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Forums - Nintendo - Positive Impacts From a Unified/Fusion Nintendo Platform

phaedruss said:
DélioPT said:

He kinda did. From a post in another page: "What we mean by integrating platforms is not integrating handhelds devices and home consoles to make only one machine."

This basically shows that the intent for next generation is not to eliminate one form factor but to make it work together.

I said nothing on console power. But now that you mention it, i don`t think next generation Nintendo will go MS or Sony`s way of cutting edge graphics. They did that with N64 and it didn`t work for them. GC was more powerful than the PS2 and it still sold badly. It`s always about the games - and perception!

You are right about Splatoon. The userbase of Wii U will hinder the game`s sales. Taht`s why i said it was important to make one game that works on 2 platforms: with the increase of the userbase, the more it can sell, thus reducing the risks of commercial failure.

"I think more likely we are looking more at something like the iPad-iPhone model where you can get the same games and apps for both systems and generally they're similar in performance except maybe the iPad version runs at a higher resolution or something. "

This is basically what i said. One game working on 2 platforms is the ideal solution to Nintendo`s problems.


I don't think the issue with the N64 was with how powerful it was. Like you said it's about the games and having this unified OS with the console being at a higher resolution and better graphics overall but the same games across both platforms will help with that a lot.


Yeah, N64 was a powerful console, but Nintendo`s way of doing business was what kept developers out of the console.

To me, doing what devs already do on PCs (scalable power) is the best way to sell Nintendo consoles next gen.
If Sony releases another handheld they will probably follow the same route.



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Soundwave said:
phaedruss said:
I'm not sure where you're getting this "dock" thing from. Wouldn't it just be a home console?


My personal bet here is that Nintendo will use mobile chips next time out (like the iPhone/iPad/Samsung Galaxy/even the Vita) so the "console" may not be what people think in terms of a traditional console. What they'll do I suspect is just scale the chip and in terms of hardware cores for portable or a home device. 

It could be a dock, it could be the chip self contained in itself (not requiring the portable at all), but I suspect it will be very different from what people think of as a "console" (think Vita TV or Apple TV sized). 


I don't think so. It might not be a huge leap over the Wii U, but an apple TV type thing would get slaughtered.



DélioPT said:
phaedruss said:


I don't think the issue with the N64 was with how powerful it was. Like you said it's about the games and having this unified OS with the console being at a higher resolution and better graphics overall but the same games across both platforms will help with that a lot.


Yeah, N64 was a powerful console, but Nintendo`s way of doing business was what kept developers out of the console.

To me, doing what devs already do on PCs (scalable power) is the best way to sell Nintendo consoles next gen.
If Sony releases another handheld they will probably follow the same route.


Yep, exactly what I'm thinking. That's how this whole unified OS/architecture is going to play out I think.



phaedruss said:
Soundwave said:
phaedruss said:
I'm not sure where you're getting this "dock" thing from. Wouldn't it just be a home console?


My personal bet here is that Nintendo will use mobile chips next time out (like the iPhone/iPad/Samsung Galaxy/even the Vita) so the "console" may not be what people think in terms of a traditional console. What they'll do I suspect is just scale the chip and in terms of hardware cores for portable or a home device. 

It could be a dock, it could be the chip self contained in itself (not requiring the portable at all), but I suspect it will be very different from what people think of as a "console" (think Vita TV or Apple TV sized). 


I don't think so. It might not be a huge leap over the Wii U, but an apple TV type thing would get slaughtered.


That's kind of the beauty of a software ecosystem based setup versus the traditional hardware model Nintendo has used in the past though. 

iPod Touch doesn't sell *that* great anymore, but does Apple care? F*ck no, they'll get you with an iPhone or an iPad. Whatever you choose. Some people buy 2, even 3, some people just need 1. But they all end up buying from the Apple store once they buy into the ecosystem. However many iPod touch's that Apple sells is really just icing on the cake, it's a nice bonus for them. 

So it doesn't really matter to Nintendo if the console variant isn't your cup of tea, maybe you buy the tablet version or the smaller handheld version. 

In the past though if you didn't like the console or didn't think it was worth it to buy just the console, Nintendo was basically screwed because they had no way to sell you the new Mario at all, that's the downside of having a brilliant game like Mario 3D World tied down to a niche platform that almost no one has. 

It will probably be quite liberating for Nintendo too, they can stop that juggling act of "oh sh*t! our handheld is not selling well enough! Quick! Make more games for it! Oh sh*t now our console isn't selling well, make more games there!". It must be exhausting. Now they can just say "you know, what, you're the consumer, you choose the form factor(s) you want, we'll just focus making the best possible singular game library". 



phaedruss said:
DélioPT said:


Yeah, N64 was a powerful console, but Nintendo`s way of doing business was what kept developers out of the console.

To me, doing what devs already do on PCs (scalable power) is the best way to sell Nintendo consoles next gen.
If Sony releases another handheld they will probably follow the same route.


Yep, exactly what I'm thinking. That's how this whole unified OS/architecture is going to play out I think.

I sure hope so.
With more people being needed for a big game, with more copies needed to be sold to make a profit and with basically no 3rd party support, i don`t think Nintendo has a better solution than really support their consoles 100%. Which they will be able to do if they go this route.

Crossing my fingers! :D



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Soundwave said:
 


That's kind of the beauty of a software ecosystem based setup versus the traditional hardware model Nintendo has used in the past though. 

iPod Touch doesn't sell *that* great anymore, but does Apple care? F*ck no, they'll get you with an iPhone or an iPad. Whatever you choose. Some people buy 2, even 3, some people just need 1. But they all end up buying from the Apple store once they buy into the ecosystem. However many iPod touch's that Apple sells is really just icing on the cake, it's a nice bonus for them. 

So it doesn't really matter to Nintendo if the console variant isn't your cup of tea, maybe you buy the tablet version or the smaller handheld version. 

In the past though if you didn't like the console or didn't think it was worth it to buy just the console, Nintendo was basically screwed because they had no way to sell you the new Mario at all, that's the downside of having a brilliant game like Mario 3D World tied down to a niche platform that almost no one has. 

It will probably be quite liberating for Nintendo too, they can stop that juggling act of "oh sh*t! our handheld is not selling well enough! Quick! Make more games for it! Oh sh*t now our console isn't selling well, make more games there!". It must be exhausting. Now they can just say "you know, what, you're the consumer, you choose the form factor(s) you want, we'll just focus making the best possible singular game library". 


Personally I won't buy a shitty set top box, a tablet, or a handheld, but I will buy a reasonably powered Nintendo console IF Nintendo goes this route with having all their games on all their platforms. If you're thinking the "dock" will be like the Ouya or something, I think that's a terrible idea.



phaedruss said:
Soundwave said:
 


That's kind of the beauty of a software ecosystem based setup versus the traditional hardware model Nintendo has used in the past though. 

iPod Touch doesn't sell *that* great anymore, but does Apple care? F*ck no, they'll get you with an iPhone or an iPad. Whatever you choose. Some people buy 2, even 3, some people just need 1. But they all end up buying from the Apple store once they buy into the ecosystem. However many iPod touch's that Apple sells is really just icing on the cake, it's a nice bonus for them. 

So it doesn't really matter to Nintendo if the console variant isn't your cup of tea, maybe you buy the tablet version or the smaller handheld version. 

In the past though if you didn't like the console or didn't think it was worth it to buy just the console, Nintendo was basically screwed because they had no way to sell you the new Mario at all, that's the downside of having a brilliant game like Mario 3D World tied down to a niche platform that almost no one has. 

It will probably be quite liberating for Nintendo too, they can stop that juggling act of "oh sh*t! our handheld is not selling well enough! Quick! Make more games for it! Oh sh*t now our console isn't selling well, make more games there!". It must be exhausting. Now they can just say "you know, what, you're the consumer, you choose the form factor(s) you want, we'll just focus making the best possible singular game library". 


Personally I won't buy a shitty set top box, a tablet, or a handheld, but I will buy a reasonably powered Nintendo console IF Nintendo goes this route with having all their games on all their platforms. If you're thinking the "dock" will be like the Ouya or something, I think that's a terrible idea.


What's "reasonably" powered? I think something that can run Wii U type graphics in 1080P with anti-aliasing and maybe some extra effects with 4GB of RAM is "reasonable". You can make a handheld variant from that which runs games at say 540P w/o the AA but they both can then run the same games without a ton of fuss. 

Getting into the graphics pissing match just is a lose lose for Nintendo. If they bring out something like the PS4 in 2017 or something, then people will laugh at it and say "why should I buy this, I already have a PS4?", just like the Wii U having PS3/360 level visuals/slight better is not helping them this gen. And it does nothing but make the games more expensive to create, just watch many more developers will be going bankrupt in the next 3-4 years because of the PS4/X1.

You may like that, but you're not the one on the hook for laying off 500 people when game X doesn't sell 5 million copies to cover its budget either. 

Better to just get out of that pissing match and focus on a more seamless experience between the home and portable versions and price it cheaply. It's much easier to get someone to buy a $169.99 "microconsole" say, than a $300 machine that has direct competetion from 2 other companies making the exact same (or better) product. What Nintendo should focus on is leveraging their entire back catalog of games (which is enormous) too from day 1 ... a software ecosystem that can play NES, SNES, N64, GCN, Wii, Wii U, Game Boy, GBA, DS, and 3DS titles would be worth it to a lot of people even without new games. 



Soundwave said:


What's "reasonably" powered? I think something that can run Wii U type graphics in 1080P with anti-aliasing and maybe some extra effects with 4GB of RAM is "reasonable". You can make a handheld variant from that which runs games at say 540P w/o the AA but they both can then run the same games without a ton of fuss. 

Oh well..we don't have a problem then. You made it seem like you were talking about an Ouya type thing or something. THAT would be perfectly fine though, especially if they can keep the OS slim, like 1/2 GB of RAM or less ( I think that's plenty for a console OS) that would be really great.



phaedruss said:
Soundwave said:


What's "reasonably" powered? I think something that can run Wii U type graphics in 1080P with anti-aliasing and maybe some extra effects with 4GB of RAM is "reasonable". You can make a handheld variant from that which runs games at say 540P w/o the AA but they both can then run the same games without a ton of fuss. 

Oh well..we don't have a problem then. You made it seem like you were talking about an Ouya type thing or something. THAT would be perfectly fine though.


Mobile chips are surprisingly powerful these days. A home variant freed of battery life restrictions (since it would plug into the wall) could probably meet my described performance level. 

It would also save Nintendo a ton of money in hardware R&D if they could basically use the same cheap mobile chips for 2, even 3 or 4 different "variants", just scale them up and down in terms of CPU/GPU cores and RAM. 



Soundwave said:
phaedruss said:
Soundwave said:


What's "reasonably" powered? I think something that can run Wii U type graphics in 1080P with anti-aliasing and maybe some extra effects with 4GB of RAM is "reasonable". You can make a handheld variant from that which runs games at say 540P w/o the AA but they both can then run the same games without a ton of fuss. 

Oh well..we don't have a problem then. You made it seem like you were talking about an Ouya type thing or something. THAT would be perfectly fine though.


Mobile chips are surprisingly powerful these days. A home variant freed of battery life restrictions (since it would plug into the wall) could probably meet my described performance level. 

It would also save Nintendo a ton of money in hardware R&D if they could basically use the same cheap mobile chips for 2, even 3 or 4 different "variants", just scale them up and down in terms of CPU/GPU cores and RAM. 


I guess we're all on the same page then. Are you thinking qualcomm or I think people have been talking about ARM, but I'm not sure those would be powerful enough in a few years.