fact of improving yourself in the game, sure you could argue that you could just ignore the easy mode and then everythings fine, but that is clearly not the vision of the developer either, and knowing that you defended or at least understood the "vision" that Ready at Dawn had with the order, i would expect that you would understand that From Software want this game to be known as the "hard" game, and we "the fans" like this hard game and the challenge that it represents.

also i saw that you (or maybe someone else) said that, such a thing was just a very elitist attitude, and that the fans just want to pretend that they are the "best gamers" out there, and as a fan i must say... i would find that attitude very pathetic... i myself have never said or implied something like that and i hope other fans of the series would never do that, because that would just make us look bad... i just simply like the challenge and the vision that from software has with this games.

Come on! In your very OP you said:
- im sorry to tell you but if you dont enjoy the challenge then this game is clearly not for you, there are tons of other games out there that could fill youre gaming needs.

If that isn't the very definition of being elitist I don't know what is.

I don't see how the vision of the creator has any effect on the gamer since in most cases the intentions aren't that clear for the audience. Would you instantly stop enjoying the game if the creator came out and said that he actually wanted to make the game really easy?

But as I said, an easy mode will not take away the challenge and since that is apparently what you look for in the game I wonder what an easy mode will take away from you or the game.



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method114 on 20 February 2015
mZuzek said:
There's a reason I hated Dark Souls and that's because it was frustrating.

I don't ever want a reason to play it again.


I'm one of the #1 people who complained about games and how easy they are now and days. I always start my games on hard now no matter what.

Dark Souls series are to hard for me. Maybe I suck whatever they are just way to hard for me and way to frustrating. I tried the game on my new PC again quit after the first skeleton that never seemed to die and I had to fight like 4 at the same time.



Anfebious on 20 February 2015
vivster said:
Anfebious said:

They didn't impelement it yet. Not on the King's Field games and not on the Souls game so I just assume it isn't part of their vision. They have been doing these games for years then how come a stupid producer never stopped them before?

I think they get it. These whole games are made with only one purpose on mind. It's to satisfiy our egos, it's to satisfy our short weenies. And I'm perfectly fine with that. I even think my weenie grew bigger after playing those games... just an inch though.

Which is all I wanted to hear. I respect honesty. What irks me is not that DS is a game for the epeen. What irks me is always people pretending it's not and try to protect their penis with ridiculous claims of developer integrity

DS is a great game and I would love it to be more welcoming to newcomers though. Very similar to fighting games and bullet hell(especially touhou). I feel said that I can't enjoy these games because I'm not up to the task even though I love the story and the visuals of these games. I would love these games to have easier modes and since I'm a selfish bastard I wouldn't mind breaking a few e-penises in the process. But at least I admit that.

I don't hate games, I don't hate developers, hell I don't even hate producers and publishers. I just hate the people who pretend things just to protect their penis.

I also suck at touhou! But I found that listening to the music is far more enjoyable than trying to play them.

Hey, the penis is a very important part of a man. I also feel like protecting it sometimes but I'm Argentinian and we are known worldwide for having the biggest penis so I don't get offended that easily.



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