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Forums - Sales Discussion - August 2014 NPD Thread! PS4 - 190k, XBO - 160k, Wii U < 60k, PSV < 6k

fatslob-:O said:
Zanten said:

Now who's being silly? In the case of the Xbox One, that weaknesses is far more pronounced in the wider markets, the U.S isn't quite as lopsided. The gap between them, this month in particular, isn't so large that they 'aren't competition,' not by a long shot, and it combined with the Wii U actually take more than half of the total current gen console sales this month. (Again, in the U.S.) you are literally claiming that without those two consoles, that extra 230k sales would, what, vanish into the ether? That not even a quarter of those who bought an Xbox One or a Wii U this month would, with no Wii U or Xbox One to choose, opt for a PS4 rather than buying nothing at all? Care to explain why?

The claim that having two competitors make the PS4's situation no different then the PS2's when it had, literally, zero equivalent generation competition that summer, is ridiculous and just lazy thinking.

Yes the Xbox One isn't quite just quite as weak in the US but but does that matter that much since there were some cases where the PS4 nearly doubled/doubled on the Xbox One in some months ? 

Why would Nintendo gamers be interested in a PS4 ? It's clear that almost none of them are interested in a lot of Sony's first party games nor are they interested in third party games so it's most likely that they would just quit gaming altogether. 

With the xbox one it isn't clear what things will happen. If they do continue making games they'll be releasing them on PC from now on which would mean that Halo as well as other Microsoft titles will be released on there. If that happens a fair portion of xbox gamers will be migrating to PC or will be returning to PC gaming because of this. There's also small portion of Xbox gamers who are also disinterested with a lot of playstation exclusives so I can see them also going to PC rather than continuing their habits on playstation plus I also happen to share their sentiment about PS exclusives too. 

Causation does not imply correlation. Not everyone will opt out to buy the PS4 if nothing else exists. 


This is a sweeping judgement that is largely based on an Internet stereotype. Poor third-party sales on NIntendo consoles does not imply that Nintendo fans do not and would not want games not made by NIntendo if the Wii U did not exist. Their preference for NIntendo games does not imply a dislike for all others, even if some might seem like that. Many NIntendo fans have a secondary preference for another console (and buy ither games there) and/or like NIntendo-like games not made by Nintendo (i.e. Rayman, Kingdom Hearts...). I personally like JRPGs and some Sony exclusives, which I for the most part can't get on the Wii U.

Your conclusion that most NIntendo gamers would quit gaming without NIntendo is actually quite ridiculous. This might be the case for some, but you make it seem as if the demand for interactive entertainment would largely disappear into a void. What is to say that those who don't already wouldn't just develop an interest to NIntendo-like ganes on other platforms?  Furthermore, you seem to imply the assumption that NIntendo's non-existence would not cause another company (lkely a Japanese one) to fill that void with similar games,

 It certainly is not "clear"; that's just your opinion.

Aside, you seem to have this belief (that a lot of PC gamers have) that consoles mostly only exist for exclusives and that, without them, consoles would die quickly and everyone would migrate to PC/mobile or quit gameing entirely. That a brand is almost worthless without its exclusives (no matter how much it associates itself with third-party games). That people don't really value a budget properitary console built specifically for gaming, and that every would readily accept and embrace the PC environment if only we just got rid of consoles. Do you really think that the general consumer sits there deliberating intensively over which consoles have which exclusives, "objective" cost-to-value ratios, mulling over specs and genres, and so forth? Or do simply look and choose what is popular convenient, affordable, and looks fun? Gaming devices have different properties which influence how they appeal to different people. That goes beyond the simple "numbers games".



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I have updated the OP with all info!



Those Wii U numbers always brighten up my day. Good laugh.



Boutros said:
I have updated the OP with all info!

It's really weird that the VGC numbers aren't there, but regardless, great job.



Scizor_99 said:

This is a sweeping judgement that is largely based on an Internet stereotype. Poor third-party sales on NIntendo consoles does not imply that Nintendo fans do not and would not want games not made by NIntendo if the Wii U did not exist. Their preference for NIntendo games does not imply a dislike for all others, even if some might seem like that. Many NIntendo fans have a secondary preference for another console (and buy ither games there) and/or like NIntendo-like games not made by Nintendo (i.e. Rayman, Kingdom Hearts...). I personally like JRPGs and some Sony exclusives, which I for the most part can't get on the Wii U.

Your conclusion that most NIntendo gamers would quit gaming without NIntendo is actually quite ridiculous. This might be the case for some, but you make it seem as if the demand for interactive entertainment would largely disappear into a void. What is to say that those who don't already wouldn't just develop an interest to NIntendo-like ganes on other platforms?  Furthermore, you seem to imply the assumption that NIntendo's non-existence would not cause another company (lkely a Japanese one) to fill that void with similar games,

 It certainly is not "clear"; that's just your opinion.

Aside, you seem to have this belief (that a lot of PC gamers have) that consoles mostly only exist for exclusives and that, without them, consoles would die quickly and everyone would migrate to PC/mobile or quit gameing entirely. That a brand is almost worthless without its exclusives (no matter how much it associates itself with third-party games). That people don't really value a budget properitary console built specifically for gaming, and that every would readily accept and embrace the PC environment if only we just got rid of consoles. Do you really think that the general consumer sits there deliberating intensively over which consoles have which exclusives, "objective" cost-to-value ratios, mulling over specs and genres, and so forth? Or do simply look and choose what is popular convenient, affordable, and looks fun? Gaming devices have different properties which influence how they appeal to different people. That goes beyond the simple "numbers games".

Gee, I guess stereotypes aren't based on data then ... /sarcasm 

Most customers AREN'T multiconsole owners so Nintendo gamers having little to no interests playing games on other consoles is the actual case. Why don't you bring some evidence instead of trying to work around my argument with an anecdote ? 

FYI there's no other company like Nintendo that can be replaced and not a damn company will be able to fill the void either because Nintendo content have their own identity compared to the lifeless clones out there. 

Are you implying that I'm a PC gamer ? FWIW I wasn't hiding that fact. If I truly valued that belief of consoles only existing for exclusives then I obviously wouldn't be condemning the WII U so much but that's not the case apparently. What did all of that have to do with the original point ? 



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fatslob-:O said:

Gee, I guess stereotypes aren't based on data then ... /sarcasm 

Most customers AREN'T multiconsole owners so Nintendo gamers having little to no interests playing games on other consoles is the actual case. Why don't you bring some evidence instead of trying to work around my argument with an anecdote ? 

FYI there's no other company like Nintendo that can be replaced and not a damn company will be able to fill the void either because Nintendo content have their own identity compared to the lifeless clones out there. 

Are you implying that I'm a PC gamer ? FWIW I wasn't hiding that fact. If I truly valued that belief of consoles only existing for exclusives then I obviously wouldn't be condemning the WII U so much but that's not the case apparently. What did all of that have to do with the original point ? 

Because anecdotes can serve as evidence. I was a Nintendo gamer first long before I began playing Playstation and still a big Nintendo fan today. However, I still have interest on playing games on other consoles, not just Playstation.

Also, your claim that most customers aren't multiconsole owners is vastly unproven and largely fabricated to fit your argument that Nintendo gamers have little to no interests playing games on other consoles. Heck, your original argument is no longer recognizable because you're trying too hard looking for a reason to validate your argument.

This is no longer up for debate. The majority of people disagree with you and Zanten, Scizor, Maciveli, michael_stutzer, I, and others have said our share of the deal. Remember this. Just because you're not impressed with the PS4's summer sales doesn't mean that they are, for a fact, unimpressive. We didn't particularly have a problem with your opinion (except for FlamingWeasel), but you were waving it around as if it's a fact.



Aura7541 said:

Because anecdotes can serve as evidence. I was a Nintendo gamer first long before I began playing Playstation and still a big Nintendo fan today. However, I still have interest on playing games on other consoles, not just Playstation.

Also, your claim that most customers aren't multiconsole owners is vastly unproven and largely fabricated to fit your argument that Nintendo gamers have little to no interests playing games on other consoles. Heck, your original argument is no longer recognizable because you're trying too hard looking for a reason to validate your argument.

This is no longer up for debate. The majority of people disagree with you and Zanten, Scizor, Maciveli, michael_stutzer, I, and others have said our share of the deal. Remember this. Just because you're not impressed with the PS4's summer sales doesn't mean that they are, for a fact, unimpressive. We didn't particularly have a problem with your opinion (except for FlamingWeasel), but you were waving it around as if it's a fact.

That's weak ... 

Most gamers actually aren't multiconsole owners for each genertaion ... http://www.theesa.com/facts/pdfs/esa_ef_2013.pdf

Out of the entire gaming industry's lifetime a US household that does have a dedicated gaming console is 2 on average. It's a FACT that most gamers do NOT own multiple consoles per generation ... Much less buys a console every generation. This case is even more evident outside of the US. If your basing your rebuttal on the internet's reception then you know you've already failed. Where's YOUR claim that a lot of gamers do own multiple consoles in the same generation ? 

You've just contradicted yourself ... You say for a fact that it's unimpressive then go on to say it's an opinion. LOL 

Is this pitying for FlamingWeazel I see here ? Y'know what if your not going to actually argue my point then I may as well just leave this thread cause it's a FACT that the PS4 is average compared to the PS2 or the WII.



fatslob-:O said:
Aura7541 said:

Because anecdotes can serve as evidence. I was a Nintendo gamer first long before I began playing Playstation and still a big Nintendo fan today. However, I still have interest on playing games on other consoles, not just Playstation.

Also, your claim that most customers aren't multiconsole owners is vastly unproven and largely fabricated to fit your argument that Nintendo gamers have little to no interests playing games on other consoles. Heck, your original argument is no longer recognizable because you're trying too hard looking for a reason to validate your argument.

This is no longer up for debate. The majority of people disagree with you and Zanten, Scizor, Maciveli, michael_stutzer, I, and others have said our share of the deal. Remember this. Just because you're not impressed with the PS4's summer sales doesn't mean that they are, for a fact, unimpressive. We didn't particularly have a problem with your opinion (except for FlamingWeasel), but you were waving it around as if it's a fact.

That's weak ... 

Most gamers actually aren't multiconsole owners for each genertaion ... http://www.theesa.com/facts/pdfs/esa_ef_2013.pdf

Out of the entire gaming industry's lifetime a US household that does have a dedicated gaming console is 2 on average. It's a FACT that most gamers do NOT own multiple consoles per generation ... Much less buys a console every generation. This case is even more evident outside of the US. If your basing your rebuttal on the internet's reception then you know you've already failed. Where's YOUR claim that a lot of gamers do own multiple consoles in the same generation ? 

You've just contradicted yourself ... You say for a fact that it's unimpressive then go on to say it's an opinion. LOL 

Is this pitying for FlamingWeazel I see here ? Y'know what if your not going to actually argue my point then I may as well just leave this thread cause it's a FACT that the PS4 is average compared to the PS2 or the WII.

That's not weak. The fact that I'm a Nintendo gamer who also plays games on other platforms shot down your argument. To counter with a "that's weak..." is merely an expression of your dislike of how your argument got shot down. And I'm not the only one, too. A friend of mine, for instance, plays the Wii U as his main, but also plays Xbox. Nintendo gamers not being interested in games of other platforms is a huge myth.

Where's your claim that not a lot (you didn't say most. You said a lot) of gamers do own multiple consoles in the same generation? Multiconsole owners are the minority, but does that necessarily make them negligable? You just shot your own foot when your mouth accidentally slipped out "a lot".

So no, you've just contradicted yourself, not I. It's you that is presenting your opinions as facts, not me. The fact that you have gone extreme lengths to justify your opinion says it all. What's even worse is that after I pointed out that your argument has become unrecognizable, you have failed to straighten yourself up. I have already emphasized that I and many others don't have problems with your opinion. We had the problem with how you presented your opinion. Why are you so belligerent? For two days straight, too... o.O

And how am I pitying FlamingWeasel? Let's reread this sentence of my previous post: We didn't particularly have a problem with your opinion (except for FlamingWeasel). Now tell me where am I actually pitying him. Exactly. Nowhere! I was actually criticizing him for being too belligerent, but apparently, that flew over your head because you are also being way too bellicose. Why you're trying to associate me with FW is beyond me, but it's beyond petty and it's not helping your case.



Aura7541 said:

Where's your claim that not a lot (you didn't say most. You said a lot) of gamers do own multiple consoles in the same generation? Multiconsole owners are the minority, but does that necessarily make them negligable? You just shot your own foot when your mouth accidentally slipped out "a lot".

So no, you've just contradicted yourself, not I. It's you that is presenting your opinions as facts, not me. The fact that you have gone extreme lengths to justify your opinion says it all. What's even worse is that after I pointed out that your argument has become unrecognizable, you have failed to straighten yourself up. I have already emphasized that I and many others don't have problems with your opinion. We had the problem with how you presented your opinion. Why are you so belligerent? For two days straight, too... o.O

And how am I pitying FlamingWeasel? Let's reread this sentence of my previous post: We didn't particularly have a problem with your opinion (except for FlamingWeasel). Now tell me where am I actually pitying him. Exactly. Nowhere! I was actually criticizing him for being too belligerent, but apparently, that flew over your head because you are also being way too bellicose.

Your reading too much into my post ... 

My point was that multiconsole owners aren't the majority. It's as simple as that so go deal with it. This whole farce just further proves that Nintendo gamers aren't mostly interested in other platforms. 



fatslob-:O said:
Aura7541 said:

Where's your claim that not a lot (you didn't say most. You said a lot) of gamers do own multiple consoles in the same generation? Multiconsole owners are the minority, but does that necessarily make them negligable? You just shot your own foot when your mouth accidentally slipped out "a lot".

So no, you've just contradicted yourself, not I. It's you that is presenting your opinions as facts, not me. The fact that you have gone extreme lengths to justify your opinion says it all. What's even worse is that after I pointed out that your argument has become unrecognizable, you have failed to straighten yourself up. I have already emphasized that I and many others don't have problems with your opinion. We had the problem with how you presented your opinion. Why are you so belligerent? For two days straight, too... o.O

And how am I pitying FlamingWeasel? Let's reread this sentence of my previous post: We didn't particularly have a problem with your opinion (except for FlamingWeasel). Now tell me where am I actually pitying him. Exactly. Nowhere! I was actually criticizing him for being too belligerent, but apparently, that flew over your head because you are also being way too bellicose.

Your reading too much into my post ... 

My point was that multiconsole owners aren't the majority. It's as simple as that so go deal with it. This whole farce just further proves that Nintendo gamers aren't mostly interested in other platforms. 

I'm not. In actuality, you are not reading carefully enough. You inadvertently contradicted yourself in a very entertaining fashion and now telling me to deal with it when I already did. The bolded is wrong, too. That's your opinion, not a fact. The only fact this that multiconsole owners aren't the majority. However, I'm a Nintendo gamer that is interested in other platforms and there are many others who are, too. Minority =/= Negligable