I'm not denying they are different, I'm just pointing out the reason why ms isn't really that concerned with the backlash they are receiving (which they deserve).  They know the data and they know that whether you like it or not you are a vocal minority and a silent majority is what they are after. 

I'm sure the ps4 is going to sell better than the xb1, they got some good pr and the right price point, but don't kid yourself about where both companies are eventually headed.

Whereas by the time I can demonstrate I am right, I will likely have forgotten this conversation

Yes, it is very likely the same happens for me. I havea  short term memory....I do however, remember you from my early 2008 days. :/

Don't be like that mate, it's a good thread! MS are in a different league then most when it comes to cloud computing but that is for another thread at another time.

Neither have been independently tested, and one is allegedly capable of calling in an Antonov to help it fly ahead of it's competitor.

LOL!! I would have thought more like this guy...

I apologize

Yeah.  I just about clocked off for a couple of years there.

Fell out of gaming in a big way as I transitioned out of uni and into full time work/becoming a real grown up.

Now that I have that balance back (to an extent) I am trying to get back into gaming properly.

The old imposition on gaming used to be money.  Now I can afford all the consoles but lack the time to play them all

That just sold me a PS4 :D

I greatly enjoyed this!

Anybody can have the Steammodel on the PS4 aswell. You can just buy the digital copy if you want the advantages of digital. And since all games come digital aswell. You can choose between traditional disc based games or go the XBox1/Steam way and just download your copy without having the need for a disc and with the ability to download it to any PS4 since the copy is tied to the account. Also you can give away 2 copies with PSN afair.

MS has no excuse NOT to offer choice. Its bullshit that this system has advantages that cant be realised without forcing the customer too. Instead of offering options rather force everything down the customers throat. Thats the problem with MS.

he says its like steam, but with steam once i choose offline play its pretty much indefinite if i want it to be, i was offline with steam on a laptop for 4 months at one point. all the time enjoying empire total war. with the XB1 thats not the case, but my bigger worry is long term. MS killed live for the original XB what happens when live is killed for the XB1? you have have a brick. i can still play original XB games as they require no network connection. and as for steam i can always find hacks/mods.

I would have less of an issue if they had just gone all digital and lowered the cost, but with a disc i expect to be able to play it without internet even if it costs more